[Mezzo]

BWB, let me know when the samples are ready. I can PM my address. Thanks for all the work on this.

[necdb3]

Boy, The lighting and camera angle are really going to play havoc. It looks so much greener in the last pic.

[transam1972]

BWB..I can send you an intake manifold stud and one of those big chubby washers that held the intake manifold on..my car saw 14 seasons before it came off the road and I removed those parts to remove the intake...I replaced them with repos and saved the old hardware as keepsakes...they have a lot of original paint on them and they appear very unaffected by the time they spent doing there job for 58k..i can send you some right away for comparison purposes..just PM me your address, they can go out tomorrow..and they are yours to keep..I have been thinking of making a necklace with the other ones

[72TAMAN]

Hi guys

I have the pictures of my balancer that I painted last year with the plasti-kote # 208 and the pictures were taking at the same time but the color on the last one does not look the same as the first three pictures . The only thing that was done differently was the setting on my camera was set for close up and the picture was taking closer to the balancer. I may have played with the flash but everything else is the same , the pictures were taking within a minute of each other . This is just to show that the angle or flash or how close you take the picture will change the look of the color.

[transam1972]

glad to know I am not the only one whos Pontiac engine sports Plasti-Kote #208..now we need some pics of someones 75 Oldsmobile engine to compare

[necdb3]

Originally Posted by 72TAMAN

Hi guys

I have the pictures of my balancer that I painted last year with the plasti-kote # 208 and the pictures were taking at the same time but the color on the last one does not look the same as the first three pictures . The only thing that was done differently was the setting on my camera was set for close up and the picture was taking closer to the balancer. I may have played with the flash but everything else is the same , the pictures were taking within a minute of each other . This is just to show that the angle or flash or how close you take the picture will change the look of the color.

From those pictures, 208 has way too much blue.

[Bentwheelbob]

Well the painting is all done. I'll let it cure some and then I'll take some pictures and pass along some comments.

On another matter, My Pal Dave is here and we are working on the initial stages of putting an electric fuel pump on the Hemi Cuda. I've had vapor lock issues this summer that I hope is benefited by the electric fuel pump. My question is what should I consider the minimum distance between the tail pipe and the fuel line. The only place to really mount the pump is going to put the fuel line within 1.5 to 2.0 inches of the tailpipe right near where it exits the muffler. Is this ok?

Back to the paint - Pictures forthcoming.....

[njsteve]

Originally Posted by transam1972

glad to know I am not the only one whos Pontiac engine sports Plasti-Kote #208..now we need some pics of someones 75 Oldsmobile engine to compare

It is not the same as the 1975 Olds color. My Grandmother's 1975 Firebird has that weird metallic royal blue engine color. Bill Hirsch makes a perfect match for that color which isn't available in a spray can. Funny thing is that a buddy of mine with several Oldsmobiles took one look at my engine and told me that it was definitely the same Olds metallic blue that was on his engines.

Here's the link to Gramma's car engine color: http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...=gramma&page=4

[RicksGTO]

Originally Posted by transam1972

RICKS GTO I was reading some earlier posts, are you saying OEM engine paint is super close? if I knew about it I would have used it, maybe that's what I need..is the contest really between Scotts and OEM?

yes, I had some areas of my engine that had original paint, and I am aware of the fading with time, but comparing them to the OEM 62210 makes it look as close as I've seen on any motor. In fairness, I haven't seen the Tieman blend in person and can't say for sure on it. The camara/flash plays havoc on light blues so it will be really hard for people not attending the unveiling of the paint samples in person at Bentwheel Bob's BBQ, Beer, Bourbon and Body Shop to tell which is closest.

[Bentwheelbob]

All right, here we have a few pictures. I counsel the folks who work for me that I don't want them to be a bird dog.. What I mean is that I don't pay them to simply flush a bird up and say "look, there it is, take a shot if you want". I expect them to flush the bird, kill it, clean it, bring it home and then help cook it.

Well, I feel a little like a bird dog. Here they are...now what? We're still working on this Cuda, but I wanted to get a few pictures out. I'll talk about potential next steps later.

[Bentwheelbob]

Originally Posted by RicksGTO

yes, I had some areas of my engine that had original paint, and I am aware of the fading with time, but comparing them to the OEM 62210 makes it look as close as I've seen on any motor. In fairness, I haven't seen the Tieman blend in person and can't say for sure on it. The camara/flash plays havoc on light blues so it will be really hard for people not attending the unveiling of the paint samples in person at Bentwheel Bob's BBQ, Beer, Bourbon and Body Shop to tell which is closest.

I'm still in bird dog mode, but I intend to rip and section the sample boards and mail out to those with an interest. I would have loved to have you all here for the unveiling, but.... Obviously, there will be limits on how many pieces I have, but if you want a sample selection, send me a pm with your address.

Here's a few more pictures.

[necdb3]

It's amazing how different the colors look from different angles. (assuming they are always in the same order)

WOW! that's a tough call without being there. I'll take a stab at #4 being the closest but some of those pictures it looks off, but again, without being there WOW!

[Red Goat]

My hat's off to you, Bob! That's quite a bit of work.

