[270win]

So I'm finally getting started on the redo of my 68' GTO. My goal is to make this GTO a better driving, faster and more reliable car than it was when new. Under the hood the motor will look fairly stock, all pontiac blue...Q-jet (I'm pretty sure) and all rubber hoses etc. But, the radiator will be aluminum and the trans will have it's own cooler, the lines for the trans will be steel braided/AN fittings. I'm planning to run a 2800+ stall converter so the added cooling will be needed. The motor will be a full roller motor but I'm not sure of the exact specs. I should know next week when my engine builder gets back from the PRI show. It's already got a 12 bolt with 3.73s but it needs to be gone through...nothing wrong with it, but I want to make sure it stays that way. Also, I'm going back with factory style AC since the car came with it.

The only thing I've already done is rebuild the entire front end with new everything, added power disk brakes, and new suspension from CPP all the way around. 1-1/2" lower and bigger sway bars, adjustable KYB shocks and stiffer springs...it stops on a dime and corners very nicely now.

Here are some suspension mod pics...camera phone so bear with me.

front disks-



rear suspension-



Oh, and I forgot, I did install a set of RAIII cast gray ceramic coated exhaust manifolds...I'll get a pic of those up soon.

Here's a pic of how I ran the tranny cooler lines in my Nova, plan to do the same in this car as it worked great!
Here is is prior to the motor going in-


Here they are with the motor in, the tranny lines are the ones with that are joined with a bracket to keep them from moving around too much...the line with the filter is the fuel line-

bigger shot



Here's where I am today...I forgot to take a shot before I started today so this was taken last thing before leaving the shop today-


The heads will be off by tomorrow afternoon, they are supposed to be dropped off at the engine shop Monday. I was told the bottom end is fresh, we'll see when the heads come off....that would be nice!

Anyway, here we go!

[tigercars]

Good luck with your built. Looks like you are off to a good start.

[270win]

Thanks! I'm looking forward to it...

[webfoot]

Good job. Got any paint/clear on those nice new spindles and tie rods, I hope?

[270win]

Originally Posted by webfoot

Good job. Got any paint/clear on those nice new spindles and tie rods, I hope?

Good eye...The spindles do, the tie rods don't, and that was my mistake, they look good though as the car never gets driven in the rain and is kept in a heated/cooled garage. I'm going to clean them and clear them so I don't have to worry about them though.

[cuz68]

Looks great and a very nice job, Will you do mine next?

[PaulatFast]

Good luck on your build. Just a word of warning on that front sway bar. The factory bar was much small and the frame mounts were designed to hold it in place. When GM went to the larger bar on the GTO's in 70, they transferred much more load to the frame horns. I have seen several frames with the larger factory bars damaged at the bushing mounting points. The frame simply wasn't designed to take on that much stress in that area. The Hotchis bars are notorius for ripping through the frame horns if the car is actually subjected to aggressive driving. I would weld in a 1/4" plate with 3/8"'s nuts welded to the back if you plan to actually flog the car. If it's just a driver and you want the aggressive looks, just keep an eye on the mounting points.

[2002Z4CSS]

Originally Posted by tigercars

Good luck with your built. Looks like you are off to a good start.

Ditto that!

[270win]

Originally Posted by cuz68

Looks great and a very nice job, Will you do mine next?

Sure! I've done several cars for other people...I'm supposed to start a 71 Ford Pickup for someone this winter. I'm assuming you're just be complimentary, but just in-case...

Thanks!

[270win]

Originally Posted by PaulatFast

Good luck on your build. Just a word of warning on that front sway bar. The factory bar was much small and the frame mounts were designed to hold it in place. When GM went to the larger bar on the GTO's in 70, they transferred much more load to the frame horns. I have seen several frames with the larger factory bars damaged at the bushing mounting points. The frame simply wasn't designed to take on that much stress in that area. The Hotchis bars are notorius for ripping through the frame horns if the car is actually subjected to aggressive driving. I would weld in a 1/4" plate with 3/8"'s nuts welded to the back if you plan to actually flog the car. If it's just a driver and you want the aggressive looks, just keep an eye on the mounting points.

Thanks for the heads up! This car will never be road coursed or anything like that by me. I just wanted a more responsive suspension and the stability and safety that it provides. Still, I may go in and do some beefing up just to be safe.

[68addict]

Nice GTO! Let me know how you like that roller motor. I am considering that route but not too much more aggressive than stock for my HO engine. About that sway bar, I also have a bigger bar and noticed it won't fit in the stock holes. After what Paul said, I may switch back to my stock sized bar.....I need to think on this. How did you get it to fit in the stock mounting area?

Thank you,

Anthony

[270win]

Originally Posted by 68addict

Nice GTO! Let me know how you like that roller motor. I am considering that route but not too much more aggressive than stock for my HO engine. About that sway bar, I also have a bigger bar and noticed it won't fit in the stock holes. After what Paul said, I may switch back to my stock sized bar.....I need to think on this. How did you get it to fit in the stock mounting area?

Thank you,

Anthony

I had to take my time and work it in...it did go into the factory holes without forcing anything. Mine is from CPP if that makes any difference.

I'll be sure to post everything about the engine build here. The great thing about a HR cam is that you can go slightly bigger and see BIG gains in Tq/HP.

