#41  
Old 08-23-2019, 10:49 AM
TAQuest TAQuest is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Bay City, Michigan
Posts: 1,000
Default

[QUOTE=242177P;6054372]As usual, you don't have a clue.



On topic. So you run a couple pumps too?

  #42  
Old 08-23-2019, 11:37 AM
Holeshot71's Avatar
Holeshot71 Holeshot71 is offline
Senior Chief
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: MA
Posts: 371
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by David Jones View Post
I've run my electric for hours with no issue. It's now a bit over 10 years old. My mechanical also has a return.
So the consensus is adding some pressure to the suction side of the pump is not a problem. Thx!


Quote:
Originally Posted by jarretts70 View Post
Thanks for all the input. Glad to have Cliff chime in, I followed his book when rebuilding the carb. This stumble aside the car runs excellently.

I originally rebuilt the carb with the stock fuel inlet seat (.125? Not sure...). I have since upgraded to a .130 seat. However, I should note I never actually measured it. It came in a packet labeled .130 & I just swapped it in..It made no difference.

I noted earlier that the Holley mech pump made it worse. I'll elaborate & see if it helps troubleshoot: With the stock type fuel pump the car would accelerate HARD when going to WOT - either from a dead stop or from a roll.

After changing to the Holley pump it does not accelerate as hard. It's still quick, but not near as hard hitting as before. I I'm guessing that it has to do with the fact the Holley pump has a smaller bowl? Or it's just not what it's cracked up to be. Or I'm missing something else.

I also will note it does not matter if the gas tank is full or not, so I'm guessing that the level of the pickup in the tank is not the issue. I've been thru the lines front to back a few times looking for a kink or restriction & I think it should be all good.

My current plan is to start by dropping the tank to make sure the pickup is not clogged or damaged. Sending unit for the gauge is kind of wonky, so its a good reason to drop the tank. If that doesn't help next up will be to rig a fuel pressure gauge..

Are you running a return line or is that pump dead headed? As others have said, I've also had good luck running the large canister pumps with a return.

Also FWIW, I'm running a 455, with 6x-4 heads 041 cam, and a later model Q-jet. I set the carb up using Cliffs book and parts. The kit came with a .145" needle and seat. This car flat out rips. It pulls HARD right up through 3rd gear. I only get a hint of it getting a little flat at the top of 3rd, but by then it's time to let off. No issues with nosing over. If I was running at the track with any kind of traction I'm sure this more of an issue.

__________________
'71 GTO, 406 CID, 60916, 1.65 HS, '69 #46 Heads 230CFM, 800CFM Q-jet, TH400, 12 Bolt 3.55
'72 Lemans, Lucerne Blue, WU2, T41, L78, M22, G80
  #43  
Old 08-23-2019, 11:45 AM
nytrainer's Avatar
nytrainer nytrainer is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Long Island, NY
Posts: 1,096
Default

Thread related questions.
Funny thing is I was planning to install the Carter electric fuel pump today and saw this thread. I am adding it really only as a way to prime the carb. (350 engine) because when it sits for more than a few days it requires a lot of cranking to get fuel up to the bowl. The carb was rebuilt by Cliff so I know the bottom plugs were addressed. Just the nature of a vented carb bowl, ethanol blend fuel and a car that's not used as often as a daily driver I suppose.
Question. My mech. pump does not have return to the tank. When the elec. pump is switched on does the fuel flow stop at the inlet to the mech. pump or does the elec. pump fuel all the way to the carb bowl and stopped by rising float needle/seat closure?
Do I need to plumb in a return and change mech. pump to a return style?
Do I need to plumb in a bypass around the elec. pump so mech. pump will pull fuel with elec. shut off or does mech. pump actually pull fuel through the shut off Carter elec. pump?
Thanks all.

__________________
1968 LeMans conv. 350 HO - 4 speed triple white (hear it idle here) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eVmq...ature=youtu.be
1968 LeMans conv. 350 - 4 speed Solar red/pearl
  #44  
Old 08-23-2019, 11:54 AM
TAQuest TAQuest is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Bay City, Michigan
Posts: 1,000
Default

Mechanical pump for Pontiacs that supports 1100 HP.
http://www.robbmcperformance.com/pro...ntiac1100.html

  #45  
Old 08-23-2019, 12:06 PM
Steve C. Steve C. is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Liberty Hill, Tx. (Austin)
Posts: 10,385
Default

Might be of interest....