I wouldn't benefit from getting any of the samples since I don't really have any original painted parts to compare to... but, I am keenly interested in what the more knowledgeable Pontiac guru's have to say as to what would be to most correct for:
1. '72 455 HO motor and
2. '73 455 SD motor

Thanks again for all this effort!

Cheers,
Tim

[Bentwheelbob]

Here is an inside and an outside shot with numbers. The order was slightly different.

Inside:




Outside:

[necdb3]

I wish I had a part with original paint on it. Can't wait to see what color is the winner.

My hat is off to you for all the effort you're putting into this!

Dave

[rustedgoat]

I pm my address to you. I'll try to match up with pieces that still have some virgin 71 paint on it. Colors in photos to appear different than in real life. I'm leaning toward 3,4 or 5 it depends on which image your looking at. Make sure samples are numbered so we can report back.

[fiedlerh]

If any research finds a better mix, I'll be glad to update the pontiacpower.org web page. One problem is that old mixes can't always be cross referenced to new paint mixing base colors.

I have never come across an official factory mix for the various 71 thru 74 colors. I believe Pontiac sourced engine paint in 55 gallon drums from a local company, since out of business. I suspect "close was good enough", so there may have been slight variations throughout the year.

If you want to paint your engine like Pontiac did, use cheap paint, leave the engine rusty and greasy, and put a blindfold on before you spray. You have 30 seconds to get it done. Of course, we all would want to do the best job possible on our own cars.

[Held for Ransom]

http://www.tcpglobal.com/aclchip.asp...ntiac-pg01.jpg
http://www.tcpglobal.com/aclchip.asp...ntiac-pg01.jpg
http://www.tcpglobal.com/aclchip.asp...ntiac-pg01.jpg
http://www.tcpglobal.com/aclchip.asp...ntiac-pg01.jpg
http://www.tcpglobal.com/aclchip.asp...ntiac-pg01.jpg

They list a formula number on PPG sheets in '73, '74 and '75. I'm assuming the paint is the later paint for '73, since the same number is on the '74 sheet. Nothing for 71/2.

[Bentwheelbob]

Originally Posted by RicksGTO

yes, I had some areas of my engine that had original paint, and I am aware of the fading with time, but comparing them to the OEM 62210 makes it look as close as I've seen on any motor. In fairness, I haven't seen the Tieman blend in person and can't say for sure on it. The camara/flash plays havoc on light blues

I'll be happy to send you some samples and would be interested in hearing the results of your comparison. Send me a PM with a mailing address if your interested.

Originally Posted by transam1972

BWB..I can send you an intake manifold stud and one of those big chubby washers that held the intake manifold on..my car saw 14 seasons before it came off the road and I removed those parts to remove the intake...I replaced them with repos and saved the old hardware as keepsakes...they have a lot of original paint on them and they appear very unaffected by the time they spent doing there job for 58k..i can send you some right away for comparison purposes...

Glenn - thanks for the offer. I'll send you the samples and let you report back your thoughts on the comparison. I'll include my return address and if you you want to forward some original paint parts that would be great.

Originally Posted by 'ol Pinion head

The formula you have listed as the Pontiac Power Formula, is it the one Horst Fiedler contributed?

I should have another pair of original valve covers off a 4,000 mile original '72. Know I still have the original engine out of that car & it has not been exposed to setting outside in the sunlight. Not sure if those components have had enough heat cycles to color shift or not. Was not concerned with that when I bought that particular Lux LeMans for parts.

Heat cycling brings out more of a green tint & thats is what we are seeing in one sample.. The other extreme, I often run across on the '71-early '73 paint is with the hood off on a parts/project car, or an engine setting in a core pile, the engine enamel tends to fade (bleach out) quite quickly.

OPH - the Pontiac Power formula is the one that is listed on Feidler's website. The only difference was that I could not get it mixed in PPG Delstar locally, only PPG Shop-Line. I would love to send you some samples for comparison to the 4000 mile valve covers. Send me a PM with mailing information and I'll ship them your way. Alternatively, I will PM my information to you and you can send me the valve covers. I think I like that idea...

Originally Posted by fiedlerh

If any research finds a better mix, I'll be glad to update the pontiacpower.org web page. One problem is that old mixes can't always be cross referenced to new paint mixing base colors.

I have never come across an official factory mix for the various 71 thru 74 colors. I believe Pontiac sourced engine paint in 55 gallon drums from a local company, since out of business. I suspect "close was good enough", so there may have been slight variations throughout the year.

If you want to paint your engine like Pontiac did, use cheap paint, leave the engine rusty and greasy, and put a blindfold on before you spray. You have 30 seconds to get it done. Of course, we all would want to do the best job possible on our own cars.

Fiedler - thanks for your comments - you have characterized this insanity very well. I appreciate the resource you provide at PontiacPower and will stay in touch as this progresses. I am also sending you a PM.


Anyone else have some near virgin parts with original paint? Let me know and I will be happy to send out samples in exchange for feedback. As indicated, at some point I will post formulas for several of the paints so that you can get them mixed locally and aerosolized if you choose.

[Judge273]

All I can say is wow Bob, nice work and good food too!!

I took my oil cap samples to see what the differences were and again the colors are not the same or close.



One is the Tiemann, Rattle can 208, and a original patina cap (not in that order). Your sample leads me to guess 1 is 208, 4 is Tiemann but w/o real samples it is hard to tell.