#181  
Old 08-17-2019, 01:04 PM
Steve C. Steve C. is online now
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When I converted to fuel injection on my current 505 we used a Holley HP EFI Universal kit, p/n 550-500

https://www.holley.com/products/fuel.../parts/550-500

Holley p/n 522-488 48 lb/hr fuel injectors
Holley p/n 565-107 Dual Sync distributor

For the intake manifold we used a old style 4500 Victor intake that I had on hand. It was previously runner blended and port matched to my cylinder heads. We outsourced the intake to have bungs welded on for the fuel injectors and the FI rails mounted. In order to fit the 4150 style throttle body to the intake we used a Brodix HV300 4500 to 4150 carburetor adapter. However the adapter was modified, it was cut down and blended for a smooth transition into the intake plenum/runners. With the adapter modified and the shorter throttle body there was no reduction in hood clearance. I use a small diameter K&N air filter that fits up inside the shaker scoop molded onto my fiberglass hood.

The previous 4150 Victor intake with the carb pad milled 0.650" was not used for the FI project. Our dyno testing indicated by milling the intake it lost about 8-10 hp at peak power rpm. With it and my modified HP950 carb the engine made 660 hp at 5900/7000 rpm. No testing was done after the change to fuel injection but I suggest there was no significant loss in power.



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Last edited by Steve C.; 08-17-2019 at 01:12 PM.
  #182  
Old 08-23-2019, 02:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Steve C. View Post
When I converted to fuel injection on my current 505 we used a Holley HP EFI Universal kit, p/n 550-500

https://www.holley.com/products/fuel.../parts/550-500

Holley p/n 522-488 48 lb/hr fuel injectors
Holley p/n 565-107 Dual Sync distributor

For the intake manifold we used a old style 4500 Victor intake that I had on hand. It was previously runner blended and port matched to my cylinder heads. We outsourced the intake to have bungs welded on for the fuel injectors and the FI rails mounted. In order to fit the 4150 style throttle body to the intake we used a Brodix HV300 4500 to 4150 carburetor adapter. However the adapter was modified, it was cut down and blended for a smooth transition into the intake plenum/runners. With the adapter modified and the shorter throttle body there was no reduction in hood clearance. I use a small diameter K&N air filter that fits up inside the shaker scoop molded onto my fiberglass hood.

The previous 4150 Victor intake with the carb pad milled 0.650" was not used for the FI project. Our dyno testing indicated by milling the intake it lost about 8-10 hp at peak power rpm. With it and my modified HP950 carb the engine made 660 hp at 5900/7000 rpm. No testing was done after the change to fuel injection but I suggest there was no significant loss in power.


.
It would be interesting to see how an set up would react to the same intake both before and after milling and fuel injection all else equal.

I guess the test would need to be (and unlikely to ever happen)

Intake un-milled - CARB vs Fuel injected
Intake Milled - Carb vs Fuel injected.


I would think that the fuel injection set up would not be as finicky to the placement height of the throttle body vs a carburetor which operation is in direct relation to the air flow passing through it and the air+fuel within the intake.... The Carb will respond with changes in spacing however I dont believe a "throttle body" which only flows air is as responsive to the throttle body height as it is to velocity within the intake runners.

So I personally feel that a fuel injected engine can get away with a lower profile single plane intake manifold (and fit under lower hoods) than a Carb engine and make the same if not more power than a carb with ideal spacing that needs a taller hood to run.

I ended up going with the Northwind intake for its lower profile and EDL fuel rails... Hopefully it will work well.

And I could be way off on the mark as well...Ive been wrong on occasion.

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  #183  
Old 09-18-2019, 07:33 AM
Steve C. Steve C. is online now
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"I would think that the fuel injection set up would not be as finicky to the placement height of the throttle body vs a carburetor which operation is in direct relation to the air flow passing through it and the air+fuel within the intake.... The Carb will respond with changes in spacing however I dont believe a "throttle body" which only flows air is as responsive to the throttle body height as it is to velocity within the intake runners."

I had a discussion with the the fellow who did the work on my intake regarding the modification with the Brodix carburetor adapter. In short, he felt the same as your statement. It's air and not air/fuel mixture and the F.I. set up would be less sensitive to the impact.

Almost all my different engine combinations have been tested on a engine dyno but I've never had my car on a chassis dyno. I hope to do so soon with the current 505 and the now converted fuel injection set up. For interest, plus I want to know if my small air cleaner assy has a significant impact on the performance. My Trans Am does not have a functional shaker assembly. The car has the saftory shaker scoop molded to a fiberglass hood. The air cleaner assy sits up inside the scoop, thus I cannot go larger. What I have is a K&N filter that measures 2.875" high x 9" diameter, with their 9" dia X-Stream filter top. When I talked with K&N tech they stated those two items used together would flow approximately 710 CFM and suggested my 505 / 650 hp engine needs approximately 1100 CFM for operating at 6000 rpm where it made peak power on the engine dyno with the carb set up. I then asked at what lower RPM will the above 710 cfm be adequate for ? The answer, based on their calculations, a 505ci engine at 4000 RPM would require approximately 710 CFM. WHAT ! I'm having a HARD time understanding this and now want to test on the chassis dyno with and without the current air filter assy.