Q. Why Do Electric Fuel Pumps Die?

https://www.hotrod.com/articles/why-...uel-pumps-die/


.

__________________
'70 TA / 505 cid / same engine but revised ( previous best 10.63 at 127.05 )
Old information here:
http://www.hotrod.com/articles/0712p...tiac-trans-am/

Sponsor of the world's fastest Pontiac powered Ford Fairmont (engine)
5.14 at 140 mph (1/8 mile) , true 10.5 tire, stock type suspension
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qDoJnIP3HgE
  #46  
Old 08-23-2019, 12:25 PM
ponyakr's Avatar
ponyakr ponyakr is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: North Louisiana
Posts: 7,621
Default

"...Do I need to plumb in a bypass around the elec. pump so mech. pump will pull fuel with elec. shut off or does mech. pump actually pull fuel through the shut off Carter elec. pump?"

A stock factory Pontiac mechanical pump always pulled thru the Carter electric, for me.

According to what has been posted, I assume that SOME brands/types of pumps would require a bypass.

  #47  
Old 08-23-2019, 12:47 PM
David Jones's Avatar
David Jones David Jones is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Pleasant Grove, Alabama
Posts: 8,412
Default

The Carter electric (P4070) I use is a "rotary vane" type pump. I believe that type is required to "pull through". At about $60, plus a switch and some wire. I added a pre-filter and needed a few fittings (which I drilled out as large as I could) and a little hose. The mount is a three foot piece of aluminum angle between the tank strap bolts. $125/150 total?

__________________

frittering and wasting the hours in an off hand way....



1969 GTO, 455ci, 230/236 Pontiac Dude's "Butcher Special" Comp hyd roller cam with Crower HIPPO solid roller lifters, Q-jet, Edelbrock P4B-QJ, Doug's headers, ported 6X-8 (97cc) heads, TKO600, 3.73 geared Eaton Tru-Trac 8.5", hydroboost, rear disc brakes......and my greatest mechanical feat....a new heater core.
  #48  
Old 08-23-2019, 02:02 PM
1968GTO421's Avatar
1968GTO421 1968GTO421 is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Travelers Rest, SC
Posts: 1,285
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve C. View Post
Might be of interest....

Q. Why Do Electric Fuel Pumps Die?

https://www.hotrod.com/articles/why-...uel-pumps-die/


.
Thanks, Steve, that was really informative.

__________________


"No replacement for displacement!"

GTOAA--https://www.gtoaa.org/
  #49  
Old 08-27-2019, 10:40 PM
jarretts70 jarretts70 is offline
Senior Chief
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 446
Default

Was away from the car (& this forum) for a couple days, back at it now.

Holeshot - I've run a OEM type pump that had a return line; the Holley pump I installed does not.,

I'm going thru everything back to front to look for obvious restrictions in the fuel delivery system, I'd sure like to get it running without a electric pump & frankly don't think a relatively mild street engine should need one.

I dropped the gas tank tonight. My gas gauge is a bit wacky so I wan to clean up the sending unit anyway. It was a new tank but it looks like I used the original pickup. Note it took a few years to rebuild the car, so I've forgotten some of the finer details...That said, Pickup looks fine. Not corroded or anything. As suggested I'll take the filter sock off just to be sure it's not a restriction.

  #50  
Old 08-28-2019, 12:02 AM
Holeshot71's Avatar
Holeshot71 Holeshot71 is offline
Senior Chief
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: MA
Posts: 371
Default

Another thing to check is certain types of air filter assembly's can cause bog issues. Sometimes it's how close the lid is to the carb. Also seen those open element filter "lids" cause weird drivability issues.

__________________
'71 GTO, 406 CID, 60916, 1.65 HS, '69 #46 Heads 230CFM, 800CFM Q-jet, TH400, 12 Bolt 3.55
'72 Lemans, Lucerne Blue, WU2, T41, L78, M22, G80
  #51  
Old 08-28-2019, 12:43 AM
ponyakr's Avatar
ponyakr ponyakr is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: North Louisiana
Posts: 7,621
Default

"...electric pump...frankly don't think a relatively mild street engine should need one..."

That sounds reasonable. And, I don't remember any of the popular carbed Musclecars that came from the factory with an electric pusher pump. If you guys know of some, please post that info.

