[60sstuff]

The “Paint Code” on 64-65 Tempest Series Fremont data plates use the letter “A” to signify Black painted wheels.

This third letter (wheel color) would be after the lower and upper color codes.

It seems this particular coding stopped in very late 65, and wasn’t used in 66-67 years.

CT.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Would there be an instance where a 64 came with anything other than a black rim ?
(poverty caps and hubcaps the only options)
I have pictures of cowl tags for Red, Silver, Skyline Blue cars - all with the A

What would code be on a 65 with Rally Ones (silver) ?

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Have a 65 example coded LL L
Had no wheel or hubcap option (poverty cap car)

[60sstuff]

Originally Posted by Baron Von Zeppelin

Have a 65 example coded LL L
Had no wheel or hubcap option (poverty cap car)

That LL L looks like Teal Turquoise lower and upper body color with the Teal wheels and poverty caps.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

All those i listed were Fremont examples.
The 64's (Red, Silver, Skyline) i guess are inconclusive whether they would have had poverty caps, or optional hubcaps. With Code A

So, i guess a 65 Fremont without a 3rd digit would be a Rally One car.
Thats neat to know.
... too bad i don't live in california to start checking up on all the car show cars with R1 wheels on them. lol

[John V.]

Baron, my recollection is that a "-" (dash or dashes) was coded on the '65 Data Plate when Rally Wheels were ordered. Not 100% confident of that and not sure if that applied to Fremont. But there is no letter code associated with them.

I have not researched the '64 Wheel Color usage other than the fact that all builds with a Wheel Cover option (Deluxe, Custom, or late year Wire Discs) got Code A Black Wheels.

Code A Black Wheels were also used for all other exterior color builds without a wheel cover option (including all Special Paint Color builds) with some exceptions.

I have assumed the only exceptions were for the 5 exterior colors for which wheel colors were offered.

The Wheel Color was coded with the same letter as the exterior color.

Yorktown Blue Wheels coded F
Pinehurst Green Wheels coded J
Singapore Gold Wheels coded T
Gulfstream Aqua Wheels coded Q
Saddle Wheels coded S

If that '65 Reef Turquoise GTO (Code K) Paint with Teal Turquoise (Code L) Wheels is a factory combination, it could be that some '64 Paint colors were complemented by a Wheel color that was not identical to the body color.

I don't think I've ever documented such a combination, but I haven't documented very many '64s without a full wheel cover option.

Possible '64 combinations might be:

Skyline Blue with Yorktown Blue Wheels
Aquamarine with Gulfstream Aqua Wheels
Alamo Beige with Saddle Wheels

Would love to know if anybody has documented any such '64 combinations.

The '65 Wheel Colors other than Code A Black were:

Fontaine Blue Wheels coded D
Teal Turquoise Wheels coded L
Capri Gold Wheels coded T

Perhaps a '65 aficionado here might know what other Paint colors each of these wheel colors were combined with for builds without a Wheel Cover option.

I always thought it was interesting that PMD cut back on the number of Wheel Colors in '65 excluding Black, 5 in '63 and '64 but only 3 in '65 and '66.

Baron, good point about the no code being '65 Rally Wheel builds but note that Chris states that the Wheel Code my have been left off the late '65 Fremont Data Plates.

I assume the '65 Billing History Cards always listed the Wheel Color unless the Rally Wheels were optioned, full year.

Another related thing, I think when a Two Tone combination was ordered, the Lower Body Paint Color would have dictated the Wheel Color. Again, such a rare thing, not sure documented examples exist but if somebody knows of one, would love to know about it.

[John V.]

Good stuff! But here's what I've uncovered quickly from some hard copy records.

FFE KC built GTO Hardtop. Late March built (C27). Code FY Whitewalls and no Wheel Covers. That fits my hypothesis.

But an S1A Balt built GTO Convertible doesn't fit. Code FY Whitewalls and no apparent Wheel Covers. Box 48 shows code 4 which my decode research concluded was for the Spare Tire Cover alone. Dec build so too early for the Wires option. Saddle Bronze with Saddle Wheels would have been expected but shows Black Wheels instead.

