[66sprint6]

Yesterday we switched to a different dipstick tube for our newly installed TH350. It was a huge pain. But the old one was leaking badly where it slipped into the tranny. We ordered this TCI "Trick stick"because of it's reputation for not leaking. And it does not leak now it's a huge relief. But the installation was difficult due to just the slightest difference in bends from the original. We massaged the heck out of it and then I see that the tab used to grab a bellhousing bolt is nowhere near anything bolt-able.
So I'm going to try again but at least the leak has stopped. The next one will definitely have the seal that looks like a hat at the tranny end of the tube not the O-ring.

[The Champ]

Originally Posted by Chief of the 60's

Here is some food for thought as well as looking at this from an economical angle. That car with any non-OD tranny will tach at around 3800 RPM at 55 mph. With an OD, that same car, same engine and same rear gear will tach at about 2200-2400 RPM at 55 mph.

Sorry, late to this party...

In what alternative universe to you live in Chief?

With tires close to the OE tire height (27" - maybe a common 255/60/15 ), with a non overdrive transmission will tach a little over 2400 RPM at 55 MPH.

Even with 26" tall tires (say a 235/60/15), that car would only hit a little over 2500 RPM.

Or if it was being run with 14" wheels with the widest available 245/60/14's (25.6" tall), it would only be reading 2566 RPM at 55 MPH.

To hit 3800 RPM, the tires would have to be around 17" tall or the car.

Can I point out that the car would be traveling over 80 MPH with the 245/60/14's or 86 MPH with the 27" tires.

The amount of incorrect information you post here is legendary. I won't even go into the other wildly inaccurate info you have posted in this thread...

Carry on, I need the laughs...

[Chief of the 60's]

Laughs is what I get from reading this ^ ^ ^ because I owned these cars when they were stock.

[242177P]

Originally Posted by Chief of the 60's

Laughs is what I get from reading this ^ ^ ^ because I owned these cars when they were stock.

Must not have been able to find high gear then?

[Chief of the 60's]

Originally Posted by 242177P

Must not have been able to find high gear then?

Par for the course. Canadian takes the advice of a Googling parts pusher.

[242177P]

Originally Posted by Chief of the 60's

... will tach at around 3800 RPM at 55 mph.

Wallace's calculator shows at 55mph a TH400 w/3.55s turns 3735 rpm in second gear (slightly more with convertor slippage).

Driver error?? Blame the machine.

[Chief of the 60's]

Originally Posted by Carmine

Hi everyone. My interest in some Pontiac years/models seems to be all over the charts for some reason. A little unsettled. Not sure why, but now I find myself looking at '66 GTO's. Many out there and prices seem to vary according to condition. I found a few of interest but was slightly turned off because they had automatic transmissions. Then I thought more about it. Getting older now and do I really want to shift a 4 speed?? I have other cars with 4 speeds already, so it's not like I would be missing anything. And I noticed that automatic equipped cars usually were priced cheaper. For no particular reason, I'm not a big proponent of any 2 speed automatic equipped car. I was wondering if it was possible and how difficult, to take out the 2 speed automatic transmission and replace it with lets say a TH350 or TH400. It would be a must to keep the original console and use the original shifter. I don't think I would have any interest in an overdrive transmission if I had to modify the transmission tunnel. Any thoughts would be appreciated, Carmine.

Originally Posted by 242177P

Wallace's calculator shows at 55mph a TH400 w/3.55s turns 3735 rpm in second gear (slightly more with convertor slippage).

Driver error?? Blame the machine.

Maybe now you can see it.

[242177P]

Originally Posted by Chief of the 60's

Maybe now you can see it.

Uh huh. Still not high gear.

How about you show us your math instead?

[meangene]

Originally Posted by Chief of the 60's

This would be a huge and expensive mistake.

i just had a friend put one in his 65 goat, (200r4) no mod in trans and he been running it now 3 month and he love it and he beats the hell out of it. (konwal455gto)

[meangene]

Originally Posted by Sirrotica

FWIW, the 4L80E was made from 1991-2013, tons of cores out there in GMC, chevy light duty trucks and medium duty motorhomes etc. Up to 18,000 lbs chassis. A stock 4L80e is nearly as strong as a built 200 is, more work initially, but reliability is worth something.

