[GT182]

Give me a Pontiac from '57 up to the unibodies any day. Some of the best looking cars on the road... and built tuff too. I'd rather be in an accident in one from those years with a full frame than any thing made up to today that's a unibody.

If I had the money and garage space, I'd have a full size Pontiac from the 60s sitting next to my GTO.

[justincampbell]

I figured I'd just throw in my 2 cents

First, let me say that I love big Pontiacs. I had a '77 Grand Prix and to ths day it is still one of the best riding/driving cars I have ever been in.

Second, I don't think "investment" is exactly the word I would use, however I consider whether or not I am likely to lose money in the long term in any vehicle purchase. I am not likely to keep a car for more than 3-4 years before I move on to something else(automotive ADD). I don't expect to make any money on these vehicles, but I certainly don't earn enough to say "I lost $5k, it's no big deal." I don't think this makes me less of a car guy. It just means that I may want a different car at some point without taking a second job. I only have one vehicle that I can approach with a "money is no object" mentality. That vehicle is one that has a great deal of sentimental value(been in my family 40 years) and will never be sold.

Third, the current economy is complete and total crap and IMO will be for quite a while. Basically, if you need to sell you will probably have to give it away(not just big cars). The exception to this(in some cases) would be restored/finished cars. The people who had way too much money, still have way too much money and are often foolish with it. I say finished cars because about 99% of the big money people are lucky if they know how to change their oil.

[goatwgn]

Not just cars, nowadays you cant even make money on a house. Glad Im not selling, but a friend of mine is pretty much stuck with about 7 rental houses that he cant get rid of at a profit. And this is true with a lot of "investments" nowadays

[Cobrabill]

Originally Posted by justincampbell

I figured I'd just throw in my 2 cents

First, let me say that I love big Pontiacs. I had a '77 Grand Prix and to ths day it is still one of the best riding/driving cars I have ever been in.

Second, I don't think "investment" is exactly the word I would use, however I consider whether or not I am likely to lose money in the long term in any vehicle purchase. I am not likely to keep a car for more than 3-4 years before I move on to something else(automotive ADD). I don't expect to make any money on these vehicles, but I certainly don't earn enough to say "I lost $5k, it's no big deal." I don't think this makes me less of a car guy. It just means that I may want a different car at some point without taking a second job. I only have one vehicle that I can approach with a "money is no object" mentality. That vehicle is one that has a great deal of sentimental value(been in my family 40 years) and will never be sold.

Third, the current economy is complete and total crap and IMO will be for quite a while. Basically, if you need to sell you will probably have to give it away(not just big cars). The exception to this(in some cases) would be restored/finished cars. The people who had way too much money, still have way too much money and are often foolish with it. I say finished cars because about 99% of the big money people are lucky if they know how to change their oil.

Even though a 77 GP is not a"big car"(it's a"G-body or A-special"),the 77 was the last of the real GP's.If money weren't an object-i'd have one.

[71GP76TA]

Originally Posted by TylerW

I'm not trying to be a rude person, but why even have that forum? It's obvious nobody on this board outside of a few ppl give a crap about full-size Pontiacs unless you nearly give them away, even if they are nice cars.

People post ads and it's like a graveyard. Maybe nobody wants to admit that full-size Pontiacs by and large are barely worth the metal they are made of these days.

I think Pontiacs are great cars, but I'll never buy another full-size version. I found out the hard way they are a poor investment.

You paid $860 for that turd and sold it for $1200... WTF is the problem???

[TylerW]

Thanks for the interesting or rude, and in a couple cases, useless comments.

There is no BAD news. I sold this car a while back. The only part that I am..what was the phrase... "stomping my feet over" is that nobody on this board deigned to fork out $800 for this car. That's what it sold for. It sold to some guy who there's no idea how it'll be cared for.

Secondly..I said INVESTMENT. Let's define invest: Invest means, in simple terms, to convert cash into material goods. In this case, it wasn't a good investment because I lost about..oh..300 bucks. Now, nobody needs to come offer the noob(that damn low post count..dammit!) a shoulder to cry on and your hanky. I reinvested the money in something else that's sure to RETAIN it's value.

Now...the part that I never said, but obviously was interpreted as such was, make a PROFIT on. I would have liked to, but I was up against a time constraint and had to sell.

I saw a comment about that "dirty carpet" and that replacing that would have netted a few hundred more. No, it wouldn't have. All that would have achieved would be to move comments onto the dent in the RF, or the faded taillight trim, or the wrong hubcap, yadda yadda.

The NHRA tag. I agree, it should have been one of those "Let me tell you about my grandchildren" tags.

"It would have sold had it been exposed to more than PY". It was.

Anyway, I guess you guys all have enough dough rolling around that you see people selling cheap cars as a source of amusement. Glad you got a laugh out of it before you sat down and deducted $5000 out of your checking account for your garage queen's new paint job.

To conclude, don't post anymore dumb comments. The car is gone, none of you have it, it went to a bro, you caused that, not I. I tried here first. Oh well, bye Bonneville.

