[rohrt]

Anyone run old school air bags in the back for spring droop?

[Tom Vaught]

I never ran the Air Lift air bags to fix "spring droop" but did run them to allow be to carry more weight in the rear area of the car. I did have one failure of a bag and that was because I was way overloaded (too many college women) in the vehicle after a campus blackout on the way back from the mall.

I really think the bags would help but if you are removing the springs to install the bags on a 64 GTO then why not just fix the springs?

Tom V.

[Tom Vaught]

I never ran the Air Lift air bags to fix "spring droop" but did run them to allow be to carry more weight in the rear area of the car. I did have one failure of a bag and that was because I was way overloaded (too many college women) in the vehicle after a campus blackout on the way back from the mall.

I really think the bags would help but if you are removing the springs to install the bags on a 64 GTO then why not just fix the springs? Airlift may not even be around these days.

Tom V.

[GTO JONES]

Just for traction at the track.

[ZeGermanHam]

I wouldn't recommend using them to cure a spring sag issue - that's when you should replacing the springs. Only time I could see using old school air bags within the coils would be for drag race suspension tuning or if you towed a trailer on occasion and needed to do some load leveling. Outside of those circumstances, the issue of sagging springs should be addressed by replacing them, not covering up the issue with air bags.

[Sirrotica]

The air bags can be run either inside of a spring for an adjustable overload system, or by themselves if they have provisions to mount the bag at both ends.

There are course people that run them inside of a spring instead of replacing the worn out spring. My experience is they make for a harsh ride when used in conjunction with a conventional spring. The manufacturer wants a minimum of 5 lbs in the bag at all times.

I've used the 2600 series bags by themselves, and it gives you a much better quality ride on rough road surfaces. No regrets of converting my vehicles to 100% air ride, over a combination of spring and air bags.

I tried the spring and bag on my 05 GTO for hauling a trailer with it, and it was way to stiff for my liking with no trailer, and only 5 lbs in the bags. I'll most likely remove the metal springs, and convert it to air ride in the future.

Having driven semi tractors with and without rear air ride, the difference is quite a contrast.

[ZeGermanHam]

Yeah, full air ride with and integrated air bag & shock body is a totally different animal, and it is often quite good. Lots of flexibility for usage. But they are costly and complex to install, and I assume OP is looking for a cheap way to keep the rear of the car from sagging. Seems to me that new springs are the cheapest and easiest way to fix that particular issue. But perhaps there's more to the story.

[Sirrotica]

Originally Posted by ZeGermanHam

Yeah, full air ride with and integrated air bag & shock body is a totally different animal, and it is often quite good. Lots of flexibility for usage. But they are costly and complex to install, and I assume OP is looking for a cheap way to keep the rear of the car from sagging. Seems to me that new springs are the cheapest and easiest way to fix that particular issue. But perhaps there's more to the story.

I was referring to just removing the spring and putting a bag in it's place as an alternative, it's only marginally more expensive than buying 2 quality replacement springs. They make kits with mounts for the rear of A bodies to convert to air ride, instead of metal springs. If you can fabricate yourself, it can be very affordable to do the conversion. I've done my own vehicles and the cost is mostly to buy the bags, and air source if you want it self contained in the vehicle. I've had rear air ride, that I fabricated, in my dually for roughly 8 years, and love it.

I just wanted him (the OP) to be aware of the superior ride afforded by the conversion over conventional springs, for a minimal investment. Just in case he was interested in something over a stock suspension, just an alternative, nothing more.

[ZeGermanHam]

Ah, gotcha.

[bill ryder]

I have them now. just for traction!!

[rohrt]

It was an idea that someone else through out to me.

My tempest currently has some kind of helper spring shocks on it now. It really does need new springs, however it always seems like a crap shoot buying springs. You never know where the car is going to sit or how stiff the springs may end up.

[Old Man Taylor]

Fix the springs for the ride height, use the bags for racing. I ran them for years in my GTO, but now that I don't race it anymore I took them out. At the track I ran 20 psi on the right and 4-10 psi on the left. In the end I think it would have been fine to just use a bag on the right at 20 psi, and nothing on the left. The down side of them is that the right side of the car stays a little higher.

[Chief of the 60's]

I used them back in the day, they're certainly better than air shocks. However like others have said, fix the problem, not mask it. Replace the springs. It'll probably be cheaper than the air bags.