I'm curious how the K&N numbers differs so much based on my dyno sheet with the carb set up that indicates 866 scfm at the 6000 rpm. Then the formula below that suggests 867.9 cfm. Note, almost the same as my dyno sheet

( For the calculation I used 0.99 for the volumetric efficiency. However at 6000 rpm on my dyno sheet it indicated 106.9 VE)

6000 x 505 = 3030000
3030000 divided by 3456 = 876.73
876.73 times .99 = 867.9 cfm

https://itstillruns.com/calculate-en...e-6393767.html





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  #184  
Old 01-29-2020, 02:00 PM
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Bump, because we still dont have an efi section.

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  #185  
Old 01-29-2020, 02:15 PM
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I'm going to toss this post up.
Right now, I'm very happy to say Mr. Dick Boneske is working on the Rochester 2bbl carbs for our 65 Tripower 421 in the GTO.
He is, as he has for others before, modding the carbs for the hydraulic roller cam and other aspects of the build level of the engine. I have high expectations, that his work and advice will help me get the carbs set to where the car idles, cruises, and performs at the track up to its capabilities.
Ultimately as I posted before, if this doesn't get us where we need to be, then a 3x2 EFI system is the next and last step, and that is a very expensive solution.

  #186  
Old 02-08-2020, 10:56 PM
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8 years later and we still have no EFI Section.....what gives, Moderators???

  #187  
Old 02-08-2020, 10:57 PM
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Please create a EFI Section...PLEASE!!!

  #188  
Old 02-08-2020, 11:08 PM
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Quote:
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Please create a EFI Section...PLEASE!!!
You’re posting in it now, it’s included here in the Boost forum.

Simply start a thread to discuss any EFI topic of your choice.

  #189  
Old 02-08-2020, 11:27 PM
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Bart would it be possible to change the heading of the section to reflect that? That might help direct all posts of that nature to this one section if that's the long term answer.

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  #190  
Old 02-08-2020, 11:47 PM
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Bart would it be possible to change the heading of the section to reflect that? That might help direct all posts of that nature to this one section if that's the long term answer.
Mods canít create new sub forums or change the headings, only the forums admin has access. Send a request by PM to our forums admin eric_cspan and perhaps he can make the changes.

  #191  
Old 02-09-2020, 12:15 AM
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Will do. Maybe others can as well, if their interest inclines them to. Thanks

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  #192  
Old 02-09-2020, 12:09 PM
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Pm Sent to eric_cspan. Thank You, Bart.

Quote:
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Mods canít create new sub forums or change the headings, only the forums admin has access. Send a request by PM to our forums admin eric_cspan and perhaps he can make the changes.

  #193  
Old 02-09-2020, 03:36 PM
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Quote:
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Please create a EFI Section...PLEASE!!!
What is it you would like to discuss?

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  #194  
Old 02-09-2020, 05:33 PM
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I'd like to know if any of you are using a 3x2 EFI system. I am aware of 3 basically:
The FiTech, which is a direct bolt on for my MOPAR 6bbl intake, but would need Holley adapters to work on a Tripower intake.
The F&B direct port injection system, which at least doubles the cost of the FiTech
The Autotrend system, which I have seen in person, which looks almost identical to 3 Rochester 2bbl carbs, and from what the owners, who are "car show friends" say it works GREAT, but by the time fuel lines, pump, and all associated parts including the EFI system are added up is (EEK!) $8,000
SO....
What other 3x2 Pontiac EFI options are there?

  #195  
Old 02-09-2020, 06:43 PM
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E-Mail Sent.


Quote:
Originally Posted by wreckmastr View Post
What is it you would like to discuss?

  #196  
Old 02-12-2020, 09:03 PM
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I sent a PM to the admin, with no response so far. Did anyone get a response?

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  #197  
Old 02-12-2020, 09:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by avman View Post
I'd like to know if any of you are using a 3x2 EFI system. I am aware of 3 basically:
The FiTech, which is a direct bolt on for my MOPAR 6bbl intake, but would need Holley adapters to work on a Tripower intake.
The F&B direct port injection system, which at least doubles the cost of the FiTech
The Autotrend system, which I have seen in person, which looks almost identical to 3 Rochester 2bbl carbs, and from what the owners, who are "car show friends" say it works GREAT, but by the time fuel lines, pump, and all associated parts including the EFI system are added up is (EEK!) $8,000
SO....
What other 3x2 Pontiac EFI options are there?
I think you could build your own for much less. Especially if you're willing to mpfi and skip the three special throttle bodies to house injectors. You'll be fabricating instead of spending... But it could be done.

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  #198  
Old 02-13-2020, 03:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott65 View Post
I think you could build your own for much less. Especially if you're willing to mpfi and skip the three special throttle bodies to house injectors. You'll be fabricating instead of spending... But it could be done.
I'd love the time to "fabricate", even though it's not something I do, I think it could be therapeutic. Usually it's better for me to do what I do in my one man small business, and leave the fabrication to someone who does that every day.
Thanks for the reply.

  #199  
Old Yesterday, 04:21 PM
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Made a post in the parent page of this thread for a MEFI & distributorless system for Pontiacs.

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  #200  
Old Yesterday, 08:45 PM
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Made a post in the parent page of this thread for a MEFI & distributorless system for Pontiacs.
I just don't understand what the issue is with having an EFI section. Why such a resistance?

There are late model LS powered and swap sections, is it this difficult to support an EFI retrofit section? It's obvious there's a legitimate need for it.

I just don't get it...


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