[TylerW]

Originally Posted by 71GP76TA

You paid $860 for that turd and sold it for $1200... WTF is the problem???

"Turd"..? Really? That's funny, that's the same thing we called '76 and up TAs when they were a few years old and cheap, rich guy.

[Brian Baker]

Wow...Tyler, it sounds like you have learned your lesson. You now know a little better about what is a good investment and what is a bad investment in regards to Pontiacs. We can't all hit home runs every time at the plate, but it would be nice if we could...instead we can just learn from our strike outs and swing smarter the next time at bat.

[Coach]

Originally Posted by TylerW

Glad you got a laugh out of it before you sat down and deducted $5000 out of your checking account for your garage queen's new paint job.
.

Well she's not exactly a garage queen, but I sure wish I could have gotten her painted for $5k, lol.

[Engine-Ear]

Hey Tyler, glad you came back to reply.

I remember that '66...in fact I think I even traded email with you about getting it to run good (anyway, doesn't matter).

You may not agree, but the tone of your opening post was begging for people who are truly into the big Pontiac end of the HOBBY (H O B B Y, not BUSINESS) to chime and set you straight.

99 out of 100 '66 Cat "more-door"s won't have much of an audience...the late '70s coupe is probably the same in that regard. Your results didn't turn out like you planned, but that's life, sailor.

If you get another Pontiac someday that you plan to KEEP and ENJOY, shine around again...we'll be glad to help (well, some of us anyway).

Merry Christmas, TW.

[242177P]

Originally Posted by TylerW

Anyway, I guess you guys all have enough dough rolling around that you see people selling cheap cars as a source of amusement.

I doubt that anyone was amused by the sale itself, the "screw you all" attitude was the real attention grabber. HTH.

[Cobrabill]

The reality is that interest drops off( a cliff)after '68(the last of the "Coke bottles".Very limited audience(market).The later you go-the smaller it gets.By 72 you need a magnifying glass to see it."More-doors" just accelerate the numbers.

[TylerW]

It was not a "screw you" attitude. It was and is, a "don't waste my time if you aren't serious or interested" and the only people that get them in a wad over that are, you guessed it, people that AREN'T serious or interested.

I like to buy and sell things on Craigslist and eBay, and I learned quickly to separate the people who are always too far away, will have money on ___ date, find small BS to turn them off on being interested, ETCETERA..from the folks who have money and wish to spend it on an item I have.

When I listed that Bonneville on here, I knew very well I was going to be putting it out in front of a majority just in from a Tylenol Arthritis run in the 'ol GTO convertible. That's borderline rude, but I've read enough on these forums to see the comments people make about "mainstream" cars.

When I made the statement that people in this hobby will pay too much for a rust bucket and ignore the solid cars because they aren't everyone's idea of cool, I was right. That's true. That's why mid-late '70s smogger Trans-Ams went from being $2000 used cars to the wildly overpriced things they are today....everyone HAS to HAVE one. I remember my father slamming the hood in disgust on a very nice, very modestly-priced '79 TA because it had a 403 Olds in it. That was about 1983.

Anyway...the '66 Catalina is undergoing a full restoration. The guy isn't wealthy, he's doing it all himself because he simply wanted a classic car and he really couldn't care less if an internet board sniffs in disdain.

[Blackcat]

Selling a car is like wanting abuse. Be it a nice car or a POS. If you cannot take the heat then its too bad. I've owned and sold more cars than people can imagine. From every GTO (cept 74) And plenty of big cars. I would often have a car sitting on my corner with a forsale sign on it every month. You get all kinds that look, kick the tires and insult you. Tell them no thanks and wait for the next one.

It's been a few years since I've sold any cars and the last ones I sold broke my heart.
But, live goes on and some day another Big pontiac will be in my driveway.

[Gathrn]

Glad to hear the Cat is undergoing a full restore. Sounds like it went to the right person who will enjoy it as a hobby.

[Greg Reid]

Originally Posted by TylerW

... and he really couldn't care less if an internet board sniffs in disdain.

But apparently, you do.

[GaryK]

Originally Posted by TylerW

.

The car is gone, none of you have it, it went to a bro, you caused that, not I. I tried here first. Oh well, bye Bonneville.

Am I to assume you mean an african-american? (In NJ, that's how we would interpret that kind of statement) As if they shouldn't own classic cars?

None of us have the car because none of us wanted it! Reasons based more on the seller than the car itself.

I hope to see "the bro" and his car at the next cruise or car show!

[ramairthreegto]

What the hell is your problem?

I and many others stated our like of the full sized muscle car era cars, even though they don't bring the money some other models do. The reality is a 428 cat or bonneville is not going to bring in what a RA or 455 GTO will. Let alone a first gen TA. It is not fair, but does not matter what is the rarer or better car, the market gets to decide.

