[67Lemons]

With all the negative reports of HFT failures let’s spin this to a positive place. WHO has recently within the last three years installed a flat tappet cam successfully & what did you do that you feel helped?

[PunchT37]

I have not lost a flat tappet cam. But, in the last 3 to 5 years? Nope. My a$$ would tighten up a bit if I were to do it today.

[Flattrack88]

I haven't installed an HFT but have installed 2 SFTs in the past 14 months with no issues. First was Crower cam with Crower lifters and second was a CamCraft cam with Crower EDM lifters. I checked both cams for taper and unscientifically held several of the lifters face to face to confirm there was a slight radius. Both times i used Lucas break-in oil. Crower cam and lifters was coated with the provided lube, Lucas. CamCraft cam and lifters were coated with recommended cam saver lube. Broke in both with my 1.5 rockers (vs. 1.65). Started, instantly brought to 2000-2500 rpm and varied a little for 20-25 minutes. Did not remove inner valve springs. I may have just been lucky both times but no issues. That said, I wouldn't install one without checking taper these days.

[PunchT37]

I would use straight 30w oil and a bottle of gm eos for break in. Change the filter only after the 20 to 30 min run in time. Then, add 30 w to full mark. Then, run engine with break in "package" for a while longer.


I`m not a "break in oil" advocate as a special high dollar oil.



Then, drop oil and filter and run what you want. Been working for 30 yrs or so.

[JB Eng Wis]

There is always that risk of something going wrong.... I have not given up on flat tappet cams (HYD or Solid)...
But I do my best to use all the tools that are available.... And for Pontiac engines that means removing the inner valve springs, and using a great break in oil.
I have had cams also Plasma Nitrided by Comp Cams that has added another 100+ dollers to the cost...it was a SBC not Poncho .Did it need it....?? I hope I never find out....
As far as Break in oils go....Lucas 30w has LOTS of Phosphorus & Zinc with lower Calcium..around 1100ppm (which is a detergent) ... If less Calcium is wanted then use the Driven brand BR oils where the calcium is under 450ppm.... but cost more...
Lifters are another story....whose lifters are whose??? Most everybody talks Johnson Hylift... (spend the money,,,no cheap lifters)...
Thats some advice that I can share....Hope it helps... and Best of luck if you choose a FT Cam.

[AG]

I installed a used RA IV cam using used HFT lifters in the fall of 2022 and everything worked no problem. I used 100# seat pressure CC cam lube on the cam and moly paste on the bottom of the lifters. Since the cam had not been run with the lifters before, I did a 20 min break-in cycling the rpms up and down. I used Crane Cams ZDDP additive and changed the oil and filter after the break-in, didn't find anything in the filter.

[tom s]

I did the 421 in my ^@ GP and a 4 cyc that was in my 63 Lemans.The GP got a 068 with a set of NOS GM lifters,the 4 cyc got a a factory regrind done by Isky also with GM lifters.Was VERY careful priming and sure all lifters were spinning when it was 1/4ed and primed.Used 10-30 dyno oil with a 1/2 bottle of EOS and a 1/2 bottle of STP.Fired them up,did the normal brake in and both engines as far as I know are running fine.Still own the GP and it gets driven a lot.The 4 cyc I assume is good as the current owner lives close and if it failed I would know.When I do a oil change on the 421 it gets the 10-30 dyno oil and also the 1/2 bottles of EOS and STP.FWIW,Tom

[mgarblik]

At my school, we build and dyno 6-8 flat tappet cam engines a year. In the last 20 years we have lost one cam on the dyno I mentioned in a previous post. So that is a minimum of 120 up to 160 engines. Most are mild builds or restoration builds. I would guess most were in the 250-400 HP range. But several had pretty hot cams and made over 500 HP. I have not heard back from any other students about failed cams once in their cars on the street or track. I would say about 25% of the students have come back with their cars to show off or I have seen them at Cars and Coffee. No complaints. My personal 462 Pontiac built last year with an Ultradyne flat tappet cam ran for several hours on the dyno. 48 power pulls trying to get the pair of dumb AFB's tuned and running great. I put about 1700 street miles on it last year. Flat tappet solid. Adjusted the valves once on the dyno. Valve covers have not been off since.

I will say we have had 3 engines at the school with roller lifter failure on the dyno. One was a Morel lifter that would never oil. Another was a Lunnati that broke a tie bar. The third was a Isky that lost a roller wheel and tore up everything in a BBC. So roller lifters. solid or hydraulic are not the magic pill IMO. They do make lots more power and are necessary in real high power builds. But they can fail at about the same rate unfortunately.

