[tom s]

Mike,as I have said the early carbs are 1/2 in taller than the big top carbs so your giving up 1/2 in using them.There are no spacers under my carbs.John has a point about the 69 TA air screens.I found those ACs on ebay under marine.My body shop guy took my ACs yesterday to cut 1/2 in off the front and 1/4in off the back.As said,no spacers under the carbs.I think a 63 car has more room than the 62 as I remember running one on it with the TA screens.Tom

[61-63]

I'm going to put a big mouth top on my set, the TA air screens, and tig weld a stainless steel wire form to fit under them and put K&N filter fabric between the screens and wire forms to serve as a filter element. The screens provide no real filter function as you can tell by looking down into the carbs in this picture.

[tom s]

Pics of SD carbs and SD ACs in relationship to my ACs with 1/2 and 1/4 inch cut off.Could not find my TA screen to compare.Tom

[tom s]

well that sucks,1in and 1 1/4 diff.Tom

[mgarblik]

So I guess the question still is : will the bathtub intake fit under a flat hooded 62 full size with the SD air cleaners or any known air cleaner? Crumpled tin foil test? Thanks

[61-63]

This bathtub and car belonged to John Chonacas. The car is a '63 Catalina and the hood had one of the Ford truck scoops on it. John had a pair of the sd Corvette air cleaners on the carbs that had had the small openings cut off and larger diameter openings bonded to the air cleaners with the panel bonding compound, so the air cleaners would mount on the big top air horns. When John closed the hood on the set the hole cut in the hood for the scoop caught under the top fin of the front air cleaner. He couldn't figure out a way to get the air cleaner unstuck and ended up destroying that air cleaner in the process of getting the hood back open. You will notice spacers under the carbs. Had those not been there would the setup have fit? Or had the hole for the scoop been cut just a tad forward would the front air cleaner
have cleared? DK to both questions. We do know that the TA screens clear because several cars have them. I have a number of pictures of '63 Tempest and LeMans cars with bathtubs that have the screens on them so we know they also fit. DK on the sd air cleaners though.

[tom s]

The ACs I have and had cut down a little fit under my stock 62 hood with the 5 in top AFBs.No way SD ACs will fit on the4in top carbs.I doubt even if you cut 1/2 inch off the intake top.I have done all the tests.Tom

[tom s]

And yes I have done many tin foil tests!Tom

[mgarblik]

OK, That is the information I needed. Looks like I need to find a nice 62 hood and a metal hood scoop if I want to run this intake. Huge extra expense, may be a show stopper. Damn.

[Region Warrior]

Those filters got to be most restrictive ever seen. Worse then 3x2s.
Has to really f up air flow.
I would make a large bottom pan to fit over both carbs and use larger diameter filters.
Just say'n...

[tom s]

The ones I put on are no more restrictive than the SD ACs.IMO the TA screens could be the answer.Remember this was a RACE intake!I have been running one on my 421 SD tempest for 22 years now with custom made velocity stacks with just screens on them!Only good for keeping rocks and kids out of the engine.Where there is a will there is a way as I have found.I can get 1/2 inch more room by milling the top.Also these intakes did not use the 625 cars with the factory SD air cleaners.They ran a pair of 750 NASCAR AFBs with NO ACs.I have my intakes and it makes no diff to me if I go forward with the project! Tom

[4zpeed]

Originally Posted by tom s

The ones I put on are no more restrictive than the SD ACs.IMO the TA screens could be the answer.

Like to see a pic of those if you can find them, or the ones John said he was going to make.

Remember this was a RACE intake!I have been running one on my 421 SD tempest for 22 years now with custom made velocity stacks with just screens on them!Only good for keeping rocks and kids out of the engine.

Lmao, those lil rascals get into everything. I liked the stacks, I thought they looked great.

Where there is a will there is a way as I have found.I can get 1/2 inch more room by milling the top.Also these intakes did not use the 625 cars with the factory SD air cleaners.They ran a pair of 750 NASCAR AFBs with NO ACs.

Plenty of will here. I know you wanted to use the SD AC's, as mentioned it is still possible.

I have my intakes and it makes no diff to me if I go forward with the project! Tom

Does to me, , thanks for the update and info, very much appreciate your efforts Tom.





