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#1
11-06-2018, 03:21 PM
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How to start eating this elephant
So my much neglected 68 is starting to weigh on my mind as my daughter is off to college and my son is of an age to want to help.
It's been sitting for 25 years, and to say it will need a lot of work is a bit of an understatement. However a question I've been mulling over is the best way to get things started. See I am 99% sure it has a slightly bent frame from before I owned it. Being a young man and inexperienced when I acquired the car I didn't really consider that, nor why it would matter. But with the way the body panels fit on the passenger side, it's pretty clear. So at this point it will take quite a bit of work to get the suspension and running gear in "moving under its own power" shape. Not insurmountable, but significant. My question is: Do I spend the time to get it moving under its own power or do I get it into a frame shop and get that corrected first? Additional questions: Do I need to strip off the front clip before I take it to the frame shop? Am I looking at hundreds of dollars? Thousands of dollars? "If you have to ask you can't afford it"? |
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#2
11-06-2018, 03:46 PM
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Job one is to find out if it's actually bent. Bad body panel fit could just mean someone didn't take the time to fit them correctly, used repop parts, core support is bent etc.
Usually there will be visual evidence if the frame is bent ... the frame horn on the (assuming front collision) passenger side should show signs of damage, rarely will the frame get bent without considerable tweaking of that front horn where the bumper connects. You can look for a crease in the frame where it goes from the control arm mounts to the first body bushing under the firewall. Maybe do some measurements based off the data in the Service Manual. If you are going to be taking off the front sheet metal anyway ... then take it off before it goes to a frame shop. Also .... there are instances where frames can be bent back without going to a shop ... depends on the bend and how well you are equipped at home. Minor frame misalignment can be compensated for with creative front end alignment. Also .... you need to first decide what your goal is with the car ... total restoration? Building a driver, a beater, just want to get it on the road etc. If it's a total restoration and you'll have the body off the frame anyway ... wait till then before it goes to the frame shop. No matter what the shop charges, it's going to be less if they don't have to remove and install any parts to do their job. I have no idea what the going rate is these days. I remember my first GTO, wrecked it in high school, father was P.O., said the frame was bent, sold it (a 66 still in his name). I had just put a new paint job on it .... two weeks later I see someone else driving it after they had obviously straightened the frame. |
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#3
11-06-2018, 04:18 PM
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People who stay under budget in this game are basically unicorns. So whatever you think it’s going to cost you, plan for more.
That said, the best way to start it just to start. Anything. Send the seats to the upholstery shop, paint the firewall, change the spark plugs. Whatever. Just do something as often as possible. The longer you contemplate it while taking no action, the more daunting it will seem.
__________________
1967 Firebird 462 580hp/590ftlbs 1962 Pontiac Catalina Safari Swapped in Turd of an Olds 455 Owner/Creator Catfish Motorsports https://www.youtube.com/@CatfishMotorsports |
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#4
11-06-2018, 05:32 PM
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Good advice ... every time I go down to the shop just to make myself do something, anything ... I usually end up getting a lot more done than I thought I would.
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#5
11-06-2018, 05:35 PM
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My thoughts on this is if the car need restoration work anyway pull the frame out.
You have the opportunity to measure it easily. Straitened if needed. Then blast and paint it. Change the bushing brakes and lines if needed and stick the car back on it. Start with a good foundation. Its all fairly easy work and if you have your son to help you even better. You won't have to spend as much time crawling under it either. Frame straightening is usually a cost per hour. You can do a lot of the grunt work of measuring it out yourself before taking it there so it shouldn't cost any horrible amount. |
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#6
11-06-2018, 05:40 PM
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The frame is definitely bent. Before I got it, it was hit hard on the right-front corner. The passenger door had to be "adjusted" by the body shop to the point it doesn't latch correctly, but it doesn't rub on the fender. Also the sway bar will destroy the passenger side bushings in less than a two months of regular driving (happened multiple times). At 17 and 18 you don't recognize these things as big warning signs, but now I realize it was trying to tell me something.
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#7
11-06-2018, 06:13 PM
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Frame first but be careful. set a budget. My frame off began with a rusted fuel line. Now I have a fully restored Lux Lemans. If it was a GTO I wouldn't be so far under water.20k so far without paint. But I didn't do it to make money either...
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72 Luxury Lemans nicely optioned 
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#8
11-06-2018, 06:25 PM
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I see in your profile you’re from NE. If the frame is too damaged to repair private message me. I know where there’s a ‘68 GTO frame in the Kansas City area. Don’t know it’s condition, it’s still under the parts car. Bob
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#9
11-06-2018, 06:44 PM
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Personally, I would get it running and moving. That would be a small victory for me, and whatever frame shop you take it to will appreciate not having to push it all the time.
