[65nss4spdGTO]

Originally Posted by 69Goat1

Guess I am confused on the first question about ET's of guys who went Faster... TTB knows all that stuff because he has been throwing it around all over the forums for years but for some reason even though everybody went faster according to him with CV heads then why did they jump ship?

I was 719 HP for $300 in port work and the cost of a set of heads from Summit on a stock block/stock crank 462. My heads have never been worked on by a "Pontiac" guy...pretty good bang for the buck for the low investment...I built the engine to be as easy on parts as I could with a cam that didn't require a lifter brace etc...very low buck deal but as with all low buck deals like that the stock Pontiac 455 block is always the weak point if you have decent rods...

Congrats on the Dyno numbers for the CV - How does the CV engine perform in a car? Weight? Trans? etc...

With all due respect If we couldn't get more then 789 HP out of a set of mild E's on a 535 then even though you are busy we still wouldn't be talking about it...I am pretty sure 800+ is going to be a no brainer and I won't be happy with less than 850 and that is certainly within the capabilities of the "Easy" Button for E-heads...Can probably drop compression some and get that out of the DCI heads...I know 3 guys who switched to HP's that slowed down from their E's but to be fair 1 friend sold his set to another so it was only 2 sets of heads. I drove 1 of the cars and it seemed lazy... I am sure with lots of tuning, a bigger cam, more gear, more stall they would have been comparable but it was just a head switch deal and to go from running 10.30's to 10.80's and being tapped on funds they just sold out and went back to what they had that worked. Don't get me wrong - If you do all the stuff to make them work a KRE HP is a great head but when you get outrun by a set of Summit Racing E-heads with $300 in grinding on them you pretty much just get dejected about the whole deal...

I am not sure what CI I am going to go with but to me a "Bigger Motor" is more than 462 ci...

By the way I never said the E-head was the end all be all head for a Pontiac but for the low amount of money I have in mine I am pretty happy to have been able to outrun some of the "Pontiac Exotics up to and including CV-!'s at our track as you see, there are more than just the few sets guys on these boards are using floating around out there and to say nobody has done anything at all for 3 years with them is ludicrous...to think just because everyone isn't using you or Bill specifically for their builds doesn't mean someone no one is building a CV engine with all the old heads floating around out there...Heck the only Pontiac engine type shop I have ever dealt with is Butler and I only ordered a few parts from them and when I build my engine I will order parts for it but nobody anyone here knows will be the Machine Shop and Engine Builder...

I'm asking you to tell me who switched from CVs and went FASTER AFTER.

You keep talking about this $300 set of heads, I think you should go back to him because he is giving his work away.

Get back to me when you make that easy 850 HP with standard port Eheads, that has to be a record. Now you are sounding like a CV-1 nut hugger!

Btw, how long ago did you run 9.90's, wasn't a few years ago?

How much faster are you today?

Calvin Hill
Hill Performance
708-250-7420

[TimeWarp]

Originally Posted by 69Goat1

Guess I am confused on the first question about ET's of guys who went Faster... TTB knows all that stuff because he has been throwing it around all over the forums for years but for some reason even though everybody went faster according to him with CV heads then why did they jump ship?

There are plenty of examples of people who went faster and did not "jump ship". If you want reasons why some did, ask them. Don't assume it was the heads fault. There are also plenty who have not jumped ship. Men like Robin and Fulton are not BSers. Either way its not ok to come back on a forum and bash a head because someone else said XYZ.

Nobody is forcing anyone to buy any particular head. At least...I haven't seen anyone holding a gun to another person's head. Judge their merits by first hand reports, not someone else's heresay and the buyer will be far better off. if you don't like the product...don't buy it.

The heads have shown they have potential. Whether you think its only one example, or you look at the list Bill gave of people who went faster after using the heads and believe the whole list is true.

There are people running them out there. Are they always the fastest head on the track? Of course not. There is so much else to a race car beyond the heads.

Out of the original small batch a LOT of heads ended up sitting around for various reasons. Mine are brand new and were purchased by Tom years ago. Why? Life interfered. This hobby isnt going to feed your family or take care of someone sick. There are a few diehard racers that race all the time. The rest of us have other things going on, and cars get put on the back burner.

I personally think these heads have a lot of potential. Is it my goal to have a car faster than every other out there? No. Even if I had that kind of money it wouldn't be my goal. I also know I won't turn down a deal on another good set of E-heads if they come along.

[mike leech]

Is it just me or have somebody mentioned yellow bullet trash or be trashed in every single post they've made?