Art Carr would laugh at that statement/ https://www.cpttransmission.com/ is as nearly as strong as a built 200

[Sirrotica]

Originally Posted by meangene

Art Carr would laugh at that statement/ https://www.cpttransmission.com/

Really, maybe he'd better check out the torque ratings of a stock 4L80E!!

Anythime Art Carr wants to send me one of his 200s and I'll install it in my diesel dually and see if it makes 270,000 miles without failure. No doubt in my mind that even with $4000 dollars worth of billet parts and labor my diesel will have no trouble breaking it pulling a trailer and truck combo at 14,000 lbs. shifting through the gears at WOT.....

Seems in his advertising he also sells 4L80Es, there wouldn't be any need for him to build 4L80Es if a 200 will suffice, would there?

[meangene]

we replace them 4L80E in are company plow trucks all the time and i sure are Art would sell you one /and we where talking a better fit, no computer to run the 200r4

[Sirrotica]

Originally Posted by meangene

we replace them 4L80E in are company plow truck all the time and i sure are Art would sell you one

I don't need one, at 270,000 miles its just fine, BTW it's a K3500 and I use it to plow, tow, everything and anything, still going strong. Maybe you need someone that knows how to plow snow, replace the operator instead of replacing transmissions.

Why aren't you replacing the 4L80E with a 200, they must be stronger according to you and Art, right? Why is Art selling 4L80Es?

You'll never convince me that a 200 is stronger than a 4L80E, but hey knock yourself out. Doubtful that any person with a grip on reality would side with you, but maybe you can convince someone of it.

Next you'll be telling me a Dynaflo is stronger than a 4L80E......……………….LMAO Now it's my turn to laugh...…………….

[Sirrotica]

I'm going to bed, it's midnight here, blast away.

[meangene]

Not trying to convince anybody, just point out thing like plate you will need to bolt it up to your Pontiac, computer to shift , and a driveshaft, the 200 has a lot more going for it and you probably have a 4L85E in your dually because 4L80E we have don't hold up

[meangene]

It's a saturday night why go to bed so early, no hard feeling but Art builts good 200R4 for Pontiac that all i'm trying to say but hey put a 4L80E in if you want.

[Sirrotica]

Well gee, a $50 dollar plate, same if someone uses a 700.

An ECM which most modern transmissions use, it's not 1987 any longer. In my statement I did say that it's more work and money to convert to a 4L80E initially, but worth it in my estimation because of the added reliability. If electronics scare you maybe time to find another hobby, because fuel injection is quickly overtaking carburetors in this hobby.

A stock 4L80e is nearly as strong as a built 200 is, more work initially, but reliability is worth something.

There is a kit to make the 80 a full manual transmission negating the need for an ECM and a long time member here just installed a 80 with a full manual option in his 68 GTO and documented the install here on PY.

http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...d.php?t=823023

The 85 has one more planetary gear in it than an 80 does, 5 as opposed to 4, other than that it's virtually the same. Both transmissions use the internals of the tried and true T400, the standby for most all over 400 cubic inch Pontiac cars built until 1976 It was also used in one ton chevy trucks until 1990, when GM debuted the 4L80E in 1991.

A probably mostly unknown fact is the there is absolutely no usage of a 200 in any trucks, not even an S 10 in their short run of less than 10 years. I have a good 200 core in an 84 GP, but I would never use it behind a 455 Pontiac after researching them, some people buy into the hype, I don't.

A 4l80E, it's a 400 with overdrive. BTW, I do have a 4L80E because after 50 years of wrenching, I do know what is in my own vehicles. It's a 1993 and there wasn't a 85 available in that year, not until 2002.

And finally a quote from Jake of Jakes Performance that used to build 200s and has switched over to 4L80Es because he knows that the 200s, as well as other GM transmissions, the 200 just aren't that reliable.