I suppose it might depend on exactly what "relatively mild" means. My '69 RA3 4-speed GTO didn't need one, in stock form. With only about 500 miles on it, I entered it in a race at our local airport. Won the class, against some local big block Chevelles & a 442. In doing so, I made several passes down the track. It ran all the way thru, shifting at about 5000 rpm, or slightly above, & never ran out of gas.

So, by today's standards, exactly how "mild" was a 366hp early '69 RA3 engine ?

Some of the bigger cube engines come to mind, 426 Hemi with two 4's, 427 BBC, 429 Boss Ford, 440 Six Pack Mopar, BOP 455's, 500 Caddy. So, did any of these cars come with electric pusher pumps ? Surely the car maker would not want these engines to run out of fuel, which could possibly cause engine damage, or at the very least, reduce engine performance.

And, it's already been mentioned about the RobbMc pumps. They're available in a 550hp model, and an adjustable 1100hp model. With a good 1/2" supply line, one of these should supply most any reasonable street engine.

https://www.robbmcperformance.com/pr...ontiac550.html

https://www.robbmcperformance.com/pr...ntiac1100.html

The Carter M6907 should supply more than factory Pontiac pumps, I assume.

https://butlerperformance.com/i-2445...fmp-m6907.html

https://www.amazon.com/Carter-M6907-...42350075&psc=1

https://www.ebay.com/p/Mechanical-Fu...nid=1907933686

I think it has also been mentioned that a pusher pump is real handy for filling the carb bowl(s), when the car has not been cranked in quite a while. If this happens on a car without a pusher pump, I usually pour a little gas down the primaries. Since none of my race cars had a working choke, I always turned the idle screw, to keep idle speed up, til carb/engine warmed up. But, most street guys would probably not wanna have to raise the hood & do all this. So, a working choke plus an elec pusher pump appear to be good equipment for a street car, IMO.


Last edited by ponyakr; 08-28-2019 at 12:59 AM.
  #52  
Old 08-28-2019, 09:58 AM
78w72 78w72 is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: iowa
Posts: 4,683
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ponyakr View Post
"...electric pump...frankly don't think a relatively mild street engine should need one..."

That sounds reasonable. And, I don't remember any of the popular carbed Musclecars that came from the factory with an electric pusher pump. If you guys know of some, please post that info.

I suppose it might depend on exactly what "relatively mild" means. My '69 RA3 4-speed GTO didn't need one, in stock form. With only about 500 miles on it, I entered it in a race at our local airport. Won the class, against some local big block Chevelles & a 442. In doing so, I made several passes down the track. It ran all the way thru, shifting at about 5000 rpm, or slightly above, & never ran out of gas.

So, by today's standards, exactly how "mild" was a 366hp early '69 RA3 engine ?

Some of the bigger cube engines come to mind, 426 Hemi with two 4's, 427 BBC, 429 Boss Ford, 440 Six Pack Mopar, BOP 455's, 500 Caddy. So, did any of these cars come with electric pusher pumps ? Surely the car maker would not want these engines to run out of fuel, which could possibly cause engine damage, or at the very least, reduce engine performance.

And, it's already been mentioned about the RobbMc pumps. They're available in a 550hp model, and an adjustable 1100hp model. With a good 1/2" supply line, one of these should supply most any reasonable street engine.

https://www.robbmcperformance.com/pr...ontiac550.html

https://www.robbmcperformance.com/pr...ntiac1100.html

The Carter M6907 should supply more than factory Pontiac pumps, I assume.

https://butlerperformance.com/i-2445...fmp-m6907.html

https://www.amazon.com/Carter-M6907-...42350075&psc=1

https://www.ebay.com/p/Mechanical-Fu...nid=1907933686

I think it has also been mentioned that a pusher pump is real handy for filling the carb bowl(s), when the car has not been cranked in quite a while. If this happens on a car without a pusher pump, I usually pour a little gas down the primaries. Since none of my race cars had a working choke, I always turned the idle screw, to keep idle speed up, til carb/engine warmed up. But, most street guys would probably not wanna have to raise the hood & do all this. So, a working choke plus an elec pusher pump appear to be good equipment for a street car, IMO.
the fuel starvation issues happen on cars much faster than any stock car ever produced. its usually engines of 425+ hp & good drag radials getting decent traction running mid 12's or faster. none of those cars listed above were that fast, most were in the mid 13's. & drag radials didnt exist back then, street cars usually ran on hard street tires.

