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#21
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clearance problem
The trans mount i used is a GM one that i had in my cupboard for 30 years and is and was identical to the old one i took off the trans,,,, stock. Iv'e drove this car for 2 years with the 6 bangger in it and it goes down straight as a arrow. Also there is only one shim for front end alignment so i really find it hard to believe it has a frame sag. Just thought i would put it out on here to see if anyone else has had this problem. Iv'e did these swaps alot over the last 30 years and never had this mickey mouse problem. Thought i was missing something... I guess put shims under the frame perches which i'm against. Could it be the steering box from a 6 cyl. car? are the different from the V-8 cars as far as shaft lengths?
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#22
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Are you sure that you have the "Taller" Engine frame mount on the Drivers side and the "Shorter" metal engine frame mount on the passenger side? They are different.
Where did your V-8 Frame Mounts come from? Tom V. .
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"Engineers do stuff for reasons" Tom Vaught Despite small distractions, there are those who will go Forward, Learning, Sharing Knowledge, Doing what they can to help others move forward. |
#23
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The frame stands have different bolts patterns they cannot be mounted on the wrong side, those clever Pontiac engineers made it easy.
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1964 Tempest Coupe LS3/4L70E/3.42 1964 Le Mans Convertible 421 HO/TH350/2.56 2002 WS6 Convertible LS1/4L60E/3.23 |
#24
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clearance problem
As B-Man said you can't bolt them on wrong. And they are from a 64 LeMans.
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#25
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clearance problem
The kicker is the motor is level from side to side and has the correct drop back towards the firewall. I'm using the factory trans
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#26
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Interesting, then why is the Stock metal engine mount on the frame higher on the drivers side.
The engine should not be level, if I remember correctly, so that the oil can drain from the oil pan out the open pan plug hole properly when doing an oil change. Tom V.
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"Engineers do stuff for reasons" Tom Vaught Despite small distractions, there are those who will go Forward, Learning, Sharing Knowledge, Doing what they can to help others move forward. Last edited by Tom Vaught; 11-06-2019 at 11:19 PM. |
#27
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clearance problem
???? The motor is sitting in there spot on from left to right and has the correct drop from front to back which in turn lets the oil go to the oil pan sump
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#28
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I will ask the question differently then.
Why is the drivers side metal mount higher vs the passenger side metal mount? Why can't they be the same height if the bolt pattern to the frame is different. They are different for a reason. Post up what it is. Tom V.
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"Engineers do stuff for reasons" Tom Vaught Despite small distractions, there are those who will go Forward, Learning, Sharing Knowledge, Doing what they can to help others move forward. |
#29
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The engine should sit level from side to side.
The drain plug is in the center front on all oil pans until 1970 when the plug was moved to the side, and even then the engine was still mounted level in the frame. I would say the reason for the difference in frame stand height has something to do with the crossmember not being symmetrical. Here’s my ‘64 Tempest engine compartment showing the frame stands, judge for yourselves. By the way this car was also factory equipped with a six-banger, at one point I put a 455 in it.
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1964 Tempest Coupe LS3/4L70E/3.42 1964 Le Mans Convertible 421 HO/TH350/2.56 2002 WS6 Convertible LS1/4L60E/3.23 |
#30
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Quote:
A ‘64 -‘65 Pontiac 215 six weighs in at about 440 pounds (same as Chevy 194/230/250 sixes). A Chevy small block V8 is about 550 pounds. Chevy V8s are definitely heavier than Chevy sixes, look it up, the information is out there on the ‘net. Front springs for six cylinder cars are made for the lighter engine, put in a V8 and the front end will sit lower.
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1964 Tempest Coupe LS3/4L70E/3.42 1964 Le Mans Convertible 421 HO/TH350/2.56 2002 WS6 Convertible LS1/4L60E/3.23 |
#31
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Sorry about that Tom. My mistake.
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"I know just enough to keep me here, but not enough to get me out" |
#32
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Quote:
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The '64 GTO The '65 Chevelle The '69 Chevy Pickup Project The Brazen Orange 2006 GTO |
#33
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The engine is supposed to sit level side to side, it however may not sit centered in the frame. Pontiacs are wider than most other GM engines causing steering shaft exhaust manifold interference if centered symmetrically in the chassis.
I worked on a 68 Firebird that someone had butchered the frame mounts in, with the proper mounts installed the engine was offset to the passenger side of the car by at least an inch. The first gen Firebirds are rear steer tie rods and that puts the steering box in an area that causes the minimal clearance with the exhaust manifolds. It also causes the engine to be off center in the chassis. In my experience most Pontiac cars have the engine offset to the passengers side because of steering gear interference. Different chassis have more or less offset than others. I.E. a 69 GP has the engine setback in the chassis about 4 inches requiring no engine off set because of steering gear interference. In this particular car there is a possibility that the frame horns could be swayed to the right/passenger side causing the steering box to be too close to the exhaust manifolds, even with the correct frame engine mounts installed. I'm not saying that this is definitely the problem, but is a possibility to cause the interference shown. |
#34
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My carpenters level (4 foot) when sitting above the waterneck on the front ends of the valve covers says the engine is not level but it is only off about a 1/4 of a bubble from being close to being level. So I guess I would agree that it is close to being level.
Tom V.
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"Engineers do stuff for reasons" Tom Vaught Despite small distractions, there are those who will go Forward, Learning, Sharing Knowledge, Doing what they can to help others move forward. |
#35
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We found that out pulling the 6 out of a friend's 67 Acadian(Nova) to put in a SBC. Felt not a lot different.
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Skip Fix 1978 Trans Am original owner 10.99 @ 124 pump gas 455 E heads, NO Bird ever! 1981 Black SE Trans Am stockish 6X 400ci, turbo 301 on a stand 1965 GTO 4 barrel 3 speed project 2004 GTO Pulse Red stock motor computer tune 13.43@103.4 1964 Impala SS 409/470ci 600 HP stroker project 1979 Camaro IAII Edelbrock head 500" 695 HP 10.33@132 3595lbs |
#36
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Quote:
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Jeff |
#37
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The '64 GTO The '65 Chevelle The '69 Chevy Pickup Project The Brazen Orange 2006 GTO |
#38
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I may be way off here, as I see a lot of more qualified people than I, have already responded, but it looks to me that the shaft coming out of your steering box is too long. (compared to mine)....maybe you have a manual steering box?
That would mean that your steering column is shorter, does that mean that 6cyl. cars and V8's had different length steering columns? and maybe manual steering columns were shorter than power steering columns?? Sorry to create more questions than answers, but if you could relocate that rag joint closer to the steering box, there would be plenty of room. sorry I don't have any pics of mine |
#39
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Steering columns are all the same length.
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1964 Tempest Coupe LS3/4L70E/3.42 1964 Le Mans Convertible 421 HO/TH350/2.56 2002 WS6 Convertible LS1/4L60E/3.23 |
#40
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Quote:
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Gotta Luv some old Muscle.. 64 GTO Sedan Produced w/PwrSteering-PwrBrakes-AC-Padded Dash/Rally clock/ RemoteSideMirror 3sp&3:08/10 boltPosi-Pwr Windows-Pwr Antenna Silvermist w/BlackVinyl Top http://s161.photobucket.com/albums/t201/dracowizard/65/ |
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