2004 GTO Sighting

[GTO_2004]

Don't get too close, it may bite.


[This message was edited by GTO_2004 on January 22, 2004 at 01:37 AM.]

[Nickv]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Thirdgen455:
I bet if Chevy would have got this car with only a mild change of the front end, and a 350HP engine and we didn't. us Pontiac guys would be bitching WHY DIDN'T WE get one of those<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

The thing is that the Monaro is sold in the Middle East as the Chevy Lumina SS. With chevy badging.

"Everyone is entitled to be stupid sometimes, but you're abusing that privilege"

[ctgross]

That's the first picture I've seen that I really like!

That carpet is really cool

Didn't know they shipped any to Iraq.

CT Gross
------------------------------------------

"It's never too late to have a happy childhood"!

66 Blue GTO
http://community.webtv.net/ctgross/GTO

[HUMBLER]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by ctgross:
That's the first picture I've seen that I really like!

That carpet is really cool

Didn't know they shipped any to Iraq.

CT Gross
------------------------------------------

_"It's never too late to have a happy childhood"!_
http://kurtsplates.homestead.com/files/ctgross.jpg
_66 Blue GTO_
http://community.webtv.net/ctgross/GTO
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>



"the Humbler...the Humbler...G...T...O!"

[Nickv]

GM does not sell any cars to Iraq. Not yet anyways.

They sell to the following Middle Eastern countries.

Bahrain
Egypt
Israel
Jordon
Kuwait
Lebanon
Oman
Qatar
Saudia Arabia
Syria
United Arab Emirates (UAE)
Yemen

http://www.gmarabia.com/content_data...mina_coupe.htm

Chevy Lumina SS Coupe

"Everyone is entitled to be stupid sometimes, but you're abusing that privilege"

[Goathead]

I wonder if thats because they won't buy them in the states...



http://www.dannys65gto.com

http://kurtspontiac.homestead.com/dannys65gto.html

[Brad B. Hillebrand]

Sorry, lame engine for the money. Lame looks too. Nothing special still guys that a nice cheap 4.6 DOHC 32V Mustang or Lincoln Mark VIII engine won't produce, old chevy or pontiac. Nothing special that an old junk yard engine can't compete with. Sure, go spend 30K or whatever and watch the value of this car decline BIG TIME. Don't get me wrong, love the GTO but this one is a looser......

Brad

"It's the last thing I'll ever say, I promise"

[disc0monkey]

please dont call it a goat

[Brad B. Hillebrand]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Thirdgen455:
I bet if Chevy would have got this car with only a mild change of the front end, and a 350HP engine and we didn't. us Pontiac guys would be bitching WHY DIDN'T WE get one of those<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

You might get your wish! The Chevelle is comming back!!! Same kinda gimick car I would think. Can't wait to see how POS that thing will be and what doner car they will use. Once again, they will ruin a GREAT name plate. Maybe the Corsica will some back with cowl induction and a big SS on the fender powered by a big ricer 2.1 turbo. Corsica, I mean Chevelle SS.

What's next?

Brad

"It's the last thing I'll ever say, I promise"

[GTO_2004]

so much dumbness...

Australian RWD + American V8 - Now THAT'S what I call a "coalition".

[Mr_GTO]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Brad B. Hilleband:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Thirdgen455:
I bet if Chevy would have got this car with only a mild change of the front end, and a 350HP engine and we didn't. us Pontiac guys would be bitching WHY DIDN'T WE get one of those<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

You might get your wish! The Chevelle is comming back!!! Same kinda gimick car I would think. Can't wait to see how POS that thing will be and what doner car they will use. Once again, they will ruin a GREAT name plate. Maybe the Corsica will some back with cowl induction and a big SS on the fender powered by a big ricer 2.1 turbo. Corsica, I mean Chevelle SS.

What's next?

Brad

"It's the last thing I'll ever say, I promise"<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


Go ahead and tell us what YOU want. And it has to be within reason, no pontiac engines, etc. It has to be in the realm of reality. And if you don't know anything about how a car is produced, it will show. So lets hear it.

[Nickv]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by disc0monkey:
please dont call it a goat<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


I don't know it says GTO on it.

"Everyone is entitled to be stupid sometimes, but you're abusing that privilege"

[Brad B. Hillebrand]

That's a very simple answer.

Originality and out of the box design and thinking.

This means NOT taking same old production stampings, adding a new interior a slapping a name plate on it and attempting to pass it off as something "new", "reto" or "muscle of yesterday".

