[FHC1971]

My 1971 Firebird Formula 400 came with the Y99 option. 15" Rally II wheels. My question is "What are JW wheels going for?" I find the 15x7 JW wheels were used on Firebirds from 70-72. I'm working on bringing her back to factory.

[Ramairnacho]

Did it come with trim.rings too? If it had trim rings you can not tell if it's a 73 on up rally 2 or jw kr . Jw aren't cheap. My formula came with 14 x 7 cl but I nabbed a set of 73 rally 2 15 x 7 with trim ring I might run. You can also buy a repop set of jw style rims I have read that arent all rusty and crusty. Im.no expert but enjoy the hobby. Good luck finding your correct rims and hope it don't break the bank. There is also date codes on them close to value stem. Post more info on your car too.

[FHC1971]

Build sheet says trim rings.

[keith k]

Originally Posted by Ramairnacho

Did it come with trim.rings too? If it had trim rings you can not tell if it's a 73 on up rally 2 or jw kr . Jw aren't cheap. My formula came with 14 x 7 cl but I nabbed a set of 73 rally 2 15 x 7 with trim ring I might run. You can also buy a repop set of jw style rims I have read that arent all rusty and crusty. Im.no expert but enjoy the hobby. Good luck finding your correct rims and hope it don't break the bank. There is also date codes on them close to value stem. Post more info on your car too.

All Formulas had trim rings, regardless of whether the Rally IIs were 14" or 15". Within the Firebird lineup, Rally II's without trim rings were a Trans Am only thing.

And yes, even with rings, it's pretty easy to spot the difference between the JW/KR/KN wheels and the '73+ style, if you know what to look for.

FHC1971, depending on when your car was built, it might have had KRs instead of JWs. I think some early '71s got JWs, then they switched over to KRs (visually identical, but different code).

[Ramairnacho]

I was told the trim rings cover the part that tell them apart. Not arguing I apologize for my mistake. But a nice set of later rally 2 and a good wod of extra funds for other things is also an option. Did the 71 400 have ram air option? The interesting thing is my friends 1970 ta has original jw and trim. Rings, he gave he 1 original one because he got a nos set. I haven't seen his phs docs but believe you could order a ta with trim rings. Am I wrong again?

[Transamric]

Keith, you didn't factor KN coded wheels into your timeline.
My May '71 TA had KN's but the Build Sheet shows JW's. Giles said he's seen that before.

[Norwood]

Originally Posted by Ramairnacho

Am I wrong again?

the center section of the JW is the same as the center used on the 14 inch wheel thus giving it its unique look. The 73 and up wheel has its own larger center making them easily identifiable. Also the trim rings changed in 73 to match the larger center.

[Ramairnacho]

Yes the section is a 14 inch and spokes might have slightly different dimensions but putting early center cap and early trim.with correct paint color should look fine and save him.alot of money. A set of nice 73 on up cost about 600 to 1k depending on condition and a set of correct early rally 2 rims probably 3k rusty junk and if you calculated the restoration process and Shipping its another easy 1500. So correct rims are about 5k with correct repop bolts , trim ring ect. Next question is what's that car worth and owners plans. I'm no expert but know trying to be 100% original is expensive and in some case might not be worth it. This is what im.running and I used the money I saved for other parts like new dash and electric harness.

[Norwood]

70-72 15 inch trim ring dosen’t fit 73 up wheel correctly because of the increased size of the center. Maybe that’s why a new ring was made to fit the new wheel in 73. Just a thought. ��

['ol Pinion head]

Unless you're extremely lucky or have endless funds, if the '71 Formula is a driver/ local showcar, best alternatives are:

-Recreated small center 15x7 Rally II's. Several long time vendors have had them made over the years. You get the JW-KN-KR look without the deep expense. Today, expect $1500 -2100 in expense for 4 bare wheels, not painted. In the late 90's I had a fellow in N TX make 3 sets. I provided all the cores. Back then the machining & jig welding was not that crazy an expense. Being out on the road a lot, dropping off & picking up also saved some cash. Am currently looking for another regional source to do this process & recreate some more. Have enough cores just need a competent source.

'73+ 15x7 Rally II's. Even these have become expensive in high exposure for sale venues. expect a friendly $275-400 a set. Correctly stripped & detailed, more. Shipping is the killer.

Trim rings for JW-KN-KR style wheel. There is a reproduction Chevrolet trim ring that works well, though the hole for the valve stem is shaped wrong & us serious guys immediately notice it. For my '72 T/A. I sourced NOS & a variety of extremely nice used original GM trim rings. For the last decade this style of NOS trim ring have been very expensive. Everything is expensive, just way it goes.

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[Ramairnacho]

This question should also help you. To the group Is black or red center caps correct? If parts from 69 where used on 70 the black caps correct or all red? It's a valid question I like the arrow but if these fit on mine I'm running with a repop of these. These in pic I believe are nos and expensive.

[necdb3]

71 would have red caps.

[Ramairnacho]

When was change over from black to red? Did 70 have both and all 71 - 72 have red?

[necdb3]

I believe the cut off date was somewhere around Dec 69. Cars before got black, cars after got red. Someone may have a bulletin stating a date but that should be pretty close.

[unruhjonny]

Originally Posted by necdb3

I believe the cut off date was somewhere around Dec 69. Cars before got black, cars after got red. Someone may have a bulletin stating a date but that should be pretty close.

this is spot-on;
all 1970-1972 Firebirds with Rally II's would have had red PMD caps;
1970 GTO's could have black or red depending on the build date.

[Ramairnacho]

This was given to me by my friend and is off his jw rim. I thinks it's original but not sure. His jw have trim rings he said. I believe it's original but I'm not an expert

[Ramairnacho]

And this is a shine chrome one on my rally 2 73-79 style. I think they repop but again im.not sure. Hope experts can help with this then you know what to look for when dropping 3 to 8 k on rims. As a boy I liked 15 inch enki and American racing centerline style polished out on bf 255/50. Not 265/50 scraped in the front on my 73 formula 400 with a 455 I built as a teenager. 17 or 18 inch modern American mags with tubular suspension will look nice too and you will have extra for shocks but not stock. I think.its called resto mod.

[Tellyshavilli]

Originally Posted by FHC1971

My 1971 Firebird Formula 400 came with the Y99 option. 15" Rally II wheels. My question is "What are JW wheels going for?" I find the 15x7 JW wheels were used on Firebirds from 70-72. I'm working on bringing her back to factory.

I have used trim rings for JW and KR wheels

[71GP76TA]

Are JW/KR rings same as Oldsmobile?

['ol Pinion head]

No, the '74-77 Olds 15x7 trim ring has a step on both the outside edge & on the inner edge before the drop down the slope. Have put a few nice sets of those together over the years.

Ignacio, what your friend gave you is incorrect for the early Pontiac 15" Rally II. On the correct trim ring, the valvestem hole is a true OVAL, same shape as used on early 14x7 Rally II trim rings.