__________________
 be a simple...kinda man.
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#10
11-06-2018, 06:52 PM
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I agree with getting it running and driving. Then decide what the cars ultimate fate is. You could go with a roadkill vibe as you work on it.
If it’s already a challenge to work on it I don’t think pulling the frame out is going to motivate you any more unless the end goal is a long term restoration project. I would think more along the lines of base hits rather a home run. |
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#11
11-07-2018, 09:41 AM
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Quote:
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Clutch Guys Matter _______________________________________ 53 Studebaker, 400P/th400/9" 64 F-85 72 4-4-2 Mondello's VO Twister II 84 Hurst/Olds #2449 87 Cutlass Salon 54 Olds 88 sedan |
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#12
11-07-2018, 10:44 PM
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When you find a frame shop, ask then if you need to remove the front end sheet metal and proceed from there and good luck!
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#13
11-07-2018, 11:56 PM
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I like to divide my elephants into bite sized servings. In other words, look at the car as a bunch of small projects. Each time you identify the project you are working on....say, the front suspension....Print out a list with every task needed to finish that front suspension project. Check the items off as you finish them.
That way, you can actually see your progress. Also, you can choose to do one, single thing on that list or several. Almost every time you choose to do one thing, you'll wind up doing several.
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Greg Reid Palmetto, Georgia |
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#14
11-08-2018, 08:31 AM
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Unless there is great sentimental attachment, and a love for working on said elephant, I'm more apt to trade for an elephant that needs a lot less.. I've done both extremes The satisfaction I gained from managing a dozen restorations wore off quicky, but thats me.
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#15
11-08-2018, 09:12 AM
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Quote:
On the FB groups I see all the time someone says "Look at my new project! Cant wait to get started!" And its a $350 car they pulled out of the field, with no drivetrain, no interior, and rust on every single panel. Which, don't get me wrong, you can fix all that. But If I could walk to the sportsbook and say "I want to be $1000 even money that that guy never achieves his goals with that car" I would do it everytime. The OPs car doesn't sound THAT bad, but I learned my lesson. I brought one back from the dead. I'm good, all my other projects I have tried to start with a better canvas.
__________________
1967 Firebird 462 580hp/590ftlbs 1962 Pontiac Catalina Safari Swapped in Turd of an Olds 455 Owner/Creator Catfish Motorsports https://www.youtube.com/@CatfishMotorsports |
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#16
11-08-2018, 04:46 PM
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Thanks for the replies. I think the right thing to do is just start working on the suspension. Unlike in years gone by I have a close (< 1/4 mile) autoparts store that will provide me with the specialty tools to do the job and there's Youtube for videos to show me the way.
As far as doing a different car goes, well anything in my price range wouldn't be a GTO, and while this one is in sad shape I also know what it needs whereas a different car would just be a different set of issues that I'd have to find out. Plus the boy has some idea of wanting to work on it. Found a local shop that said $160 to clean the radiator, another wanted $700 to recore it. I think he is under the impression I'm doing a concourse restoration for a RA II or something. |
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#17
11-08-2018, 06:12 PM
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Quote:
By that time he will have the tanks off anyway so you are going to have to stump up the $700 (maybe even more because you are not dealing with the original guy who quoted), or you will wind up with a radiator core and separate tanks and a bill for his work anyway. Even with the most careful budgeting, there are very few shortcuts in recommissioning a car that's been static for 25 years. Money just keeps running through your fingers once you start on these projects. Ian 
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To laugh at men of sense is the privilege of fools. |
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#18
11-08-2018, 06:29 PM
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Don't worry too much, at this point it's just talk on the phone. Before I make a decision I'll show the radiator guy the actual radiator and he can tell me what the prognosis is.
I'm willing to just buy a cheap one to get it started and replace it when it's time to have one that's suitable for operation. Quote:
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#19
11-08-2018, 07:27 PM
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Quote:
Its more rust and incompleteness that kills people. If your car is at least mostly there that is a big head start.
__________________
1967 Firebird 462 580hp/590ftlbs 1962 Pontiac Catalina Safari Swapped in Turd of an Olds 455 Owner/Creator Catfish Motorsports https://www.youtube.com/@CatfishMotorsports Last edited by RocktimusPryme; 11-08-2018 at 07:41 PM. |
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#20
11-08-2018, 07:38 PM
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Been there, done that, got the PTSD to prove it. ;-)
Car is actually complete, just needs stuff replaced. I drove it for about 4 years in college (80's - 90's) and just decided that it was too risky to have as a daily driver. So it got parked but there are no parts missing from when it was being driven. Quote:
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