i have the robbmc 1100 pump & i still have fuel starvation issues with 1/2" line on good runs, it doesnt happen all the time, i can click off pretty consistent low 11 sec runs, but when i do a hard launch or take the rpms higher than usual it will cut out at the top of 2nd gear around 1/2-3/4 track.

on the street i can run as hard as i want & never see the issue, from a launch or at a roll spinning tires through all gears. the problem happens at hard launch & good traction on the track when a mechanical pump needs to pull fuel through almost 20 feet of fuel line, with bends, & try to keep a little q-jet fuel bowl full. i plan to play with the psi of the pump a little more & see if turning it up at the track will help... if that doesnt work, its in tank pump time!

also the hp ratings of fuel pumps (550, 1100) are done with them sitting still on a dyno with a short big supply fuel line, so the actual power they can support goes out the window when in the real world of drag racing. small pusher pumps like the carter are a great idea for priming the carb after sitting or as a small helper pump for some cars below a certain power level/et, but i doubt they would do much for the real fast street/strip cars.

anyone out there with 450-500+hp run a carter type pusher pump that overcomes a fuel starvation issue at the track from a mech pump? would be a cheap alternative to an expensive fuel pump set up if they did.

  #53  
Old 08-28-2019, 10:02 AM
TAQuest TAQuest is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Bay City, Michigan
Posts: 1,000
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 78w72 View Post
the fuel starvation issues happen on cars much faster than any stock car ever produced. its usually engines of 425+ hp & good drag radials getting decent traction running mid 12's or faster. none of those cars listed above were that fast, most were in the mid 13's. & drag radials didnt exist back then, street cars usually ran on hard street tires.

i have the robbmc 1100 pump & i still have fuel starvation issues with 1/2" line on good runs, it doesnt happen all the time, i can click off pretty consistent low 11 sec runs, but when i do a hard launch or take the rpms higher than usual it will cut out at the top of 2nd gear around 1/2-3/4 track.

on the street i can run as hard as i want & never see the issue, from a launch or at a roll spinning tires through all gears. the problem happens at hard launch & good traction on the track when a mechanical pump needs to pull fuel through almost 20 feet of fuel line, with bends, & try to keep a little q-jet fuel bowl full. i plan to play with the psi of the pump a little more & see if turning it up at the track will help... if that doesnt work, its in tank pump time!

also the hp ratings of fuel pumps (550, 1100) are done with them sitting still on a dyno with a short big supply fuel line, so the actual power they can support goes out the window when in the real world of drag racing. small pusher pumps like the carter are a great idea for priming the carb after sitting or as a small helper pump for some cars below a certain power level/et, but i doubt they would do much for the real fast street/strip cars.

anyone out there with 450-500+hp run a carter type pusher pump that overcomes a fuel starvation issue at the track from a mech pump? would be a cheap alternative to an expensive fuel pump set up if they did.
Can you see a fuel gauge when this happens?

  #54  
Old 08-28-2019, 11:00 AM
Tom Vaught's Avatar
Tom Vaught Tom Vaught is offline
Boost Engineer
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: The United States of America
Posts: 31,294
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 78w72 View Post
"also the hp ratings of fuel pumps (550, 1100) are done with them sitting still on a dyno with a short big supply fuel line, so the actual power they can support goes out the window when in the real world of drag racing. small pusher pumps like the carter are a great idea for priming the carb after sitting or as a small helper pump for some cars below a certain power level/et, but i doubt they would do much for the real fast street/strip cars.
For many years, many of the Fuel Pumps were rated at FREE FLOW conditions.

The Holley 110 GPH Blue Pump being one of them.
A decent mid 10 second car needed TWO OF THEM to run that number.

Part of the issue was the Minimal fuel flow Fuel Pressure Regulators.
Grumpy Jenkins needed two of the regulators to barely feed his SB Chevy Vega race car.

The Holley 7/16" Relief Ball Regulator and the Mallory 140 GPH fuel pump changed that
situation. One of the first actual fuel pumps to flow some fuel.

The Good Aftermarket Fuel Pumps and the EFI Fuel Pumps rate their flow differently.

Below is a Picture of a Bosch 044 EFI Fuel Pump.

In the second picture you can see that the Flow Graph STARTS at 35 PSI fuel pressure. It is HAPPY at 70 psi of fuel pressure.

