[ponjohn]

Shelly-

My combo 3.73's and a 295 tire are mathematically lower than a 3.55 and a 28" tire. My car 60 ft in the mid 1.6's consitently. I also run a 3000 redneck AND my car weighs nearly 3700lbs with me.

Point is, I don't think you're killing it too much with the combo. Did you check fuel pressure? Timing?

Since my gear change my redneck has gone up from 6-7% up to 10-11%. Might switch to a continental.

You say it was lazy on the gear changes, did it pull in the upper rpm?

[Rob B]

What kind of Distributor? How much timing? Is it locked? Very well could be converter also. What RPM would the converter flash too?

[71 Ventura II]

IMHO I would like to see the gear stay the same but step up to the ATI 8" "Tree Master" 4400 converter in your combo. Even in your 2850# + driver car with the cam your running it needs the larger converter. Don't let the 8" housing scare you it is a very efficient converter. There are plenty of guys running the same converter with like cams to yours pulling 1.4X's 60' times in heavier vehicles. Also, pulling down big mph. JD

P.S. Your gear looks right in line for the combo. My reasoning is from the relatively light race weight. If you had a car in the 3500-3800 lb range then I would say a 3.73-4.10 would work. Your concern will be "Hooking" the small section width tire. A 3.42 gear with a 29" tire should be very close if it will hold the power with the higher stall.

[ponjohn]

Continental is coming out with a new 4200.

[69f bird]

The converter will flash to 3300 rpm. It is a brand new Redneck. The timing is set at 35 degrees all in by 2500 rpm (not locked). I did not change the timing at all. The distributor is a new HEI connected to an MSD 6AL box. Fuel pressure is just under 7 1/2 lbs.

When shifting from 2nd to 3rd, at about 5800 RPM, what would my new RPMs be using a th400? It was "doggy" after each shift too...likely into the same low 3k rpm range.

Trying to decide, between now and Norwalk...new converter or different gears?

[shotgun]

Shel, bolt up your RPM and watch what happens.

[ponjohn]

My car loads from 5400 to 4000 after the shift. I thought this wasn't enough but many people 9on this board) have siad that is more loading than they get.

I would put gears in it as this is a drag only. I would NOT go any higher (numerically) than 3.73's.

I don't think the covertor is waaaay off base. Maybe too tight for the gears in there.

[71 Ventura II]

Originally Posted by ponjohn

My car loads from 5400 to 4000 after the shift. I thought this wasn't enough but many people 9on this board) have siad that is more loading than they get.

I would put gears in it as this is a drag only. I would NOT go any higher (numerically) than 3.73's.

I don't think the covertor is waaaay off base. Maybe too tight for the gears in there.

FWIW When you go lower say from a 3.70 to a 4.30 the converter "Loses" stall! As an example, my old HughesGM25 converter would footbrake to 2100 rpm's with the 3.70 gear. When the 4.30's went in it would push my car through the lights @1400 rpms! You lose the ability to hold the car back with the greater multiplication. (On the footbrake).

The "Biproduct" of having a very light weight car is you must order a much looser converter when compared directly to the same unit made for a 3800-4100 # cars. Otherwise you'll be wondering why it won't 60' well. My current Redneck will fash to 3600-3700 rpm and will footbrake to 3200-3300 behind my 400; it only adds 6.2% slippage on the topend. I actually selected a slightly smaller cam this time around because even in my car @3300 lbs, cam @0.050 .247/.252, 4.30 gear, and 3500+ converter it wasn't enough to get better than a 1.857 60' time. More converter and it would have launched much harder. Now look at a 455+ CID engine with a solid roller cam @.271/.280, with a 3.42 gear.... Swap the 3.42's to say a 3.73 ending up with even less stall than before.

Bottom line, the converter he's using is way too tight and needs more flash. Where he goes from here can be an expensive learning experience or not. Have fun! JD

[74gto]

Originally Posted by 69f bird

Well, mixed and somewhat disappointing results, but all-in-all, not a bad day. The car weighs 2850 without me. I am happy with that. It passed tech with just fine for what we hoped was a 10 second car. The car ran straight, handled well and stopped fine.

I ran several times with the 30x9x15 MT radial slicks. Every launch was very slugish...60 ft's in the 1.75-1.79 range. I tried launching from 2000 RPM up to 3300 and once from idle...same general results... 1/4 times were in the 11.6x range at ~118. I thought maybe not enough gear, so i installed a pair of MT 275/60-15 drag radials which are 2" shorter than the slicks...basically same results.

The car is sluggish coming off the line and then after 100' it starts to take off. It also felt sluggish immediately after each shift.

So, I know a few people thought the Redneck torque converter stall was too low at 3300 rpm and that the 3.42 gears were not enough gear. Do my symptoms match up well with that? I do have a Coan 3500 stall converter to try to see if its the converter. I also have a pair of 275/50-15 drag radials I can try in order to simulate more gear.

