[71 T/A]

Melling sells an SPC5, which is close to the original 067 cam.
Does anyone have or know who sells a correct 067 cam?
Looking to do a stock rebuild on my nos. matching 68 GTO 400 motor.

[77 TRASHCAN]

Yes, Butler does, now.
Their line of Ram Air cams.
They offer the 067, 068, 744, and the 041 cams in HFT versions AND hydraulic roller versions. Made for them by Comp.
There’s been some publicity here, about them, although not a lot.

[jamaca85]

spotts performance...online or on ebay

[PunchT37]

Those cams are what they call “067” cams. The specs are not factory.

[74Grandville]

spc-5 does not = 067. best bet would be to retard it 5-6 degrees and you'll be close.

[unruhjonny]

I had heard that this grind is not made, then I saw some literature (I printed it, but don't know where it is right now) that suggested it was being remade.
I will need one... eventually.

[1968GTO421]

Just curious as to why it matters whether a person uses an 066 or an 067 cam. both have the same lift/ intake duration and the 067 apppears to have 3 degrees more exhaust duration at .050 which doesn't register on the "butt dyno", perhaps on an engine dyno but not by much hp or torque. I've been doing cam swaps for over 50 years and it takes some noticeable changes in lift/duration to make a change in ET or mph at the track. FWIW, just curious. Thanks

http://www.pontiacpower.org/PontiacCams.htm

[77 TRASHCAN]

Originally Posted by 1968GTO421

Just curious as to why it matters whether a person uses an 066 or an 067 cam. both have the same lift/ intake duration and the 067 apppears to have 3 degrees more exhaust duration at .050 which doesn't register on the "butt dyno", perhaps on an engine dyno but not by much hp or torque. I've been doing cam swaps for over 50 years and it takes some noticeable changes in lift/duration to make a change in ET or mph at the track. FWIW, just curious. Thanks

http://www.pontiacpower.org/PontiacCams.htm

The sealedPower CS641 is the 066 cam. Nothing I’ve seen in their specs “ says” such. I checked the spec on it ears ago. It’s exact, and not expensive.

[i82much]

just buy an 041 and sand it down!

[steve25]

A better choice to use to have reground / sanded if you want call it would be the 068 since it has the same base circle .

[PontiacJim1959]

Originally Posted by 1968GTO421

Just curious as to why it matters whether a person uses an 066 or an 067 cam. both have the same lift/ intake duration and the 067 apppears to have 3 degrees more exhaust duration at .050 which doesn't register on the "butt dyno", perhaps on an engine dyno but not by much hp or torque. I've been doing cam swaps for over 50 years and it takes some noticeable changes in lift/duration to make a change in ET or mph at the track. FWIW, just curious. Thanks

http://www.pontiacpower.org/PontiacCams.htm

The differences are in the Intake/Exhaust Centerline and Lobe Separation Angle, as well as valve opening/closing events.

Intake Centerline: 066 -107 degrees, 067 -112, Exh: 066 -116, 067 -113
LSA: 066 - 111.5, 067 - 113
Overlap: 066 -55 degrees, 067 -54

[unruhjonny]

Originally Posted by PontiacJim1959

The differences are in the Intake/Exhaust Centerline and Lobe Separation Angle, as well as valve opening/closing events.

Intake Centerline: 066 -107 degrees, 067 -112, Exh: 066 -116, 067 -113
LSA: 066 - 111.5, 067 - 113
Overlap: 066 -55 degrees, 067 -54

Some of us want a 067 cam for being eligable for the Pure Stock Drags;
Running the 066 cam would definitely put me at a disadvantage.

[Steve C.]

https://www.psmcdr.com/

Camshaft

The camshaft must be correct for the year, model, and horsepower claimed for the type of lifter (hydraulic or solid). Roller cams NOT allowed. Duration at .050" lobe lift must be within 1% of factory specs. Lift at the valve must be within 2% of factory specs. Engines must be able to produce at least 16.0 inches of vacuum at 1200 rpm. However, some factory-produced engines were not able to generate 16.0 inches in showroom condition, so those cars will be given a variance to the rule. Solid-lifter cams lift checked at zero lash.


.

[77 TRASHCAN]

Originally Posted by unruhjonny

I had heard that this grind is not made, then I saw some literature (I printed it, but don't know where it is right now) that suggested it was being remade.
I will need one... eventually.

Bee quite awhile ago, what ever 067 replica being made, many touted as NOT a copy of the original.

Is this same thinking being applied to the Butler 067 cam?

Just making sure.

I can’t imagine Butler reproducing something that’s not the real deal...

[Steve C.]

Butler Exclusive Pontiac "067" Reproduction Hyd Cam

284/293
200/210
111 LSA


.

[Jay S]

Originally Posted by Steve C.

Butler Exclusive Pontiac "067" Reproduction Hyd Cam

284/293
200/210
111 LSA


.