We have many good examples of this type of thinking today from Chrysler. Cars like the Crossfire, Viper, Prowler and PT cruiser are all original designs and make a statement. One drives by and your head turns. That's the design I'm talking about.

The new “GTO” will drive by and NOBODY will notice it, it looks like every other mid size car, be it GP or Grand AM. People won’t notice unless it’s yellow. The original GTO stood out and people took notice. Why? Original design and out of the box thinking.

GM does have the retro pickup, pretty cool. Too bad they didn't make that investment in the new GTO.

Ford did it right with the GT40. Same design, tons of modern features and enhanced engine designs. Big price tag that keeps the value high for the original GT40.

The new GTO is a marketing gimmick, hyped by a great nameplate. It has no merit or right to wear the GTO name.

Why? Because it’s a disgrace to the real GTO and what it stood for.


Brad

"It's the last thing I'll ever say, I promise"

[Nickv]

Originality like a pickup truck that looks like a 50's model, or the GT40 which is real original in it's design, or the new Mustang which is REALLY out of the box thinking isn't it?

Chrysler is the only one right now that I may agree with you on their unique styling cues.

But the 2004 GTO still fits the criteria of what a muscle car is.

My guess is that most hate it, not because Pontiac reused the nameplate, but because it's imported from Austrial and Pontiac did not build it. If this car was exactly how it is now, but was in fact built and designed by Pontiac would your opinion be the same? I suggest to you that it would not.

"Everyone is entitled to be stupid sometimes, but you're abusing that privilege"

[Mr_GTO]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Brad B. Hilleband:
That's a very simple answer.

Originality and out of the box design and thinking.

This means NOT taking same old production stampings, adding a new interior a slapping a name plate on it and attempting to pass it off as something "new", "reto" or "muscle of yesterday".

We have many good examples of this type of thinking today from Chrysler. Cars like the Crossfire, Viper, Prowler and PT cruiser are all original designs and make a statement. One drives by and your head turns. That's the design I'm talking about.

The new “GTO” will drive by and NOBODY will notice it, it looks like every other mid size car, be it GP or Grand AM. People won’t notice unless it’s yellow. The original GTO stood out and people took notice. Why? Original design and out of the box thinking.

GM does have the retro pickup, pretty cool. Too bad they didn't make that investment in the new GTO.

Ford did it right with the GT40. Same design, tons of modern features and enhanced engine designs. Big price tag that keeps the value high for the original GT40.

The new GTO is a marketing gimmick, hyped by a great nameplate. It has no merit or right to wear the GTO name.

Why? Because it’s a disgrace to the real GTO and what it stood for.


Brad

"It's the last thing I'll ever say, I promise"<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Take a look at Caddy and Pontiacs that are all new in the next year or so. That is where GM is heading. Lutz came in in 2001. Now the fruits of his labor are starting to show. GM had no other RWD coups than Corvette. Had they waited, they loose a ton of market shart to other companies. GTO fills the void until a US designed and built car can take up the void.

As far as the other cars: Crossfire;good styling, slow and underpowered and basically a MB. Viper and Prowler were both by Lutz and are low volumn cars. Prowler is now gone. PT sold real well intially, now they langish on lots.

Styling is bland with the GTO. But so was the old GTO. Unless you KNEW what you were looking for, you couldn't tell if it was a GTO a Cutlass a chvelle a GS or Tempest, etc. Companies coppied each other. It was evident then, it is evident now.

SSR was in development before Lutz came on board.

GT Ford is all retro and it does it well, but it too is LOW LOW volumn car. You may NEVER see on on the road.

GTO fits the bill. It is a 2+2 coupe, 300+RWHP and it handles to boot. Unlike the original. But as with most complaints, I do think that GM will design a more retro GTO to be built in 2007 off the SIGMA chasis that the caddy CTS/SRX use now. It might even have AWD someday.

But it does hold the small car big motor motiff that the original GTO had.

[Brad B. Hillebrand]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Nickv:
Originality like a pickup truck that looks like a 50's model, or the GT40 which is real original in it's design, or the new Mustang which is REALLY out of the box thinking isn't it?

Chrysler is the only one right now that I may agree with you on their unique styling cues.

But the 2004 GTO still fits the criteria of what a muscle car is.

My guess is that most hate it, not because Pontiac reused the nameplate, but because it's imported from Austrial and Pontiac did not build it. If this car was exactly how it is now, but was in fact built and designed by Pontiac would your opinion be the same? I suggest to you that it would not.

