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Old 11-05-2019, 05:02 PM
Hank Hank is offline
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Default 64 Exhaust clearance problem

I put a 66 389 with 093 head in my 64 with factory 64 manifolds. ALL mounts are correct. Drivers side manifold is laying on the rag joint, Any suggestions?
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Old 11-05-2019, 05:27 PM
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I've seen several posts indicating that you can move the engine left or right by loosening the mounts and jacking in the direction you want. Have you tried that? This may solve the problem.

There should be no clearance problem with your 093 heads and log manifolds.

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Old 11-05-2019, 06:34 PM
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Default clearance

Yes i did do that, it's up as far as it can go on drivers side. I'm baffled .

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Old 11-05-2019, 08:40 PM
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It is not uncommon for the frame to sag up front, especially with engines as heavy as these Pontiacs are. Could also be frame damage from a prior accident.

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Old 11-05-2019, 08:42 PM
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Default clearance problem

Never been hit, no sag. Car is solid as a rock

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Old 11-05-2019, 08:47 PM
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Default clearance

This thing was a 6 cyl. car and has manual steering.

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Old 11-05-2019, 09:10 PM
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Could the transmission mount be too tall?

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Old 11-05-2019, 09:12 PM
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Default clearance

No its the right tranny mount. Motor has the correct drop to it

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Old 11-05-2019, 09:21 PM
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Some 1/4” thick spacers under the motor mount frame stands should give you the clearance you need.

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Old 11-05-2019, 10:14 PM
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How do you discount crossmember sag? A local reputable alignment shop told me this is common to all A bodies & F bodies. How else could this interference be explained?

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Old 11-05-2019, 10:22 PM
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Default clearance problem

Wouldn't think a 6 cyl would have sag it that much.

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Old 11-05-2019, 10:38 PM
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A six isn’t that much lighter than some of the small V8s offered in the A and F cars (sb Chevy) so no matter what was mounted between the rails they all sag to some degree.

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Old 11-06-2019, 07:40 AM
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A shorter trans mount may still help. It was common for the drive shaft to hit the tunnel floor, and that was one of the fixes. Tom Vaught was looking for a shorter mount recently. I think that was why he wanted it.

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Old 11-06-2019, 08:16 AM
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On my '65 with it's original 389 I tried two different sets of motor mounts. The motor did bolt in slightly lower with the one set, but definately not as low your picture shows. I have 093 heads on it now and the exhaust manifold to rag joint clearance is 3/4". How are the clearances on the passenger side?

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Old 11-06-2019, 09:22 AM
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I would try loosening and moving the steering wheel over to the left. Grinding the manifold down and shimming the motor mount..

The clearances on these cars are crude by todays standards.. They all need extra frame support under the radiator. They way they have the steering box hanging out there on one frame rail is a joke... SC&C sells the piece you need.. I'm putting one on my car during this winters tear down..
https://scandc.com/product/scc-heavy...evelle-gs-442/


Last edited by 389; 11-06-2019 at 09:28 AM.
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Old 11-06-2019, 09:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hank View Post
Wouldn't think a 6 cyl would have sag it that much.
You use the proper frame mount perches ?

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Old 11-06-2019, 10:02 AM
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The frame I used under my Chevelle wagon (same basic frame) had a small little Chevy small block all if its life before I got it. A Chevy small block weighs less than any GM 6 cylinder by the way. It had some frame sag which we addressed while the car was in the body shop. The guy also had a frame jig so he checked it out and made some minor adjustments so we'd have a strong platform for building the car. My point being, you can't SEE frame sag in and of itself but it sure does crop up with issues like yours or when you try to get an alignment. Why do you you think the aftermarket came out with offset cross shafts for those A-body upper control arms? To compensate for the sag almost all of them have.

Honestly, the best way to cure your problem is to visit a shop with a frame machine, have it measured and have the front tweaked a bit back into spec. It doesn't take much work and makes for a better platform overall. As it stands I'll bet that side of the car needs a huge pack of shims to get the alignment anywhere close, another sure sign of frame sag.

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Old 11-06-2019, 01:21 PM
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We have the frame sag problem on our '68 Firebird. It is severe enough to prevent proper front end alignment. All else is completed on the car. What will happen to front sheet metal alignment is we have the sag corrected?
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Old 11-06-2019, 03:16 PM
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Body mount holes have a lot of room to play built into them. If you want to have the frame adjusted with the car all together, it would be best to loosen all the sheetmetal mounts prior to adjustment. Or better yet, pull the whole front clip off. You could just pull the radiator support and leave the fenders attached to the cowl to preserve your door/fender/cowl alignment. The amount the frame needs to move to restore spec and allow for a proper alignment isn't really that much. You may need a few more shims here and there but most if not all of the change should be able to be absorbed by the rubber body mounts' compliance. You are moving the frame horns out more than down and we are only talking about a movement of (probably) less than three-quarters of an inch.

Be aware that finding a shop with a frame machine and someone who knows how to use it can be tough nowadays and for you another problem is that the nice finish you probably already have on the frame will get scuffed up a bit. But that's easy enough to fix after the fact.


Last edited by Rich-Tripower; 11-06-2019 at 03:32 PM.
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Old 11-06-2019, 08:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cardo View Post
A shorter trans mount may still help. It was common for the drive shaft to hit the tunnel floor, and that was one of the fixes. Tom Vaught was looking for a shorter mount recently. I think that was why he wanted it.
I have plenty of clearance for my rag joint. I have no issues with the frame/etc.

I have a Doug Nash 5 speed trans in my 64 GTO with a Lakewood scatter shield.
The Nash Trans rear mount sits lower in the vehicle (when the engine install angle is correct).

I was looking for a shorter trans mount because of that, not because I had frame sag or other issues with the engine/frame installation.

From the Installation Manual:

To install the 5-speed, a new cross-member must be fabricated. The transmission mount
has to be moved to the rear 2.25”, and since the motor and transmission angle down, the
mount will have to be .38” lower. THAT was why I was looking for a shorter trans mount.


Tom V.

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Last edited by Tom Vaught; 11-06-2019 at 08:38 PM.
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