If you were running the pump at 6 PSI fuel pressure you would be well over a hundred gallons per hour of REAL FUEL FLOW.
You can see in graph #3 that the fuel flow always increases as the pressure requirement is reduced.

Tom V.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Bosch 044 Fuel Pump.jpg
Views:	49
Size:	8.0 KB
ID:	518879   Click image for larger version

Name:	Bosch 044 fuel pump flow-1.jpg
Views:	48
Size:	89.8 KB
ID:	518880   Click image for larger version

Name:	Bosch 044 fuel pump flow.jpg
Views:	62
Size:	44.7 KB
ID:	518881  

__________________
"Engineers do stuff for reasons" Tom Vaught

Despite small distractions, there are those who will go Forward, Learning, Sharing Knowledge, Doing what they can to help others move forward.

Last edited by Tom Vaught; 08-28-2019 at 11:06 AM.
  #55  
Old 08-28-2019, 11:35 AM
HWYSTR455's Avatar
HWYSTR455 HWYSTR455 is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Manassas, VA
Posts: 14,658
Default

Many people continue to have issues with the 550 & 1100 pumps, some are due to vapor lock/heat, some from poor/inadequate plumbing.

On the one Power Tour I was on, vapor lock was experienced by folks even with excellent mech pumps and plumbing, some even with electric pumps. You start sitting in traffic, the asphalt is 110+ degrees, and it cooks the fuel in the tank and lines from the ground up. (radiant).

The solution is more psi, even with carbs. Run a bypass regulator as close to the carb as possible, and you greatly reduce the chances of vapor lock. In tank pumps are best, but it can still be done with external pumps with acceptable results.

Deadhead pump setups don't last as long as bypass ones. Period.

I have seen these discussions for years, on here, and in person to person conversations. In the end, everyone ends up going to a modern fuel system, if they want to be able to drive their' cars (or perform). Pump gas these days is more susceptible due to the alcohol, but it did happen back in the day, too.

I have heard so many say they 'get by' with pusher pumps, etc, but in the end, they all buckle to a modern fuel system. (or live with sub-standard results) Many don't even realize they are having issues, until they upgrade. The results speak for themselves.

You can't cheat physics.

.

__________________
.

1970 GTO Judge Tribute Pro-Tour Project 535 IA2
http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...d.php?t=760624
1971 Trans Am 463, 315cfm E-head Sniper XFlow EFI, TKO600 extreme, 9", GW suspension, Baer brakes, pro tour car
https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...ght=procharger
Theme Song: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7zKAS...ature=youtu.be
  #56  
Old 08-28-2019, 11:38 AM
i82much's Avatar
i82much i82much is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 2,786
Default

what do you think about those bypass setups where the fuel pump bypasses directly into the fuel tank, instead of having the bypass under the hood and a return line that runs the length of the car?

  #57  
Old 08-28-2019, 11:43 AM
HWYSTR455's Avatar
HWYSTR455 HWYSTR455 is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Manassas, VA
Posts: 14,658
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by i82much View Post
what do you think about those bypass setups where the fuel pump bypasses directly into the fuel tank, instead of having the bypass under the hood and a return line that runs the length of the car?
The fuel in the line, regardless of how they are run, still heats up.

EFI is diff, since the psi to the front of the car is under higher psi. But personally, the few dollars saved isn't worth the loss in overall function/performance of a 'true' bypass setup (regardless of carb/EFI)

.

__________________
.

1970 GTO Judge Tribute Pro-Tour Project 535 IA2
http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...d.php?t=760624
1971 Trans Am 463, 315cfm E-head Sniper XFlow EFI, TKO600 extreme, 9", GW suspension, Baer brakes, pro tour car
https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...ght=procharger
Theme Song: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7zKAS...ature=youtu.be
  #58  
Old 08-28-2019, 11:56 AM
i82much's Avatar
i82much i82much is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 2,786
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by HWYSTR455 View Post
The fuel in the line, regardless of how they are run, still heats up.

EFI is diff, since the psi to the front of the car is under higher psi. But personally, the few dollars saved isn't worth the loss in overall function/performance of a 'true' bypass setup (regardless of carb/EFI)

.
Ok thanks. I've seen that setup a few times and didn't quite understand the reason for it.

  #59  
Old 08-28-2019, 12:10 PM
78w72 78w72 is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: iowa
Posts: 4,683
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by HWYSTR455 View Post
Many people continue to have issues with the 550 & 1100 pumps, some are due to vapor lock/heat, some from poor/inadequate plumbing.