Have you broken a Level II, V, or MXXVII 4L60E that is supposedly 700 HP capable with 450 HP? Multiple times? Have you ever read a build list for a 4L60E/65/70 and wondered why it sounded like everything in the trans was replaced for a performance build? That is because it’s the wrong unit to use in a big power application. We’re not here to mislead you. We could build and sell a very well built 4L60E that would compete with anybody’s on the market. But there is more demand for 4L80s, so business wise, it makes sense to pursue that market. We specialize in 4L80Es because we KNOW it is the only real option for REAL power with reliability.
Other builders are afraid to cut into their sales and tell you this. We’re not. We just want to be sure you get the strongest option available at the best price the first time. If this makes sense to you, take a look at our 4L80E options below.
The 4L80E is the descendant of the “Ole Reliable” TH400 transmission. It shares many components and design features. At Jake’s Performance the 4L80E is our most popular transmission. We have built them for applications ranging from heavy towing vehicles to 1800+ HP street/strip cars. The 4L80E has proven reliable like it’s predecessor.
Most of our development time is spent on the 4L80E. Look for some innovative new products in the near future that should make the 4L80E even stronger.
As with all Jake’s Performance transmissions they start with a select core that is disassembled, the case is hot tanked, pressure washed, inspected, painted and prepped for reassembly. They include all new friction clutches, bands, steel plates, soft parts, filter, modulator (if applicable), as well as hydraulic upgrades, bearings added at several thrust locations, and other modifications depending on power level.
We have established ourselves in the industry with our exclusive innovative 4L80E valve body designs whether we use our in house recalibration kit, or one of our transbrakes.

Research OD options, like I did for half a year and you'll find that dollar per dollar it's tough to beat a 4L80E for constant reliability. If you want to believe that a design that was intended for small V8s and 6 cylinders is just as tough as a 80, spend your money on a 200, I won't.

It's my opinion, and I'd never consider a 200 for rough usage, mostly because I hate to do things over again. Anyone else, feel free to spend your money as you wish.

If Art Carr has the bulletproof 200s then why does he offer 4L80Es too? Just asking that for a friend...….. Same as Chris at CK transmissions, he also offers 4L80Es on his site, I wonder why??

[The Champ]

Originally Posted by Chief of the 60's

Laughs is what I get from reading this ^ ^ ^ because I owned these cars when they were stock.

You might have owned some, but did you drive them and look at your tach at 55 MPH?

You sound like a kid who is an expert at video games, but no experience with the real thing.

There was never a stock 3.55 geared car that hit 3800 RPM at 55 MPH in high gear as you claimed and your post wasn't referring to a "stock" car anyway.

Are you sure you weren't calculating a 5.55 geared car?

Here is some food for thought as well as looking at this from an economical angle. That car with any non-OD tranny will tach at around 3800 RPM at 55 mph. With an OD, that same car, same engine and same rear gear will tach at about 2200-2400 RPM at 55 mph.

http://www.csgnetwork.com/multirpmcalc.html

This is to a gearing calculator that gives the RPM's for a standard automatic, an overdrive automatic, a standard manual and an 5 spd overdrive manual at whatever speed you want by inputting the tire height and the rear end gear.

The results for a 27" tire on a 3.55 rear geared vehicle at 55 MPH in high gear:

Auto 2495

AOD 1701

Manual 2430

5 Speed 1944

Not a single one is 3800 RPM. The OD trannies are 200 - 700 RPMS lower that what you claimed and the non OD trannies are very close to what you claimed the OD trannies would be.

Now insert all the same info with 5.55 gearing:

Auto 3900

AOD 2659

Manual 3799

5 Speed 3039

It's simple math. Why deny the truth?

Your continued refusal to deny the facts to try and validate your grossly inaccurate input in this thread is nauseating.

And just for your information - comparing the RPM of a ST300 in high gear (2nd gear in an ST 300 is high gear) to a TH400 in second gear just might be most outlandish thing you've ever done.

[Chief of the 60's]

Originally Posted by Sirrotica

Really, maybe he'd better check out the torque ratings of a stock 4L80E!!

Anythime Art Carr wants to send me one of his 200s and I'll install it in my diesel dually and see if it makes 270,000 miles without failure. No doubt in my mind that even with $4000 dollars worth of billet parts and labor my diesel will have no trouble breaking it pulling a trailer and truck combo at 14,000 lbs. shifting through the gears at WOT.....

Seems in his advertising he also sells 4L80Es, there wouldn't be any need for him to build 4L80Es if a 200 will suffice, would there?

He doesn't know what he is talking about. I have trannys built by Art Carr, he knows his chit and certainly would agree with you.

[Chief of the 60's]

Originally Posted by meangene

we replace them 4L80E in are company plow trucks all the time and i sure are Art would sell you one /and we where talking a better fit, no computer to run the 200r4

Funniest thing I have read all day.