[MikeCio1]

When the car is hot, operating temp. The starter will not start until it cools. I installed the selinoid heat shield and wrapped it in heat reflective wrap. It works better then it did. But yesterday it was about 85 out and it acted up again. I took it off and brought it in, They bench tested it and said the starter and selinoid are both good.
Any suggestions?

[Slick 50]

Most will tell you that you have heat soak. A new high torque starter should fix you up. If you have a local place that builds starters I bet they could fix you up too. Years ago I had the same problem and a local shop rebuilt my starter to some bad boy specs and I never had another problem. That was after replacing the starter 3 times with local parts store starters with lifetime warrranty. We didn't have the mini starters then.

[tommie69]

Put in a high tork starter from summit,and check your timing!It may be too far advanced and that probably has a lot to do with it .In fact I would start with checking the timing first!Tom

[MikeCio1]

The timing is right on.
I was kind of hoping not to have to put out the cash for a new starter.
Thanks for the suggestions!

[goathead455]

Do starter draw test to see if is good under load.
Do a load test on the battery to see if it has enough power to crank your hot engine.
Check your connections and use as heavy guage battery cable as possible.

[WINGNUT]

I had the same problem up until a couple years ago with my car. It would start every time but it would always scare the crap out of me, because there were times when I thought it would not start. Does your car run hot?

I remedied the problem by installing a high rpm starter, a heat shield, a 16 psi radiator cap, and a 160 degree thermostat.

[MikeCio1]

I did the heat shield and put the heat wrap all the way around it. I have a new 160 thermostat, and put some 40below in it. It runs about 165 to 175. In stop and go it will get up to 195. I guess a better starter seems to be the key from what I have heard. What is a good type or brand to use/get?

[JLHarper]

Call PY and tell them the problem.

They have a soultion for the hot starter problem using factory parts.

If I am not mistaken the SD 455s were built better internally. I bought one and its heavier for sure.
Battery cables can be beefed up as well.

They fixed me up one year. I talked with Chris at a show but others may help.

[70KGOLD]

high torque starter, Good battery Problem solved.

[Ben M.]

Or your 30 year old factory wiring could be toast. Upgrading to 2ga battery cables will fix this problem easily.

[78 GHOST]

IMHO, hot start issues are typically the sum of numerous small issues, which taken individually would not be a major problem. However, when you combine 4-5 things then you might start to run into hot start issues.

Thermal load, electrical load, voltage delivered, timing, etc. all can conspire to cause an embarassing hot start issue.

As I don't know your mechanical background, I'll start with some basics so we all understand how the performance of each component affects others.

Battery- A storage device for electricity used to start the engine, kind of like a balloon which we inflate by charging, and deflate by discharging. Discharging occurs anytime we have an electrical demand without a means of recharging. Charging occurs when the Generator or Alternator converts mechanical energy to electrical energy.

Battery Cables- Conduit for supplying electricity to an electrical appliance from the battery, and back to the negative terminal of the battery to complete the circuit. While the positive portion of any electrical circuit usually receives a lot of attention, the negative side of any circuit is equally important as it completes the circuit.

Starter- Device for converting electrical potential energy to mechanical energy. Keep in mind that Pontiac and other manufacturers used the economy of scale to save money during design and production of components. This means that Pontiac would use the same basic archetecture for certain components, while the internal features might be substantially different. The starter used on a 326 might bolt up to a 455, but provides a different cranking torque due to internal differences. Obviously, Napa/AutoZone/Etc. will not supply starters of different engines, they will usually only carry one part number of the most popular starter (usually lower HP engines.)

The result is that the starter on your car may not provide the proper amount of cranking torque, even under the best of circumstances. Add to this some compromised battery cables, a weak battery, a hot day, improper ignition timing, and that incorrect starter doesn't really stand much of a chance in starting your engine.

So, the solution is to work on these problems in a logical manner to solve your problems.

First, your starter should be critically analyzed for current draw. Barring that, you could simply pull your starter and either have it rebuilt by a reputable electrical shop locally, or install a geared Hi-Torque style starter. Should you choose the rebuild route, ensure the shop rebuilds your starter to the highest performance, "Big Block" or whatever spec the shop wants to call it, the idea is to ensure the starter is optimized for your high performance engine.

Second, consider your battery cables. OO Welding cable is a popular route to fabricating home built high performance cables. Don't overlook all connections and the negative side of the circuit.

Third, have your Battery checked to ensure you're not fighting an internal short which is causing low voltage under load. I'd suggest a NAPA with a good digital battery tester.

Fourth, have your Alternator or Generator system fully checked out. Should you be fighting a weak charging system, your battery will fail to be fully recharged.

Fifth, consider that heat adds resistance to any circuit. Should you be fighting a problem, adding high ambient or vehicle heat loads to a delicate electrical system will likely push things over the edge of functionality.

Sixth, ignition timing can cause all kinds of problems from detonation to overheating. In addition, too much ignition lead (advance) will cause cylinder pressures to rise before the engine can be started. Slightly retarding ignition timing can alleviate a hard starting problem if you're out of options, and stranded far from home.

Through this process, keep in mind that Pontiac built millions of vehicles, using stock parts, which provided millions upon millions of trouble free miles. The problem we face now is the stock components are being rebuilt by vendors who have no incentive to provide a product which provides more that the required performance for the most common vehicles.

Good luck and keep us posted. -Matt

[tp's lemans sport]

Tried wrapping the starter with a heat shield blanket didn't work. I switched batteries between the GTO and the LeMans. Drove the car for an hour worked fine when it was hot so I replaced the battery. No problems since.

[MikeCio1]

You guys are great! As soon as the car gets back from the paint shop I will be utilizing your suggestions.

[78 GHOST]

TP: I'd suggest double checking your charging system, as a faulty system will cause the battery to slowly discharge. Sometimes the charging system will work just well enough to avoid illuminating any "GEN" lights in the dash.

On our cars with the older alternators, the voltage regulators can and do get a bit wonky. Simply attaching a digital electrical system tester from a good parts house like NAPA will enable you to eliminate the charging system as a problem.

[MikeCio1]

Originally Posted by 78 GHOST

TP: I'd suggest double checking your charging system, as a faulty system will cause the battery to slowly discharge. Sometimes the charging system will work just well enough to avoid illuminating any "GEN" lights in the dash.

On our cars with the older alternators, the voltage regulators can and do get a bit wonky. Simply attaching a digital electrical system tester from a good parts house like NAPA will enable you to eliminate the charging system as a problem.

I have a after market voltmeter installed. It seems to be charging. 12.5 is about normal when drivng. 13.5 after it sets for a week, then goes down. It idles right at 12.
And I usually keep it on a tender when its sits more then a week.

[tp's lemans sport]

Thanks for the advice but it's been almost a year and no problems. If this start happening again I'll check further. I did replace the alternator a couple of month ago the bearing were making high pitched whine when I started the LeMans up. It would stop making noise after a few minutes.

[judgeman6970]

u have a lot of helpful advice/info...thanks, 78ghost!!