It was "built" about a day earlier (L9) than the one Baron posted (L10), and about 1000 VIN units earlier. Balt normally built about 100-200 Pontiac A bodies each day so the date code which relates to the "Broadcast Date" probably doesn't tell us much about the Final Assembly date. One curious thing from the PHS, Balt sometimes coded the Broadcast Date with a funky letter coding (see the PHS Baron posted). But also used the standard numeric code both before and after the one Baron posted so no apparent cutoff switch from one to the other format. The L9 build shows standard numeric coding.

An SSS Balt built GTO Hardtop does fit. Code FY Whitewalls and no Wheel Covers. Saddle Bronze with Saddle Wheels. Built in January (A24).

If anybody has KC and Balt records to check, note that the GTO Whitewalls were code FY early year and changed to Code FZ later. Red Lines were Code FR all year.

Could be Baltimore didn't stock the non-black wheels prior to mid year since both Balt exceptions are from Dec. Or could have something to do with them being Convertibles since both Balt exceptions are Convertibles.

I still like my Red Lines hypothesis but not enough records to study. If anybody has a '64 PHS showing the Red Lines with non-Black Wheels, would be interested to know about it with Plant and Time Built identified.

It is possible that my KC/Balt decode is wrong for Code 484 as the Spare Tire Cover. I am confident that 481 is the Deluxe Wheel Covers and 482 is the Custom Wheel Covers. Only other codes I have seen on the KC and Balt records for Box 48 is 484 and 485. I find it just a little odd that I have found 484 and 485 commonly which I deduced as the Spare Tire Cover alone and the Deluxe Wheel Covers with Spare Tire Cover combination respectively. But odd that I don't think I've ever seen 486 which I would have interpreted as the Custom Wheel Covers with Spare Tire Cover combination. I did have pretty solid documentation on a build that had the Deluxe Wheel Covers with Spare Tire Cover combination for the code 485. But I assumed Chevy used the same additive coding that PMD was using to deduce the Code 484 was the Spare Tire Cover alone. Made logical sense to me but the lack of any 486 coded KC/Balt docs leaves open that I have misinterpreted Code 484 and would perhaps remove the exception for the S1A build I listed above.

[60sstuff]

Originally Posted by Baron Von Zeppelin

Would there be an instance where a 64 came with anything other than a black rim ?
(poverty caps and hubcaps the only options)
I have pictures of cowl tags for Red, Silver, Skyline Blue cars - all with the A

What would code be on a 65 with Rally Ones (silver) ?

This pertains only to the BF - Fremont built ‘64 and ‘65 Data plate third letter.

1964 only had the 14x6 steel wheel.

There were several colors available for the wheels with Standard hub cap for a specific body color only.
This letter code would be stamped in the data plate after the lower and upper paint codes.

First pic shows what was available in ‘64.

Second pic is the ‘65 offerings. No code for the Rally I wheels.

Last pic shows a ‘65 Reef Turquoise with Teal Turquoise rims and poverty caps.

CT

[jeff chmura]

I have a fremont '65 the came with poverty caps black wheels.....off the top of me head, I don't remember seeing a code for wheel paint.
Original Iris mist car. So PP code
Can post cowl tag and PHS if needed
Jeff

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Originally Posted by jeff chmura

I have a fremont '65 the came with poverty caps black wheels.....off the top of me head, I don't remember seeing a code for wheel paint.
Original Iris mist car. So PP code
Can post cowl tag and PHS if needed
Jeff

Sure Jeff, everything helps on these studies.
Possibly - maybe yours is a late build from after they stopped notating the wheel color codes.

Too bad Iris Mist wasn't used as a wheel color - that would look good together.
I wonder if the reduced selection of wheel colors in 65 was an exercise to prompt more people into ordering hubcaps versus the no-charge poverty caps.

[John V.]

Cool GTO BTW. Your GTO probably just got in under the wire to get the 3.55 axle.

The 3.55 was standard with the Tripower option from the start of the year. In January, PMD announced that the standard axle for the Tripower was being changed in production to the 3.23.