[nh68gto]

Great start on the car, keep her going. Oh...FYI... We don't allow cheby pics here. LOL.

Seeing how easy those chevy header bolts are to get at, pissed me off. haha.

[270win]

Originally Posted by nh68gto

Great start on the car, keep her going. Oh...FYI... We don't allow cheby pics here. LOL.

Seeing how easy those chevy header bolts are to get at, pissed me off. haha.

LOL! Yeah, this is my first Pontiac restoration...the worst part so far is the freakin' exhaust manifolds!!! I'm just glad to have a lift to make it that much easier.

Now I understand why everyone builds Chevy...SO much cheaper to build! But I'm learning on the Pontiac. And this car already gets much more attention at car shows than any of my Chevys.

[nh68gto]

Think the manifolds are hard..., you haven't seen hard till you deal with poncho headers. LOL! I blew a 428 at start of season and to build that motor I could have bought 2 new ZZ4 crates!! Ended up with a sweet deal (friend of friend) had a 428, .030 over he wasn't using and build me a sweet ass motor (compeats in engine masters).

They are costly to build, motor and everything else but when its a 200 car show and you are the only goat or a couple ponchos its a beautiful thing.

Lot of very smart engine heads in the street section. Poncho's are very finicky.

[270win]

Originally Posted by nh68gto

Think the manifolds are hard..., you haven't seen hard till you deal with poncho headers. LOL! I blew a 428 at start of season and to build that motor I could have bought 2 new ZZ4 crates!! Ended up with a sweet deal (friend of friend) had a 428, .030 over he wasn't using and build me a sweet ass motor (compeats in engine masters).

They are costly to build, motor and everything else but when its a 200 car show and you are the only goat or a couple ponchos its a beautiful thing.

Lot of very smart engine heads in the street section. Poncho's are very finicky.

I've heard that headers are just insane to install. My car had them when I bought it...I used a sawzall to get them out. That's why I went to RA III manifolds.

Who's your builder? The guy who does mine (Jon Kaase) won this year...I think it's the third time for them. To be more precise, Jon does come up with the combination's on my builds, but one of the engine builders for Jon Kaase Racing does the actual work on mine...not Jon specifically.Anyway, GREAT bunch of guys!

He was excited to hear that this one will be a Pontiac!

I agree completely, my last showcar, the Nova, which was a beautiful car, just blended in at the shows. This GTO as is gets incredible response...I'm always the only GTO at the shows I attend which is really cool!

[270win]

So today I took out the exhaust and the top 1/2 of the engine...looks like we're going all the way on the build. I was hoping the bottom end was fresh...and it's not bad, but I'm going to have the engine shop go through it and I'm betting we'll upgrade everything.

Here are some pics-
Intake and valley tray removed-


The cam lobes and lifers looked really good, nice wear patterns...I cannot believe how thin the lifter bosses and underneath them looks! The motor's I've been doing look totally different...


One of the heads...that second exhaust valve looks burnt to me.


The cylinders still had cross hatching in the bores but some very minor vertical scratches in the top and bottom of the bores. They were barely visible but you could not feel them with a finger nail. The motor is already .030 over and there was VERY little carbon on the pistons, I was able to flake it off with my nails and they looked new underneath. These are dished pistons so they're coming out for sure.


Left her on the lift with the oil plug out to drain the pan.


Monday the motor and trans come out and we start making lists of things I know I'll be replacing. Also, I'll be doing an upgrade to the hideaways and rewiring everything while it's out. I have everything to do an electric conversion to the hideaways but I also have all new vacuum parts to go back stock. I'll probably base my decision on the cam choice. With only wanting 450hp and gobs of torque the cam might not be all that radical.

[PaulatFast]

Those pistons aren't dished. They are cast replacement pistons, the four valve reliefs are very common on these cheap universal cast slugs. While not dished for compression reasons, the material removed has the same effect.

The hide-aways work fine with very little vacume. The electric conversion always leaves me scratching my head, the factory system is a basic, straight ahead system that works very well when propperly assembled.

[270win]

Originally Posted by PaulatFast

Those pistons aren't dished. They are cast replacement pistons, the four valve reliefs are very common on these cheap universal cast slugs. While not dished for compression reasons, the material removed has the same effect.

The hide-aways work fine with very little vacume. The electric conversion always leaves me scratching my head, the factory system is a basic, straight ahead system that works very well when propperly assembled.

That's good information, how little vacuum is very little?

I've never seen pistons like that before. Either way, they're as good as gone...I'm looking at cranks, rods and pistons. I don't think anything really radical is necessary for a good reliable bottom end. I'll use ARP fasteners throughout, but I'm still investigating the components. It's probably a waste of time for me to be looking, I'll do whatever the engine shop says is going to do the job.

[68addict]

Originally Posted by 270win

I had to take my time and work it in...it did go into the factory holes without forcing anything. Mine is from CPP if that makes any difference.

I'll be sure to post everything about the engine build here. The great thing about a HR cam is that you can go slightly bigger and see BIG gains in Tq/HP.

Thank you. My bar was not even close....I needed to adjust about an inch...so i may bag the bigger bar and return to stock. Good luck with the Engine refurbish.....