[4dblnkldude]

I just broke in a summit 2801 on Saturday. Brand new engine I built in December of 2022. I used brand new comp lifters from 15 years ago. I assembled everything with Torco lube. Broke it in for 18 minutes, idled down to 900 and the temp went from 215 to 195. Started it a few more times cause we were celebrating. Started it up on Sunday like it was running for years. Let it idle for 1/2 hour and removed the oil, let it drain for 3 hours and filled it with 10w-30 brad Penn and a bottle of zinc. Cut filter open, all is good.

[MidnightAuto]

3 years ago - crower 60919 with the cam saver lifters. I did not check anything. Tremendous amount of cam lube, purple break in oil. Started right up, kept between 2 - 4 k. No issues

[chiphead]

Last year I did a Summit 2802 swap into a high mile 400. The Crane cam was starting to go flat, so I pulled it and swapped it. I paid careful attention to spring pressures and valvetrain geometry. I found a lot of issues with the old build, stock retainers crushing the valve seals, stock rocker studs/nuts on an aftermarket cam, worn out rocker arms. I replaced it all and broke it in a year ago. 30W lucas break in oil and plenty of the moly paste on the cam lobes and lifters. I pulled the inner springs even though it had mild springs. 2 runs of 15 minutes at 1800-3000 RPM. The moly paste does get in the filter, change the oil several times if using the black moly break-in lube.

I just checked it the other day, all 16 pushrods still spinning. it does make some clattering when warming up, I assume that's the worn valves and valveguides.

[64speed]

Crower 60919 and Cam Saver lifters. Over 1500 miles now.

[P@blo]

Two summit cams this year. One on my son's 75 Malibu with a two barrel SBC and the other in a friends 71 Monte with a 396. Both are doing fine.

Run HFT on all my junk and not really much issues. If the lifters do not rotate you know you have a problrm long before grinding things down. A magnetic drain plug and cutting your oil filter open so things do not sneak up on you doesn't hurt either.

[Gary H]

I've built about 10 flat hydraulic flat tappet lifter Pontiac engines over the last 2 years. No issues on them. I only use Hy-lift Johnson lifters though.

[67Lemons]

I just purchased a set of used Pontiac GM lifters on eBay this morning, said to only have a few dyno pulls then were swapped out for a roller. My plan is to send them out to be refaced & install them with a new 068 for my build, seems like the safest way to go without going roller. It will probably cost me a few Pennie’s more but I have more confidence in a set of 30 year old semi used lifters than what we can get today.

[grivera]

You would trust those over the Hylift Johnson’s recommended here?

[67Lemons]

Originally Posted by grivera

You would trust those over the Hylift Johnson’s recommended here?

At the moment I’m not sure but they were at a cheap enough price with return privileges if they aren’t in the condition described by the seller plus I’m just more comfortable with something built years ago that I can send to a machinist for inspection. The Hylift’s are in the online shopping cart at Butler’s ready to purchase if these aren’t what the seller claims regardless.

[Johnny406]

I have build or re-cammed a few flat tappet engines in recent years. I've only used Rhoads lifters for HFT and Howards direct lube (EDM) for solids. I've been using Rotella with additional zinc suppliment for braking in and then Valvoline VR-1 for usage. I haven't been removing the inner springs but I'm thinking seriously of investing in the tools to make it easy/practical. Greg Merrick taught me this back in 2010 when he was helping me for Pinks-All-Out. Place a mirror or picture frame glass on the counter to check for taper on flat tappet cams. Flat/square is VERY bad as the lifter won't spin on the lobe in the bore. To date I haven't found a flat one yet, but...

I think it's real important to add that you ABSOLUTELY MUST prime the engine!! I'll rotate and prime the engine until I've had oil come out of every pushrod hole. I'll then take the motor to TDC watching the #1 intake rocker, then set the distributor.

[74Grandville]

Crower sft with crower lifters. Lucas muscle car 10w-30 oil. Correct valve spring pressure and geometry I’m sure helps.

I’ve had 2 failures in my life.

First was back in 2003 when I had no idea what I was doing and put used lifters on a used cam from different applications. I’m sure the culprit was the lifters. I should have used new lifters.

The second was due to a lifter that wasn’t spinning. There was a burr in the oil gallery in the lefter bore. A quick hit with a ball hone resolved that issue. Now I check to make sure everything moves when building.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[b-man]

Howard’s 71 gram tool steel solid flat tappet lifters - $721.95

https://www.jegs.com/i/Darrell+Russe...xoCkUsQAvD_BwE

Just to put things in perspective, I recently purchased a set of eight 51 gram tool steel solid lifters from a small German manufacturer for my next air-cooled VW engine build and paid $468 for the set.

You gotta pay up for the good stuff.

I know they’re not hydraulic but these could be an option for those who don’t want a roller lifter but want a flat tappet lifter that’s not soft.