Documentation on that change might have suggested the change would have occurred before yours was preferenced but I'm guessing the change might have taken awhile before it got implemented at the satellite Plants. So I'm not surprised that yours got it as standard in your Fremont built Tripower equipped GTO.

A lesser known running change dealt with the Radiator choice.

From the beginning, all 3.55 and 3.90 geared GTOs required the HD Radiator. Since the 3.55 was standard with the Tripower, the GTO with Tripower was also getting the 2-5/8" thick HD Radiator as standard equipment.

Without fanfare and without any documentation that I'm aware of, PMD began installing the 2" Radiator in the Tripower GTOs sometime around March. I believe they made that decision as a direct result of the switch to the 3.23 axle. From then on in '64, if you special ordered the 3.55 axle, you were also required to order the HD Radiator at extra cost.

Your GTO would have gotten the HD Radiator "free".

There is an old thread in this forum where I was tabulating all Sunfire Red builds. If I haven't already included yours, if you post the Time Built code from your Data Plate, I will dredge up that thread and add yours to the tally. Thanks.

[G.T.O.boy]

It is included in the Sunfire thread, mine has a tagged radiator that is a 2"x17.5" 3 core radiator, but it could have been swapped out at some point, as this car was raced heavily

[jeff chmura]

No problem.....I'm at work now....will post tag and PHS tomorrow
FYI... It's a 03C build...
Jeff

[60sstuff]

Late build ‘65 GTO at the “Fremont“ GM Plant.

Capri Gold post car with 6E = 5th week of June 65.

TT paint code. No wheel color code.


1966 “Fremont” build with factory Rally I wheels.
Data plate with CC paint code and No wheel code.

CT

[jeff chmura]

You guys are right on the money.....I do have a letter on the cowl tag! Getting old sucks! Lol
Pic of cowl and PHS .
And yes, the cowl tag was removed by PO and I cleaned it up. It was painted which I found out is not the case with the Fremont built cars
Reinstalled with correct rivets. The dum dum makes it look out of place

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Thanks Jeff, at least we know another IrisMist car has survived.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Here is the example i have that bucks the standard.
There's always at least one

64 Gulfstream Aqua (Q) with no hubcap option (poverty caps)
But lists black wheel code (A) on PHS

Checked all my 65 BHC's and the LL L car was the only one of any interest.
Didn't even have one single example that was Rally One optioned. [ shameful ]

[John V.]

Well that was almost too easy. I won't claim I know the answer for certain until I find more examples.

But my hypothesis is that ALL builds with Red Line Tires in '64 were built with Code A Black Wheels.

That is true for the Balt build Baron posted, Tire Code FR indicated that one got Red Lines.

And I just found another such "exception".

11/26 Pontiac built post coupe GTO showing Tire Type 07 (boxes 72 and 73) which also means Red Lines for the Pontiac builds.

This GTO was Code FFA, Yorktown Blue with Black Wheels. It does not have a Wheel Cover option. blanks in Box 46 and 52 and too early for the Wires although Box 41 is also blank FWIW. Early year that means it was not equipped with the then optional standard front seat belts.

I'm guessing PMD decided to always mount Red Lines on Black Wheels because of very low anticipated usage. Not enough volume to justify mounting them to 6 different color wheels. Or maybe they feared the Red Lines would aesthetically clash with the other color wheels. I wonder if this was same policy for '65?

I'm continuing to sift thru my records, will report others that fit my hypothesis.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Originally Posted by John V.

...my hypothesis is that ALL builds with Red Line Tires in '64 were built with Code A Black Wheels.

That is true for the Balt build Baron posted, Tire Code FR indicated that one got Red Lines.

And I just found another such "exception".

That's a Real good lead.

I was even thinking too, that the Gulfstream Vert may possibly have been customer request for black wheels instead of Aqua.
It was definitely a hand-picked customer ordered car.

The 1964 Redline Tire factor will probably pan out though.
Sounds pretty strong

I wonder if this was same policy for '65?

Probably won't pan out to carry over into 1965 though.
The 1965 LL-L example had "CC" Redline Tires

[Jack P.]

I have a 5A build Fremont 65 with no wheel paint code. The PHS shows an optional wheel cover that covers the entire wheel. I can post info if anyone wants it.