Guess what-
my GTO left the factory an automatic, base GTO 400 car- it won't bring what a real RA or Judge car will on the market. And I think two door post bench seat A bodies are really cool, but the market does not. But I have a RAIII built engine, the RA parts, and Judge appearance, and I get to have a ball putting about 4000 miles a year on a car to represent and generate interest in Amercian automotive history.

I have a 71 Javelin 360 SST back on the road. It will not bring what a 401 4 speed AMX will, or even what a lot more common base engine Camaro or Firebird will. I am not bashing people for that, it is what it is. If I put ten grand into it, it will still not bring ten grand on the market.

There is little love in the Mopar circles for 71 to 74 Chargers and Roadrunners, let alone Satelites, and especially the 73/74s. No on is interested in a 74 smallblock. But I should have a 74 Roadrunner 318 back on the road. I know it will not bring a lot. I am not going to bash others because it is not valuable. I am going to enjoy it. Nicely powered 360s are cheap, and its a factory console, dual exhaust, front disc, sunroof car. I love it. I have no right to bash anyone if I can't make a profit on it.

And there is little to no interest in post 74 mid sized or full sized cars. Hell, most of us have no interest in any GM A body post 73. (no offense to those that do, just sayin'). If you like those cars, then fix up your Laguna or CanAm or whatever. But don't bash us for not wanting to pay much for it. If I decide to buy a 74 Monte Carlo or Grandville and dump 20 grand into it, you won't see me bashing others for it not being worth twenty grand.

I personally loved second gen camaros and firebirds when I was a kid, but could care less about them now. My opinion has nothing to do with their market value or current collectability.

I personally loved 73/74 Roadrunners when I was a kid, and still do. Again, my opinion does not exactly affect the market value.

I think Mustangs are overpriced, Torinos under priced, and would pay more for a fastback cat or bonneville than a GP, but its all just opinion. Like I think 85 Z28s and IROCS and MonteCarlo SS's are cool, but no one is opening their checkbook for one like they would a 69 Z28 or early 70s 454 Monte or 455 GP. It makes no sense to me that a SS Chevelle with a 350 brings more than car I think is way cooler like a california special 68 Buick, or 350 two door sedan Tempest. I ain't bashing nobody for it.

I have asked about dozens of cars on Ebay, Craigslist, car internet boards, etc. but only have room, time, and money for so many. In the past two and one half years I have bought a 69 GTO, a 71 Javelin SST, and a 74 Roadrunner. I would love a muscle car era Mercury and Oldsmobile to round out the defunct American muscle car era manufacturers in my project stable. Don't blame the potential buyer if they pass on your car. It just may not be what they want to take on or have enough interest in at the end of the day. If you feel put out if someone like me asks for interior pictures or a closeup of some rust around the rear window, tough crap, you are the one that wants to sell it. I am the one with the pimp roll of of 100s and 20s. If you have a numbers matching 10 thousand mile 69 TA or Dodge Daytona Hemi car, then you get to be a little more picky. Because regardless of what you or I think, the market gets to decide.

And if a guy wants to put a classic Amercian muscle car era back on the road, and is buying parts from and supporting American businesses while doing it, who cares if he is rich, not rich, or what color he is? I may have no interest in putting huge rims on a mid 80s GM car, but if a local business is getting work doing so, that's good in my book.

And screw you for busting on the "Tylenol/Arthritis set". I may only be in my 40s, but if those guys in their 80s that fought in WWII and Korea have no interest in your car or hurt your feelings, go pound sand. Just because a guy is bald or has a bunch of gray hairs, and has no interest in your car, you want to bust on him? Guess what, when he came back from his year of being an Infantryman in Vietnam he may have had no more interest in what you have to sell then than he does now. It's his damn business.

[Tennesseestorm]

I love my big Pontiac (73 Grand Ville) and will probably never sell it... its true, they dont bring alot of $... out of all of the big cars from GM, the Pontiacs seem to not be as highly desired as say Chevy, Buick and Cadillac.

I only paid $900 for my 73 GV about 10 years ago.... it was in excellent shape... still in good shape, but not as nice as it was... 10 years of weather has taken a toll on it.

The big Pontiacs are neat cars... a shame more people are not into them.

Originally Posted by TylerW

I'm not trying to be a rude person, but why even have that forum? It's obvious nobody on this board outside of a few ppl give a crap about full-size Pontiacs unless you nearly give them away, even if they are nice cars.

People post ads and it's like a graveyard. Maybe nobody wants to admit that full-size Pontiacs by and large are barely worth the metal they are made of these days.

I think Pontiacs are great cars, but I'll never buy another full-size version. I found out the hard way they are a poor investment.

[Nomadac]

If you grew up around the old big Pontiacs you would appreciate them more. The real car enthusiasts buy cars that they want to own and drive, not for investment. If someone was interested in investment, they would never buy an old car and restore it frame off, as they will never recover their total costs. Go to any Hot Rod Show and look at the restored cars and you will find many for sale for less then the total restoration, you can see this on Barrett Jackson Auctions.

I am very happy with my big Pontiac, I don't have to worry about seeing dozens of the same car at car shows.
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