[cosgrove]

Please make this stop! I can't stand reading this anymore. But I can't stop . AAGGHH!

[TimeWarp]

Originally Posted by mike leech

Is it just me or have somebody mentioned yellow bullet trash or be trashed in every single post they've made?

Not every one, but a number of them. Reason? Because that seems to be the mentality of some over here too. And its been rampant for too long. It doesn't belong here. If you like it there is plenty of band width over there.

[GTO Dan]

Originally Posted by TimeWarp

Not every one, but a number of them. Reason? Because that seems to be the mentality of some over here too. And its been rampant for too long. It doesn't belong here. If you like it there is plenty of band width over there.

It is rough over there in TOBT but if you stay in the Tech Forums that are moderated it is very good, they are some of the best on the net.

And this is nothing like TOBT. It's like comparing a yappy French Poodle to a Pit Bull.

[69Goat1]

Originally Posted by 65nss4spdGTO

I'm asking you to tell me who switched from CVs and went FASTER AFTER.



You keep talking about this $300 set of heads, I think you should go back to him because he is giving his work away.



Get back to me when you make that easy 850 HP with standard port Eheads, that has to be a record. Now you are sounding like a CV-1 nut hugger!



Btw, how long ago did you run 9.90's, wasn't a few years ago?



How much faster are you today?



Calvin Hill

Hill Performance

708-250-7420

I don't know of anyone personally who has gone faster with CV heads than they were before... TTBill is the guy you should ask on that because he is the one who is always typing that in. The few I have seen use them didn't go any faster if they even went as fast. Last guy I knew of was a roots blown deal in Tulsa by a guy named Bill who quit his CV program, sold his car and bought a Harley... I lined up with him in his firebird and ran off and left him Motor to blower...



Out here in the woods $300 will get you a lot more



As far as the 850 I am sure with an IA block and good rotating assembly and cam that 850 is highly doable with E-heads so I guess the gauntlet has been thrown out on that deal... I know 719 HP at 314 cfm with a really mild build (definitely not a maxed out deal) shows the potential for a lot better is there...



I haven't been on a drag strip since 2012 but many summer nights you can find me on the street...usually between 12:00 AM and 3:00 AM mid week...



My street car with 8.5:1 compression definitely has more than my track car had but it also has a power adder...



Best my old car ran in the fall of the year was a 9.72 and in 90+ temps 3000+ foot stuff went 9.90's...

[TimeWarp]

Oh I agree on all of the above Dan. Just saying this is another version of the same idea. And we really don't need to be that way. It can just stop if everyone decides to quit the bickering and digs. Its one thing to put out some digs to a buddy in a friendly fashion. This isn't friendly.

[GTO Dan]

Originally Posted by TimeWarp

Oh I agree on all of the above Dan. Just saying this is another version of the same idea. And we really don't need to be that way. It can just stop if everyone decides to quit the bickering and digs. Its one thing to put out some digs to a buddy in a friendly fashion. This isn't friendly.

Agreed. There is a long history and a lot of bad blood. I'll admit I do like the trash talking, as long as it is not personal. It is just too ugly here from all sides.

I mentioned early on in this thread that the performance of the heads and combinations should do the talking. They now have a voice and more credibility than ever. Let them talk and if you do need to speak up handle it the way Dick and Robin do.

[65nss4spdGTO]

Originally Posted by 65nss4spdGTO

I'm asking you to tell me who switched from CVs and went FASTER AFTER.

Calvin Hill
Hill Performance
708-250-7420

Unfotunately it is posts like yours that has created the issue. You started stating all these guys who left CV-1s. I asked you to post the ETs after if they were faster. P Dude is the only one I know and it didn't surprise me for his application. But his E headed combo or even yours has nothing's for Mike McCartys street car with CV-1 heads. I walked by it at Norwalk and it has 9.60's on the window going round after round.

So I will ask you one more time to back up your comments about the guys who switched from CV-1s and went faster with other heads.

Calvin Hill
Hill Performance
708-250-7420

[TimeWarp]

Originally Posted by 69Goat1

I don't know of anyone personally who has gone faster with CV heads than they were before... TTBill is the guy you should ask on that because he is the one who is always typing that in. The few I have seen use them didn't go any faster if they even went as fast. Last guy I knew of was a roots blown deal in Tulsa by a guy named Bill who quit his CV program, sold his car and bought a Harley... I lined up with him in his firebird and ran off and left him Motor to blower....

And I'm sure he wasn't happy. lol But there are plenty of people out there who think they know how to build a car, but really don't. Am I an expert? No. But maybe I have a little more experience than some. If someone thinks they can bolt a set of heads on their car, or bolt a blower on and go faster than everyone else...