"Everyone is entitled to be stupid sometimes, but you're abusing that privilege"<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


The retro truck is an original design. Both modern and old, combined. The looks are fantastic and that truck should sell very well. The GT40 originality is in it's drive line re-engineering, not so much body style. Lots of speeds and power. A combination of new and old. The Chrysler products hande the situation on both ends, new design and drive line. In either case, they stand out and are noticed.

The new "GTO" offers neither. No significant engine by todays standard or body shape/style. In both areas it fails which is why so many people complain about it.

In any event, justt my 2 cents. Some people like it and some don't and that's the way it is with everything. Then again, I never heard anyone say they hate the GT40, reto truck, Viper or Prowler...

O.K, just my 2 cents again....

Brad

"It's the last thing I'll ever say, I promise"

[Mr_GTO]

Brad, the SSR is original, but it will have a hard time selling at $49K.

The LS1 isn't a significant engine by today standards? The LS6 which is just a head and cam change away makes 405hp, or 370 at the wheels, gets 29mpg and is a Low Emission Vehicle. You have no idea about that motor. NONE.

I have heard lots of complaints about the SSR. Not so much about the GT but you can't buy one unless you are loaded. THe Viper is the Viper, but for $30K less you can get just as much performance in the ZO6. The prowler is dead.

GTO, save for the fender flairs, resembles the M3 BMW. Same jelly bean shape.

[Brad B. Hillebrand]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Mr_GTO:
Brad, the SSR is original, but it will have a hard time selling at $49K.

The LS1 isn't a significant engine by today standards? The LS6 which is just a head and cam change away makes 405hp, or 370 at the wheels, gets 29mpg and is a Low Emission Vehicle. You have no idea about that motor. NONE.

I have heard lots of complaints about the SSR. Not so much about the GT but you can't buy one unless you are loaded. THe Viper is the Viper, but for $30K less you can get just as much performance in the ZO6. The prowler is dead.

GTO, save for the fender flairs, resembles the M3 BMW. Same jelly bean shape.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Take a look around at the cars you see on the street today, SUV's and Mini Vans driven by mom's cost 35-50K. The M5, RX300's etc... all are in the 40+ range. Hemi pickups, I see them a lot cost big bucks too. At this time money is cheap to loan and people are leasing cars that cost 40-50K everywhere. Heck, don't ask me why but they are. The SSR will sell, I mean lease.

People who lease these cars want to stand out, show that they have money and that they are different somehow compared to others. It's why they spend all that cash. All while by Goverment stats, personal debt has increased as well as bankruptcies. It's a 2 person income family now and the money and cost of things have doubled. Those cars that offer originality, be it big buck or not will and do lease.

The "GTO" if it was an original design could have sold for mega bucks and people would lease. Put in real power and design and there you go. The LS1 is not an LS6, 1 being less that 6 it means low end, just like it's performance. The new Judge option in discussion might apeal to some due to the raw power. Now that's sometings cool.


Brad

"It's the last thing I'll ever say, I promise"

[Mr_GTO]

I don't think the people with MONEY who are after a practical car, you cited minivans, suv's and the M5 which is a VERY expensive automobile, and the SSR is not in the same category. It is a niche vehicle. It does say look at me, nobody has one of these. That is why they are only makeing 10K a year, and yea, they will sell eventually. But as with the GTO, dealers are gouging.

LOL, the difference in the LS1 and LS6 is the heads flow slighty more and the cam is different. Did you see this months Road and Track? The CTS V(can you say 2007 GTO) with the LS6 ran a 13.4@109mph. 109! That is FLYING for a 3800lb 4dr car. Guys on LS1tech.com with ported LS1 heads and a cam are making 400hp at the WHEELS. Anyone with a LS1 can tell you that 300hp at the wheels even in a 3800lb car and it will go. GTO is going to be part of the GM Performance Group and you probably will see a Judge Version with a 6.0L LS2 400hp motor.

[ChiefIronHorse]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> New GTO = POS.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Opinions are like a$$holes, everybody has one. It's just that some of them are starting to stink up the place... right brad.


<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> They won't sell because they have nothing to offer: Lame engine, looks and a high price tag.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Okay brad, tell me a vehicle that has 350 Horse Power, 365 pounds of torque, LS1 engine with high quality interior priced under $34,000? Lame engine really shows your true color. You don't know too much about the LS1.. do you brad? Second of all who says there not selling? Just because dealerships have them in their show rooms doesn't mean their not selling. GOD some people are morons!

[QUOTE] ]"It's the last thing I'll ever say, I promise" [/QUOTE

Thank GOD! But in all fairness I did ask you a question so I'll allow you to answer it. After that..... SSHHHHHH!!!