Frank

[Jim Robertson]

Tom has asked me to give my thoughts on the intake overall including port dimensions. First off thank you Tom for taking this on...yet another cool project funded and managed by Mr. Schlauch. Past dyno tests has shown this manifold to be a very capable design for excellent hp and torque production at reasonable rpms. The casting/wall thickness of the intake ports will allow significant increases in height and width throughout the entire port length. We measured a thickness of nearly 1” at the port floor near the plenum. Yes the intake is heavy but offers a lot of performance...and it has the “look.”
On the carb fitment subject: I did set 2 - 4160 holley carbs end to end on the manifold top. I will post a pic but there is a possibility that those carbs could be fitted with significant mods or a new fabricated top. 2 - 4150s mounted sideways would likely require a new top but appears to be a possibility also. Honored to be a small part of this very special project. Pontiac’ers have an unique opportunity with this offering. I plan to get one.

[4zpeed]

Originally Posted by Jim Robertson

Tom has asked me to give my thoughts on the intake overall including port dimensions. First off thank you Tom for taking this on...yet another cool project funded and managed by Mr. Schlauch. Past dyno tests has shown this manifold to be a very capable design for excellent hp and torque production at reasonable rpms. The casting/wall thickness of the intake ports will allow significant increases in height and width throughout the entire port length. We measured a thickness of nearly 1” at the port floor near the plenum. Yes the intake is heavy but offers a lot of performance...and it has the “look.”
On the carb fitment subject: I did set 2 - 4160 holley carbs end to end on the manifold top. I will post a pic but there is a possibility that those carbs could be fitted with significant mods or a new fabricated top. 2 - 4150s mounted sideways would likely require a new top but appears to be a possibility also. Honored to be a small part of this very special project. Pontiac’ers have an unique opportunity with this offering. I plan to get one.

Thank you very much for your comments Jim, I too am very grateful to Tom for providing us the opportunity to have such a special piece of Pontiac history.

Things like this don't present themselves very often for obvious reasons, it takes money and dedication not to mention skill and knowledgeable people like yourself.

From everyone that will benefit from this intake, including myself, I'd like to thank you for your efforts and involvement as well as everyone else that's taken part.



Frank

[65CatCoupe]

Hey Jim thanks for sharing you knowledge and there is no doubt this manifold is way cool and would be a great race piece. Do you happen to have a experience with it coupled to the more street oriented 455/RAIV type combo? I'm guessing that being single plane with very short runners its not great out of the hole.

[tom s]

Guys!I have been driving a bathtub on the street for 22 years!This one is on a 434 with a 068 cam and drives virtually the same as the 859 2-4 I took off the engine.Im driving off the front 2 bbl of the rear carb.Only thing I have noticed is it takes a little longer to get warmed up.Never had to use a choke on the 859,not sure if I will hook up the choke on the rear carb.Im going to put a 100 or so miles on the engine this weekend and report back.If ANYONE happens to be in the so Cal area they are VERY welcome the drive the car.Again,Jim Reduced the port outlet to STOCK pass car head opening and leaves a lot of room to port match to RA IV or larger.Tom

[61-63]

65CatCoupe your question has asked before and there are answers to it in other bathtub threads. But to answer it again as far as I have knowledge of it I did a pair of big mouth clone SD NASCAR carbs ten years ago for a fellow named Tom Karpendo from Fargo North Dakota and he dynoed those carbs on his engine with both a bathtub intake and then an 859 inline sd dual quad intake. The bathtub produced slightly more horsepower than the 859, less that 10 hp and we're talking more than 500 hp with both intakes. However the bathtub really flattened out the torque curve. I don't remember the numbers exactly but peak torque occurred quicker and it stayed there for far longer than with the 859, There is another fellow on these forums who is a friend of Tom Karpenko who remembers the specifics and perhaps he will chime in.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Originally Posted by tom s

Where there is a will there is a way as I have found.I can get 1/2 inch more room by milling the top. Tom

Could you just put a filter only - right on the airhorn , with no base.
Maybe a strategic notch or recess in a place or two if needed in the filter.
Then an AC lid on top of it.

just tossing another coin in the wishing well

[tom s]

Im done with it,Have figured out what works and will leave it up to other on how to make it work with their application.I know there is no way with small top AFBs and SD ACs under a 62 hood.Im REAL sure it will work with 69 TA RA screens which will be what I go to.I ran them on my 63 big car.I wish the guy that made my velocity stacks with the screens was still alive.Will post a pic of them.Tom

[wbnapier]

3D Print your custom velocity stacks. Tack screens to them.

You're on a roll with this 3D printing, might as well go all the way.