...well, it may or may not happen.

Can't tell you how many times I've seen people with engine combos that should have gone faster but didn't. Usually through mismatched parts or poor tuning. Heck, I've even bought a couple of those cars from very disappointed people. Sometimes you can get a good deal from someone elses lack of knowledge.

--------------------------------------------------------

The other thing is it sounds like you don't know ANYONE personally who ran CV-1 heads. Other than racing one guy who you apparently didn't know it places you in the same group as the rest of us. In other words watching and listening here. Because I'll be honest...I think if Dick Fulton's car were set up for a big blower it would be even nastier than it is

[pontibeast]

69Goat1 I need to find your machine shop guy. $300 for ports that make that kind of power makes me pissed. I live out in the woods and my head guy down in the sticks of NC hit me for 500 to port my 6X-8 heads to 260/220. Sounds like I need to come out to OK and visit some friends I have there. I was all happy about my iron heads and you had to come along and ruin it for me. Nice looking car BTW, that thing looks evil.

[TimeWarp]

My fear with $300 porting is that you sometimes get what you pay for. lol I'd rather stick with someone like Dave at SD Perf or Bill. lol Hard to beat a CNC job that has proven itself before.

$300 could leave you with rather large paper weights.

[69Goat1]

Originally Posted by TimeWarp

My fear with $300 porting is that you sometimes get what you pay for. lol I'd rather stick with someone like Dave at SD Perf or Bill. lol Hard to beat a CNC job that has proven itself before.

$300 could leave you with rather large paper weights.

Or with 9.70's at 3400 lbs at 462 ci...

[69Goat1]

Originally Posted by 69Goat1

I don't have any of the CV-1 heads but I have followed what is going on with them from the beginning.

1. Pontiac Dude kept telling us they were the best thing since sliced bread only to later recant all of that and switch combo's...

2. Mystic - Used to tell us they were the best thing since a pocket on a T-shirt to later recant all of that and switch combo's.

3. S/st was a vehement supporter of the CV program and mentioned how great they were only to completely switch engine camps and recant his support of the product.

4. Rusty4cyl - Huge supporter of the CV-1 camp who recanted and switched to a different head combo.

5. goatracer - fast Nitrous Mustang guy no longer runs the CV head and may have switched engine camps as well - not sure without digging...

6. Dino - was going to beat everyone with his CV combo but got so aggravated that he sold out and bought a boat (you can have a boat and a car too)...

Who all have I missed?

I am wondering who will be the next Ex CV guy who is now posting on this thread about how great they are that will change his combo up and pretend like he never said the stuff he did later?

Some guys never had a set but are huge Cheeleaders...ome have a set but haven't gotten them running so I am going to throw them in Cheerleader camp too...

I never post about how great any head is unless I have personal experience ie on my own car...I had high hopes for Edelbrocks Pro Port to come out as an actual buy it now race head that could be bought in assembled form or bare but completed to the point you could buy your own head components and put it together the way you liked but we all know that didn't happen.

All I have ever run is either iron heads or Edelbrock Performer RPM heads and I can tell you even though they are a huge pile of chit to some they will sure put a smile on your face. I have a set of 1st gen Edelbrock 87cc heads on my 8-71 blown street car with the multiple length head bolts and I am having 0 oil issues and have no modifications done for that. I have no performance numbers but in NA form without the adder I could drive it 65 miles to the track on pump 91 and turn 10.60's at 3850 lbs and drive home...never run hot...gas at most any gas station. With the blower the engine has a bunch more of everything and I didn't even change the cam...

My other set flow 314 cfm and are 72cc. I had them ported by a chebby guy in a wheel chair for $300 and then took them and had them flowed. The flow bench operator said they were the quietest head he had ever flowed. I put them on my 462 for my 3400 lb "tagged small tire race car" and ran 9.90's at around 139 MPH until the stock block/crank gave it up in April 2013 on the Highway 1 mile from my house (Block took out crank).

I am looking to step it up with an aftermarket block because I have been out of the racing for a few years now. I have thought Hi Ports from KRE but I have outrun a bunch of those with my E's in similar config. I like the Tiger head but probably won't use it, I really like the DCI RAV and that may be the ticket if I can get a quality header that fit's my chassis. Won't consider the CV-1 because too many have jumped ship even though according to reports "every single person who has ever used them has picked up"...I know If I pick up I don't jump ship that quick...

