[RS16017]

What 4 speed came factory in the 1967 GTO. Was it a Saginaw or Muncie

[Ducks Goat]

Muncie

[GT182]

Yes Muncie. Tho I believe a Saginaw was used back in 64, or 65, or maybe even 66 if the factory ran out of Muncie 4 speeds at the time the car was built. I've read that somewhere but can't remember where.

My first 66 GTO had a Saginaw in it when I bought it in May of 1970. The car, I found out when I totaled it, was full of bondo. So that could possibly be the reason for the Saginaw... blown Muncie replaced with the Saginaw when the car was in the body shop.

[Jeff Hamlin]

"STANDARD" MT in 66 & 67 was a 3spd Saginaw.

"OPTIONAL" 4spd was a Muncie M20 or M21.

[geeteeohguy]

Originally Posted by Jeff Hamlin

"STANDARD" MT in 66 & 67 was a 3spd Saginaw.

"OPTIONAL" 4spd was a Muncie M20 or M21.

Standard 3 speed in '66 was the Ford-sourced Dearborn unit. Strongest manual trans ever used in a GTO.
Standard 3 speed in '67 was a Muncie unit.

4 speeds were Muncie M20 or M21 for '66 and '67.

No Saginaw units were used in any '66-'67 GTO from the factory.

[242177P]

Originally Posted by geeteeohguy

Standard 3 speed in '66 was the Ford-sourced Dearborn unit.

Nope. The 3 speed Saginaw was the base transmission on 65-67 GTOs. Thing is, it was only with available with column shift, I think it's safe to describe those as exceedingly rare. When they opted for a floor shift (which most clearly did) they used the 65-69 Dearborn 3 speed.




67 GTOs used Muncie four speeds.

[400 4spd.]

Originally Posted by 242177P

Nope. The 3 speed Saginaw was the base transmission on 65-67 GTOs. Thing is, it was only with available with column shift, I think it's safe to describe those as exceedingly rare. When they opted for a floor shift (which most clearly did) they used the 65-69 Dearborn 3 speed.




67 GTOs used Muncie four speeds.

The Saginaw was base in the Lemans and Tempest. I'm not aware of column shift 3-speed manual GTOs. Can you cite a source with production numbers? If not, I stand with the Dearborn 3 speed ONLY being used in the the GTO. BTW, I have both '65 and '67 versions of Dearborns that I removed from GTOs in the early 70's.

I have never seen a column shift manual GTO. Edumicate me with sources, please.
As to the Muncie offerings, the M-20 was most common, with the M-21 offered only with certain engine code and rear gear combinations.

[242177P]

Originally Posted by 400 4spd.

The Saginaw was base in the Lemans and Tempest. I'm not aware of column shift 3-speed manual GTOs. Can you cite a source with production numbers? If not, I stand with the Dearborn 3 speed ONLY being used in the the GTO. BTW, I have both '65 and '67 versions of Dearborns that I removed from GTOs in the early 70's.

I have never seen a column shift manual GTO. Edumicate me with sources, please.
As to the Muncie offerings, the M-20 was most common, with the M-21 offered only with certain engine code and rear gear combinations.

^^^ That's straight out of Eric White's book.

I don't have production numbers, like I said they're quite rare. One of them showed up
at the GTO Nationals. Mike Noun has been researching these, maybe he'll weigh in.

[Jeff Hamlin]

3spd column shift '66 GTO

[66sprint6]

That is so cool. Not that it would be my first choice. Anyways, I heard that the 3 speed Dearborn never really made it into many cars.

[Jeff Hamlin]

Mike Noun was quoted as verifying 412 3 spd column shift GTO's in 1966 in a Hemmings article.

[400 4spd.]

Thanks for the information guys. Always learning something. So was it established that the column shift cars were Saginaw equipped? My understanding based on past readings is that the Saginaw was not strong enough to be used in the GTOs and the Dearborn was much stouter. Olds also the Dearborn in some of the 442s.

[geeteeohguy]

Have seen and driven several 3 speed '65-'66 GTO's. All were Dearborn transmissions, but all were floor shift, so HD option, I suppose. Have never seen a Saginaw equipped 3 speed GTO with a column shift. Been looking at these cars 45+ years. But I guess they do exist. Great thread!

[Jerry H.]

There was a 3 speed column shifted 66 GTO at the Witchita GTOAA convention in 1988 that was ordered with the center console. It had a weird 'block off' plate in the hole of the console.

[Mister Pontiac]

Originally Posted by Jerry H.

There was a 3 speed column shifted 66 GTO at the Witchita GTOAA convention in 1988 that was ordered with the center console. It had a weird 'block off' plate in the hole of the console.

Now THAT would be an interesting sight. I love 'odd.'

[Big Bear]

I have a 65 Lemans 326 with dearborn and floor shift. There has been a bb 66 chebby around here with a console and block off plate column shift. Wonder what trans it would have.

[gtospieg]

I have seen 1 '67 Lemans with a three on the tree and buckets...don't know which trans it had. I thought that was pretty unusual as someone buying a Lemans was usually spending a little more. Maybe they really wanted the buckets which you couldn't get in the Tempest.

[Keith Seymore]

Originally Posted by gtospieg

I have seen 1 '67 Lemans with a three on the tree and buckets...don't know which trans it had. I thought that was pretty unusual as someone buying a Lemans was usually spending a little more. Maybe they really wanted the buckets which you couldn't get in the Tempest.

Usually it's because they didn't know that the three on the tree was base.

They assumed it would come with a floor shifter.

K