Merry Christmas to the PY world

Appears to me that Butler is calling the 066 a 067. But who am I to question those guys.

According to one of Jim Hands old articles the 067 had a little over 2 degrees wider lsa than a 066. The 067 was retard 7 degrees more than a 066 ( that is a lot), plus to further the effect of the timing Pontiac added more seat timing and 3 more degrees of exhaust duration at .050. Exhaust opening events were nearly 10 degrees earlier on a 067 than a 066. 067 had a smoother, broader powerband than a 066. Doesn’t appear anyone makes a good off the self replica of it.

[Lee]

"Duration at .050" lobe lift must be within 1% of factory specs. Lift at the valve must be within 2% of factory specs."

So, that means the cam can have up to 202 intake and 215 exhaust, and lift can be ~0.415", right? Looking at Bullet's webpage, I'd use a H255/273 intake lobe (202@ .050", .273" lobe lift) and a H263/275 exhaust (215 & .275"). The 0.200" duration specs are 108/119, which I bet are WAY bigger than stock. Vacuum should be NO problem with lobes that size.

[Jay S]

The rules for durations are at the tappet and lift is out at the valve. If you can’t find the exact grind often it is possible run a little more lobe lift in pure stock and stay with in the duration rules. Actually rocker arm ratio may only be 1.48, which shows up at the valve, plus that 2% you have some wiggle room.

They did the rules in pure stock for a reason, some of the oem cams are not available. (a problem in more brands than just Pontiac).

[SD455DJ]

Hey Jonny, Steve C, Lee & Jay S (Merry Christmas!), As one of the PSMCDR organizers with Dan and Lyndon Hughes, I just want to set the record straight on what we are currently doing regarding camshafts allowed at the race. I have to say that we are not using the 1%/2% ruling any longer, but rather the 16 in. vacuum at 1200 rpm rule as the strict guideline as it is much easier to check and, quite frankly, rarely anyone that participates runs a truly factory stock cam anymore. We are going to update the cam rule this year (2021) to the above 16" at 1200 rpm in neutral. We have asked many of the racers, without any persecution or disqualification, what their camshaft specs were after they passed the 16" test. Most of the cams are within the a 5%-7% intake/10%-12% exhaust range of factory specs, sooo, an 067 cam could stretch to 210/224 degrees at 0.050" and .454"/.454", or more, theoretically. I've got a summit 2801 (214/224 @ .444"/.466") in my small valve XV 400 (330 hp with 066 cam) in the '70 Tempest and it makes the 16" @ 1200 rpm ruling easily (actually 20" with 9.95:1 compression). So this allows a lot of latitude with timing events, durations above .050", but the 16" is the determining factor. We will/can check valve lift fairly easily, but we only do that by request or we pull someone out to check their engine more closely if they are running exceptionally quick/fast.

With that said, when we had the "Certified" pure stock class, you had to run a cam at the 1%/2% rule and these cars were well built and ran just as quick as 95% of faster cars. So, while the cam is important, its not as important as a carefully built engine and a great exhaust system. A cam that meets the 16" requirement in one of these "certified" cars would maybe run a tenth, or two, quicker, so not the huge factor most people would think. Interestingly, the RAIV's run just as quick with the factory 041 as they do with custom cams. They are hard to improve on in the pure stock world.

I hope you guys aren't too disappointed by the change, and we want to encourage you to use the stock (or stock replacement) cams if that's your preference. I'm leaving the original factory 068 in my RAIII Formula when that engine gets rebuilt.

Dennis

[PontiacJim1959]

Originally Posted by Jay S

Merry Christmas to the PY world

Appears to me that Butler is calling the 066 a 067. But who am I to question those guys.

According to one of Jim Hands old articles the 067 had a little over 2 degrees wider lsa than a 066. The 067 was retard 7 degrees more than a 066 ( that is a lot), plus to further the effect of the timing Pontiac added more seat timing and 3 more degrees of exhaust duration at .050. Exhaust opening events were nearly 10 degrees earlier on a 067 than a 066. 067 had a smoother, broader powerband than a 066. Doesn’t appear anyone makes a good off the self replica of it.

Factory AMA specs Duration @ .050" from another spec sheet I have.


066 - Duration Int/Ex - 273/282
067 - Duration Int/Ex - 273/289

066 - Duration @ .050" - Int. 197 Ex. 206
067 - Duration @ .050" - Int. 197 Ex. 212

066 - Lift Int/Ex - .410/.414 plus/minus .011
067 - Lift Int/Ex - .410/.413 plus/minus .011

066 - Intake Open/Closes - 30/63
067 - Intake Open/Closes - 23/70

066 - Exhaust Open/Closes - 77/25
067 - Exhaust Open/Closes - 78/31

066 - LSA - 111.5
067 - LSA - 113