What will actually probably actually happen for me is either my E-heads will be sent to SD performance for more port work or I will just step up to a Wide Port E because I have a bunch of experience with the E-heads and I have never have had an issue with quality or performance on them...

Originally Posted by 65nss4spdGTO

Unfotunately it is posts like yours that has created the issue. You started stating all these guys who left CV-1s. I asked you to post the ETs after if they were faster. P Dude is the only one I know and it didn't surprise me for his application. But his E headed combo or even yours has nothing's for Mike McCartys street car with CV-1 heads. I walked by it at Norwalk and it has 9.60's on the window going round after round.

So I will ask you one more time to back up your comments about the guys who switched from CV-1s and went faster with other heads.

Calvin Hill
Hill Performance
708-250-7420

I put my original post above... Please put your reading comprehension hat on and try it again...

Weight and CI of Mikes car would be appreciated as well...

[69Goat1]

Originally Posted by pontibeast

69Goat1 I need to find your machine shop guy. $300 for ports that make that kind of power makes me pissed. I live out in the woods and my head guy down in the sticks of NC hit me for 500 to port my 6X-8 heads to 260/220. Sounds like I need to come out to OK and visit some friends I have there. I was all happy about my iron heads and you had to come along and ruin it for me. Nice looking car BTW, that thing looks evil.

Thanks...

The guy is not a machine shop guy. He is a disabled guy in a wheelchair that grinds on heads in his single car garage at his house. He mostly does stuff for himself only but occasionally he will grind a set of heads for a roundy round car... My Pontiac heads were the first he ever touched...

[Brandn74]

I have watched this for a while now and to say the least its sad man sad.The ones that are most vocal about this head being a dud are the same ones coming up short on the track.Out of all the people that purchased these heads from Jim how many of yall can say you had a bad experience with him?He is one of the most helpful people you can meet.Built me a pair of heads and met me on a Saturday to pick them up not knowing if I was serious or not.How can anyone have a dislike for this dude other than because he want dance to your music.I can't fathom why this guy is getting such a bad wrap.Maybe he wouldn't give free parts who knows.Bill has been a big help on explaining about not just Pontiac but other heads from different makes.Why continue with the constant trove of bs when clearly none of you guys that are going on and on intend on buying these heads.Let the ones who purchased them (like myself) have a shot at making some power without all the opinionated bs.If Robin Roberts came to Norwalk from the desert and couldn't get a race then this whole argument of which is better is dead cause NOBODY has proven them wrong yet.Dick Fulton was at Norwalk this year and still no attempt to discredit the claims of Jim or Bill.I wonder why?From where I sit the cv1 is on top and if you think otherwise step up and get beside one of them at the track so everybody can see who has a better car at the track not the dyno room.If you make 1100-1200 on the dyno but get to the track and cant beat most sbc's then you might want to look at yourself not Roland Racing or Bill Anderson.Jim you and Bill keep doing what you are doing and the truth will come out it already has begun to.

[mjm421]

Originally Posted by Hooter

I can say that Jim has more than been fair and more than once bent over backwards with regard to customer service for me. I have no complaints with him or Bill whatsoever.

Same with me Brad. I have had nothing but good dealings with Jim. Lot's of good conversations with Bill too. I love my CV's. Absolutely nothing bad to report after almost 6 years of street driving and at least a couple trips down the track. If I were to sell my car, my next build would certainly have them on it again.

[PAUL K]

Originally Posted by pontibeast

69Goat1 I need to find your machine shop guy. $300 for ports that make that kind of power makes me pissed. I live out in the woods and my head guy down in the sticks of NC hit me for 500 to port my 6X-8 heads to 260/220. Sounds like I need to come out to OK and visit some friends I have there. I was all happy about my iron heads and you had to come along and ruin it for me. Nice looking car BTW, that thing looks evil.

$500 for those numbers isn't bad. I've done several port jobs for $700 that produced over 1700 horsepower. You just have to find the right knowledgeable guy that doesn't want to own two homes and a swimming pool.

[Anderson Port Development]

Originally Posted by 65nss4spdGTO

Unfotunately it is posts like yours that has created the issue. You started stating all these guys who left CV-1s. I asked you to post the ETs after if they were faster. P Dude is the only one I know and it didn't surprise me for his application. But his E headed combo or even yours has nothing's for Mike McCartys street car with CV-1 heads. I walked by it at Norwalk and it has 9.60's on the window going round after round.

So I will ask you one more time to back up your comments about the guys who switched from CV-1s and went faster with other heads.

Calvin Hill
Hill Performance
708-250-7420

... BAMMMM !!!!!!