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#81
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Lobe numbers and specs are listed. The minor variances are due to matching to exact lobes in Comp's database. The TMC valve timings with the monster rocker ratios are impressive. Also clearly Dynomation 6 cam3 did its job with that lobe lift and 1.8 rockers. Power and valve trace graphs provided for cam 1 and cam3. Cam1 are the dark traces. TMC Cam 1 --------- 2.1 intake rocker 2.0 exhaust rocker. 109 LSA - 105.5 IC. Intake 13086 296 246 168 .366 Exhaust 13145 302 250 171 .363 4500 to 6500 avg = 608 HP. Peak 678 HP at 6500. -------------------------------------------------------- Cam 2 - 1.65 rockers. 112 LSA - 112 IC Intake 13462 311 259 179 .399 Exhaust 13491 319 265 183 .389 4500 to 6500 avg = 580 HP. Peak 671 HP at 6750 ------------------------------------------------------------ Cam 3 - 1.8 Rockers. 107.5 LSA - 105 IC. Intake 13964 315 263 182 .384 Exhaust 13492 321 267 185 .389 4500 to 6500 avg = 603 HP. Peak 677 HP at 6500 |
#82
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Thanks for the information. I have am updating the PON_HRT.xls file (I will send you the update when I am done). I have 2 cam if you can run them. Thanks Stan
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Stan Weiss/World Wide Enterprises Offering Performance Software Since 1987 http://www.magneticlynx.com/carfor/carfor.htm David Vizard & Stan Weiss' IOP / Flow / Induction Optimization - Cam Selection Software http://www.magneticlynx.com/DV Download FREE 14 Trial IOP / Flow Software http://www.magneticlynx.com/DV/Flow_..._Day_Trial.php Pontiac Pump Gas List http://www.magneticlynx.com/carfor/pont_gas.htm Using PMD Block and Heads List http://www.magneticlynx.com/carfor/pont_pmd.htm |
#83
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Cool Stan, thanks. The monster rockers combo are still the winner over these two new cams. Looking at a valve lift curve comparison shows much meat missing from the flanks. Dark traces are the 2.1 / 2.0 rocker combo (TMC1 above), light trace is the .444 lobes with 1.72 / 1.67 lobes 13455 / 13457 245 / 249 @ .050 109 LSA - 105.5 Rockers 1.92 / 1.86 Avg from 4500 to 6500 = 595 HP. Peak 656 @ 6500 RPM. -------------------------------------------------------------------- lobes 13982 / 13984 - .444 109 LSA / 105.5 247 / 251 @ .050 Rockers 1.72 / 1.67 Avg from 4500 to 6500 = 591 HP. Peak 647 @ 6500 RPM. |
#84
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Since we're doing these sims, Pasty Chef i have a cam sitting on the self im curious about. It's SR 286-299adv 258-269@.050 .466-.465 lobe 112ls 108lc meant for 1.65 rockers. Im sure you probably need more info but that's what's on the cam. Just wondering how it stacks up
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#85
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I found some lobes that line up close to those numbers. Intake lobe 12907 286 259 186 .465 ------------- Exhaust lobe 12300 297 269 195 .465 1.65 Rocker - .020 lash. 112 LSA - 108 IC. Avg 4500 to 6500 = 603 HP. Peak HP 675 @ 6500, 671 @ 6750 |
#86
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Mike,
When you have time. Can you run this SR? Thanks, Stan
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Stan Weiss/World Wide Enterprises Offering Performance Software Since 1987 http://www.magneticlynx.com/carfor/carfor.htm David Vizard & Stan Weiss' IOP / Flow / Induction Optimization - Cam Selection Software http://www.magneticlynx.com/DV Download FREE 14 Trial IOP / Flow Software http://www.magneticlynx.com/DV/Flow_..._Day_Trial.php Pontiac Pump Gas List http://www.magneticlynx.com/carfor/pont_gas.htm Using PMD Block and Heads List http://www.magneticlynx.com/carfor/pont_pmd.htm |
#87
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#88
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Performance trends between different components will line up most of the time. Stan, I'll run that solid roller later today. |
#89
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Years ago I used the Performance Trends Engine Analyzer v3.0 and found you needed to manipulate some of the input in order to provide results to mimic actual engine dyno sheets. It was a learning curve.
Example, how much to input for carb cfm. I was using a worked HP950 at the time and used around 823-825 cfm for input if I remember correctly. And how much loss in total cfm air flow with the intake and carb attached was important. And when you enter a specific static compression ratio into the program, it did not "know" if that input was for iron heads or aluminium heads in use. In a real engine situation the results would be different using the two different situations. Intake runner volume. Actual flow curve on the cylinder heads. Etc. Also using the "Standard" or "SAE" Dyno settings made a difference. Using the Standard setting gave much higher numbers.