[NYGTO]

I'd like to preload the right side but I'm not sure which airbag to use. Can one of you guys give me some direction on this? Thanks

[Sirrotica]

Originally Posted by rohrt

It was an idea that someone else through out to me.

My tempest currently has some kind of helper spring shocks on it now. It really does need new springs, however it always seems like a crap shoot buying springs. You never know where the car is going to sit or how stiff the springs may end up.

If you add the air bags to the springs, it will increase the spring rate a bunch. It really makes the rear stiff. You can never soften it enough to give you a ride that is compliant to the road surfaces because you need at least 5 lbs of air in the bags to keep them from getting damaged inside of the spring. It's like adding another spring to the metal spring already in the car.

If you discard the springs and just use bags, the spring rate can be adjusted by the air pressure, as well as your ride height.

I first used air bags back in the 1970s in my Jeep pickup truck on the front axle as an overload for the snow plow system. The stock suspension was never engineered to hold the weight of a snowplow, and it drooped when I had the plow on. I got an air bag from a semi and mounted it on the front in the center of the axle to help carry the extra load. It worked well, but when added to the steel leaf springs it was pretty stiff, I've been intrigued by air suspension since then.

It works much better though if you remove the steel springs and just use air bags by them selves. Having driven my own vehicles before switching to just air ride gives you the contrast. Having added air bags to steel springs adds so much spring rate that the ride is quite harsh. Air suspension works remarkably well by itself without being added to steel springs.

If you have fabrication skills it's not really expensive to convert. I fabbed all the parts for the rear of my dually, and went to HF ($36 with 20% off coupon) and bought a portable air tank to plumb into the system to carry air with me. I have a stake body and mounted the tank under the the deck of the stake body. Made an air manifold out of pipe fittings and 3 ball valves. It's mounted behind the driver so I just step out of the truck, and raise, or lower the suspension as needed for what I'm carrying in the bed. I originally had a old freon tank, but it finally rusted out, so within the last month I bought, and changed to the portable air tank, much thicker wall than the freon tank was.

I could have electric over air valves, and a on board compressor if I chose to, but instead I just fill the tank from my own shop air and run the ball valves manually. I really didn't want to put a ton of money into a system for a truck I only paid $1800 for back on 2010, I'm pretty thrifty...........LOL

My wife had ridden in the dually for 2 years previous with the worn out steel suspension, and knew exactly how it rode. I took her with me for the shake down run after I converted it, and she was amazed at how smooth the ride was. Well worth the labor and expense, I would have been spent anyway for new leaf springs, as they were junk. I have a modified 4 link in it, and the ride is just great, loaded or unloaded. Just wanted to put that out there as an option. I'll be converting some of my other cars to air ride in the future, just for the compliancy to the road surface it gives. It doesn't have to be expensive, if you can fab your own parts from steel, and hardware store parts.

[Keith Seymore]

Originally Posted by GTO JONES

Just for traction at the track.

Me too.

Both the Chevelle and the GTO have a bag in the RH spring to preload the chassis.

K

[NYGTO]

Could you elaborate on this. Can I install the spring without drilling and simply bolting in? I'm not looking for permanent and I've never got into this before. Thanks

[Sirrotica]

Originally Posted by NYGTO

Could you elaborate on this. Can I install the spring without drilling and simply bolting in? I'm not looking for permanent and I've never got into this before. Thanks

They usually are stuffed into the ID of the spring through the coils without removing the spring from the car, just letting the suspension hang under it's own weight . I assume your looking at adding an air bag for drag racing preload.

[Old Man Taylor]

I was never successful stuffing the bags between the coils of the springs. I had to take the springs out, but it only requires one more bolt per spring.

[Sirrotica]

Originally Posted by Old Man Taylor

I was never successful stuffing the bags between the coils of the springs. I had to take the springs out, but it only requires one more bolt per spring.

Jim, I was successful in getting mine in (05 GTO), maybe I'm just a masochist, or maybe the 05 has larger spacing between the coils,

I'm pretty sure back in the day some of my buddies with early A bodies managed to get theirs in without removing the spring, been along time though since these cars were daily drivers.

Also there are 2 types of bags nowadays, the stiff plastic bladders and the real rubber types. My 05 used the stiff plastic style bladder, and while not easy to get inside of the spring, I was able to accomplish it lying on my back in the driveway.

Even if you have to remove the spring, it's pretty straight forward, simple operation.