Suggestions are welcome! Thanks

69 Fbird,
No suggestion, but I hear you about the 3;42 gear. I also hope to be at Norwalk. I have the same gear in my 74, with 29x10.5x15 MTslicks. I ran at Norwalk last year on Sunday I only got 2 runs because of the threat of rain. I flung the fan belt my first run and ran a 13.89. My second run was a 13;49 at 99.5 MPH. My 60 ft. times were 2.0 -2.1. Car has no low end, doggish on top end. Shifted into 3rd at about the 1100 ft. mark. I run a mild 406 in my car. Probably weighs 3700 lbs. I hope to be there again this year if I get my harness in the car this week. It has a cage, and was told by teck even though it has stock seats, I need a harness. Anyways, I just pulled the car out this past Sunday for the first time this year. Gonna see what happens at Norwalk. I believe I need more timing, initial is only set at 10 degrees. Hope to meet you there, and hope to break into the 12's. My next step is probably gonna be a taller gear with the tall tires in back.

[Mo]

Nice build Shelly.

Seems like your mph is low which would indicate hp loss even with those gears and converter. Maybe you're not getting full throttle. Got to figure the motor should be making about 550hp. My car, with a tight NO2 converter and NO2 cam, would still mph in the 125 range for my 3550lbs with that HP on motor. I know it's not the best way to diagnose a problem but it does raise an eyebrow. The calculator shows at 3100lbs your only making 400hp. Thoughts?

On the flipside, I know Darin picked up like .4 with a converter swap but not sure on the mph change. Have you talked to him? Your cars are fairly similar.

I'm sure you get it the 10's real soon. See you at Norwalk!

[69f bird]

OK, getting ready for Norwalk. A new ATI converter is going in this week. I am leaving the Victor in place for now but will be bringing the RPM intake and some extra gaskets. I will also have more time at Norwalk to play with timing...we didn't touch the tuning at Maple Grove last week.

I want to do gears too, but that will have to wait. If I am going to rebuild a rear with a spool, I'd rather leave this 12 bolt 3.42 posi alone and put it back in my '69 Firebird, and then build a new rear from scratch for the Ventura.

I really appreciate everyone's input.

Shelly

[71 Ventura II]

Originally Posted by 69f bird

OK, getting ready for Norwalk. A new ATI converter is going in this week. I am leaving the Victor in place for now but will be bringing the RPM intake and some extra gaskets. I will also have more time at Norwalk to play with timing...we didn't touch the tuning at Maple Grove last week.

I want to do gears too, but that will have to wait. If I am going to rebuild a rear with a spool, I'd rather leave this 12 bolt 3.42 posi alone and put it back in my '69 Firebird, and then build a new rear from scratch for the Ventura.

I really appreciate everyone's input.

Shelly

You might bring one "Tall" and one "Short" set of stickies to see which one will hook best. I just don't want you to get all the way there and realize you have a spin monster and no cure. IMHO The right converter is going to make your car drop ET very fast. I wouldn't be surprised to see you drop .5+ plus even more with the tuning. Total timing for best MPH!!!

I believe the Victor will out perform the RPM in a build like yours especially in a light weight car. Good luck! JD

[69f bird]

The converter is in and we are ready to go! The folks at ATI recommended the following based on my car specs and PLANS to go to 3.73 gears soon. It's an ATI Fuel and Blown 408930, 9" that they said will flash to 4500 and should be foot-braked to 2500. I will start with the 275/60-15 MT Drag Radials and see what happens.

FYI, we also found that the throttle was about 1/8" to 3/16" short of full throttle. Not a lot, but still a difference. That has been adjusted accordingly.

I will be looking for a rear at Norwalk...something in the 3.73-3.90 range for the Ventura. Then I will put the 3.42 12 bolt back in my Firebird. The new 428 for the bird should be done very soon! Then onto the next project....

[ponjohn]

Shelly-

Any updates from the track or will we have to wait to Monday?

John

[Herb Hagan]

Shelly,

I still have the 8.5 rear out my Ventura

3.90 Gear
1350 Forged yoke
New bearings/seals
C-Clip eliminator kit
New complete drum brake assemblies and wheel cylinders
SS Inline tube brake lines

I still have not installed the C-clip kit, so if you wanted to upgrade to aftermarket axles

Let me know if your interested

If you have any questions give me a call 410.808.4665 Cell

[69f bird]

John, I think I can update the site from my Blackberry.

herb, I called and left my cell number, thanks!

Shelly

[69f bird]

1st run today with new converter: 1.626 60ft, 11.197 @ 118.53
2nd run today more timing (35 up to 37.5): 1.588 60ft, 11.157 @ 119.54

Plugs look a tad lite...bumped jets from 80/86 to 82/88 for next run

Weather here is outstanding. Mid 70's, but a 15 mph headwind.

Pitting with Shotgun, Mo and Jeff Reynolds...having a ball so far.

[ponjohn]

Awesome!!

Glad the hear the convertor was the culprit. Nice to see low 11's with a 3.42 gear.

[69f bird]

Well, I just backed it up with a 11.197 in the first round of eliminatuons...but on. an 111.20 dial-in. ;-( oh well, I'll try again tomorrow. .

[71 Ventura II]

This is GREAT! I was hoping for a drop of .5 or more and it's delivering! There's more there, it has TENS in it even in the heat! I wish the 60' could get in the low 1.50's to help the ET. Still the engine liked the timing increase throw a little more at it until it loses MPH; great progress for sure. JD