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'70 TA / 505 cid / same engine but revised ( previous best 10.63 at 127.05 ) Old information here: http://www.hotrod.com/articles/0712p...tiac-trans-am/ Sponsor of the world's fastest Pontiac powered Ford Fairmont (engine) 5.14 at 140 mph (1/8 mile) , true 10.5 tire, stock type suspension https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qDoJnIP3HgE Last edited by Steve C.; 08-11-2020 at 09:15 AM. |
#90
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On one example of a proposed cam mentioned here it had a .3600" lobe lift on the intake side and the software suggested a very high rocker ratio to obtain maximum valve lift. On some of these programs topping the list regarding output is often valve lift, and for a good reason. The engine wants all the lift it can, but often noted the valve lift figures provided indicate engine requirement but may not be mechanically achievable or prohibitive because of cost limitations.
A rhetorical question and something to consider. Do you want to obtain this max lift with less lobe lift and a higher rocker ratio or more lobe lift and less rocker ratio. Example, the .3600" lobe lift posted vs another lobe mentioned with .4000" lobe lift. Both rated with the same 246 degrees duration at .050" lift. .
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'70 TA / 505 cid / same engine but revised ( previous best 10.63 at 127.05 ) Old information here: http://www.hotrod.com/articles/0712p...tiac-trans-am/ Sponsor of the world's fastest Pontiac powered Ford Fairmont (engine) 5.14 at 140 mph (1/8 mile) , true 10.5 tire, stock type suspension https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qDoJnIP3HgE |
#91
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Many years ago Audie Thomas who helped on the early development stated a correct full valve lift curve is mandatory to try and predict the gas flows. Last edited by pastry_chef; 08-11-2020 at 10:05 AM. |
#92
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Was that cam tested in this combination or a different engine? Can you share what the HP was and at what RPM? Stan
__________________
Stan Weiss/World Wide Enterprises Offering Performance Software Since 1987 http://www.magneticlynx.com/carfor/carfor.htm David Vizard & Stan Weiss' IOP / Flow / Induction Optimization - Cam Selection Software http://www.magneticlynx.com/DV Download FREE 14 Trial IOP / Flow Software http://www.magneticlynx.com/DV/Flow_..._Day_Trial.php Pontiac Pump Gas List http://www.magneticlynx.com/carfor/pont_gas.htm Using PMD Block and Heads List http://www.magneticlynx.com/carfor/pont_pmd.htm |
#93
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They can show trends that can you in the right track though.
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68 GTO,3860# Stock Original 400/M-20 Muncie,3.55’s 13.86 @ 100 Old combo: 462 10.75 CR,,SD 330CFM Round Port E's,Old Faithful cam,Jim Hand Continental,3.42's. 1968 Pontiac GTO : 11.114 @ 120.130 MPH New combo: 517 MR-1,10.8 CR,SD 350CFM E's,QFT 950/Northwind,246/252 HR,9.5” 4000 stall,3.42's 636HP/654TQ 1.452 10.603 @ 125.09 http://www.dragtimes.com/Pontiac-GTO...lip-31594.html |
#94
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My comment about the sim showing less wasn't meant as a dig at the software just an observation |
#95
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I was just looking to get the specs for the engine in which the cam was tested. In most simulations keeping everything constant and just increasing the CR will cause the simulation to show an increase in torque and HP. Stan
__________________
Stan Weiss/World Wide Enterprises Offering Performance Software Since 1987 http://www.magneticlynx.com/carfor/carfor.htm David Vizard & Stan Weiss' IOP / Flow / Induction Optimization - Cam Selection Software http://www.magneticlynx.com/DV Download FREE 14 Trial IOP / Flow Software http://www.magneticlynx.com/DV/Flow_..._Day_Trial.php Pontiac Pump Gas List http://www.magneticlynx.com/carfor/pont_gas.htm Using PMD Block and Heads List http://www.magneticlynx.com/carfor/pont_pmd.htm |
#96
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1966, Dyno Don, "young man, there is no such thing as street and strip, buy one car and build it for one thing"....
Nothing more miserable then trying to drive a drag car on the street for extended periods of time... |
#97
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Slowbird has higher tolerance for large cams than most.
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#98
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Lol very true
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#99
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The engine had 11:1 compression.
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#100
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Intake 11468 Exhaust 11470 252 / 256 @ .050 111 LSA - 107.5 IC Rockers 1.92 / 1.86 - .020 lash. Peak 663 @ 6500 RPM - 663 @ 6750 4500 to 6500 avg = 595 HP. Another metric 255 / 259 dur @ .050 valve lift. ---------------------------------------------------------------- For a few of the combinations I looked at duration @ .050 VALVE LIFT. TMC cam 1 with 2.1 / 2.0 rockers = 269 / 271 dur @ .050 valve lift Brian .465 lobe solid cam with 1.65 rockers .020 lash = 259 / 268 dur @ .050 valve lift. ----------------------------- New combo. HXL 2231 intake, HXX 12203 exhaust. 270 / 274 @ .050 cam duration 108 LSA - 105 IC. 1.7 rockers - .020 lash. Top performance so far. Peak 684 @ 6500 RPM. Avg 4500 to 6500 = 612 HP. Duration @ .050 valve lift is also the highest - 270 / 274 dur @ .050 valve lift. |
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