On the one Power Tour I was on, vapor lock was experienced by folks even with excellent mech pumps and plumbing, some even with electric pumps. You start sitting in traffic, the asphalt is 110+ degrees, and it cooks the fuel in the tank and lines from the ground up. (radiant).

The solution is more psi, even with carbs. Run a bypass regulator as close to the carb as possible, and you greatly reduce the chances of vapor lock. In tank pumps are best, but it can still be done with external pumps with acceptable results.

Deadhead pump setups don't last as long as bypass ones. Period.

I have seen these discussions for years, on here, and in person to person conversations. In the end, everyone ends up going to a modern fuel system, if they want to be able to drive their' cars (or perform). Pump gas these days is more susceptible due to the alcohol, but it did happen back in the day, too.

I have heard so many say they 'get by' with pusher pumps, etc, but in the end, they all buckle to a modern fuel system. (or live with sub-standard results) Many don't even realize they are having issues, until they upgrade. The results speak for themselves.

You can't cheat physics.

.
the robbmc pump runs great in all conditions... except for hard launches with traction at the track running into the mid to low 11s. i dont have any signs of vapor lock during city driving or even hot days at the track, the car will start & restart fully heat soaked in hot weather just fine... never bogs or cuts out from a launch or punch from a roll. cliffs q-jet runs excellent in all ways.

the plumbing is as good as it can be without getting into sumping the tank. have 1/2" steel line from tank to about mmidway, then use -8AN line from there to pump & from pump to carb. i initially ran the pump dialed all the way down to ~7psi & no regulator. then tried a malllory regulator & turned the pump up to about 9psi & kept the reg at ~ 7psi. still cut out maybe 2 out of 5 runs. next step will be turning the pump up even higher, since robb's mech pumps increase flow with psi. cliff says the q-jet can handle 9psi for a short time so i will try upping the psi as much as possible. if all else fails & i want to go faster, i will go modern intank pump & sell the robbmc stuff. i plan to hook up a gauge & see what it does. have talked to a few of the fast street guys & they said it should stay at 4-5psi or above.

i82much- areomotive makes a drop in, intank pump module that has an internal regulator designed for carb applications, looks like a nice unit but i think tanks in set ups are a nicer design & you dont have to cut a hole in the tank if you buy the complete tank/pump.

  #60  
Old 08-28-2019, 12:32 PM
Tom Vaught's Avatar
Tom Vaught Tom Vaught is offline
Boost Engineer
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: The United States of America
Posts: 31,294
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by HWYSTR455 View Post
The fuel in the line, regardless of how they are run, still heats up.

EFI is diff, since the psi to the front of the car is under higher psi. But personally, the few dollars saved isn't worth the loss in overall function/performance of a 'true' bypass setup (regardless of carb/EFI)

.
The OEMs learned from the High Performance vehicles using dead head pumps and went to the SOURCE of the issue, the output of the fuel pump.

Design the fuel pump (or pumps) for the actual fuel requirement and then control the pump speed so that the engine only got the fuel volume it needed.

Many years ago with the Boost Game was first in place on OEM vehicles (like the Turbo Buicks and Vortech Supercharged Mustangs), the aftermarket came up with a "Boost a Pump" controller that raised the voltage of the "FEED" to the Fuel Pump (around 20 volts) and the fuel pump supplied higher fuel flow vs the normal 12-14 volt system normally supplied. They used this device only under BOOST mode.

The OEMs did just the opposite now that they had high volume fuel pumps available.
They reduced the voltage to keep the fuel pressure constant unless under boost and then the Vehicle Computer increased the voltage to the normal 12-14 volts.

So there are ways to control the fuel pump output today.

The Aeromotive 16306 Billet Fuel Pump Speed Controller is one of the most popular units out there today for use with modern fuel systems. Just Saying.

Tom V.

__________________
"Engineers do stuff for reasons" Tom Vaught

Despite small distractions, there are those who will go Forward, Learning, Sharing Knowledge, Doing what they can to help others move forward.
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:29 PM.

 

About Us

The PY Online Forums is the largest online gathering of Pontiac enthusiasts anywhere in the world. Founded in 1991, it was also the first online forum for people to gather and talk about their Pontiacs. Since then, it has become the mecca of Pontiac technical data and knowledge that no other place can surpass.

 




Copyright © 2017