[72projectbird]

Uh oh.

[grivera]

Well I'm confident Paul will make it right and you'll be on road in no time.

["QUICK-SILVER"]

He posted a while back about having to slow down from what sounded like a stress related health problem.

Something may have happend since the inspect and when he said it was going back together.

I'd have to look but I'm sure he's posted about other projects he's working on now. And this one was going back together over a month ago.

Clay

[STEELCITYFIREBIRD]

How your handling it business wise should be kept private, but the engine problem/s you guys owe it to us to keep us in the loop. ��

[Va68goat]

STEELCITYFIREBIRD,

You make a good point because everyone here is a potential customer but at this point, I think I'll let Paul discuss that if he wants to. I'm in a pretty awkward position because I've spent a lot of money on a motor that has less than 200 miles on it and it's almost 2000 miles away from me.

[grivera]

Originally Posted by STEELCITYFIREBIRD

How your handling it business wise should be kept private, but the engine problem/s you guys owe it to us to keep us in the loop. ��

good point - he can always post it here:

http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...play.php?f=469

[gtofreek]

Very fine debris from the bushing got through the filter and when I was cleaning up parts for re-assembly, there was very fine debris in main bearings and Jeff would not let it go back together with just a Scotch-Brite tune-up and wanted it back like new as Joe paid for. I agree with Jeff. When I took it apart, it was all oily and the debris was not evident. Also looked like the distributor jacking the timing up may have been causing some detonation as some of the top rings showed signs of the Moly coating starting to flake off. Just buying top rings from Total Seal was more money than just buying a whole set, so we bought a whole set.

Other than that, engine is just fine.

[promptcritical]

Originally Posted by Va68goat

STEELCITYFIREBIRD,

You make a good point because everyone here is a potential customer but at this point, I think I'll let Paul discuss that if he wants to. I'm in a pretty awkward position because I've spent a lot of money on a motor that has less than 200 miles on it and it's almost 2000 miles away from me.

Have you approached MSD? Their product seems to be the source of your problems, not the engine builder. He seems to be taking excellent care of you.

[JSPONT]

Good catch from my standpoint. MSD is the poop in this mess.

[Va68goat]

promptcritical,

I called MSD and their initial reaction was that the warranty had expired and they would make the repair for $135. Paul and Jeff were able to get the distributor fixed at no cost from MSD. I did call them back and spoke to someone that was supposed to be a manager and I explained to them what had happened. The "manager" said since the distributor was worked on to re-curve it and an aftermarket gear was added, it would be unlikely to recoup any cost. Since the distributor was knocking at first start in Virginia, I'm sure it just wasn't caught during the dyno in Arizona. I've never been to a dyno but Paul explained to me how loud it is!

[Richie Hoffman]

None of these companies stand behind there stuff it’s the end users problem I’m so tired of being the person who fixes these problems just my parts are crap rant

[gtofreek]

Engines are loud at full throttle on the dyno, not at idle. They are relatively quiet at idle so a knock would have been noticeable. I told you this Joe. I stand right next to the engine while setting the timing. There timing marks were solid as a rock, not jumping around like they would be after the bushing wore out.

Seems to me that if it made noise at first startup then the shop that got it running would have said something. But they didn't. Makes more sense to me that it didn't make noise, then during their first test drive, it started making noise and they were afraid they hurt the engine, so they didn't say anything. It was me and someone else on here that pointed the noise out to you. You even told me that when you went to pick up the car, they commented on how fast it was so you better take it easy at first. That means they got on it. Not saying they hurt it, they didn't. Just saying they probably thought they did, so they didn't say anything to you about the noise.

[Va68goat]

Hey Paul, I was just referring to the text that you sent me that mentioned how loud a dyno room was and the knock may be difficult to hear. I went back and spoke to the owner of the shop and the guy that hooked up the electrical work. I questioned them about driving the car prior to me hearing the motor and they said they didn't drive it hard. He drove it less than an 1/8 mile and turned around. Even if for some reason they did drive it hard, they didn't do anything that I wouldn't do or expect that motor to handle. This is a pretty respectable car shop that does a lot of nice cars. When I asked him about him knowing how quick the car was, he said he was referring to the numbers it did on the dyno. I told him I had never driven a car with this amount of power and he was telling me to be careful because it could get away from me pretty easily.

[gtofreek]

I even said that they didn't hurt it so it doesn't matter if they got on it or not. That's what it was built for. I'm just saying it seems suspicious to me that they didn't say anything about the knock. You never even said anything about it until I and someone else mentioned it. Most shops that install and fire up an engine that they didn't have anything to do with will mention a noise if they heard it, immediately. They are not wanting to be held responsible so they mention it right away. As much noise as it was making, they have to have heard it. That's why I wonder if it was just about to start rubbing and during the course of their test drive, it actually started knocking. At this point, it really doen't matter. The distributor was the problem so it's getting fixed.

[NeighborsComplaint]

Originally Posted by promptcritical

Have you approached MSD? Their product seems to be the source of your problems, not the engine builder. He seems to be taking excellent care of you.

Good luck with that one.

OP is lucky they even repaired the distributor since it was modified (composite gear added). Every product that comes with a limited warranty excludes consequential damages and covers only the product purchased. That's why it is called a limited warranty.

Here are the terms of MSD's stated warranty:

"MSD, LLC warrants MSD products to be free from defects in material and workmanship under normal use and if properly installed for a period of one year from date of purchase. If found to be defective as mentioned above, it will be replaced or repaired if returned prepaid along with proof of date of purchase. This shall constitute the sole remedy of the purchaser and the sole liability of MSD, LLC to the extent permitted by law, the foregoing is exclusive and in lieu of all other warranties or representations whether expressed or implied, including any implied warranty of merchantability or fitness. In no event shall MSD, LLC be liable for special or consequential damages. This warranty is only valid on products purchased from MSD Authorized Dealers."

[Formulajones]

It's already been stated MSD took care of the distributor. Paul and Jeff have a little more pull than the typical consumer since they build some of the best South West Tour series engines out here, and use MSD products exclusively. That's part of the advantage of having a reputable engine shop build an engine for you. If it were Joe blow calling MSD about the issue, they'd tell ya tough luck.

It was a distributor issue plain and simple. Not a builders issue. Best to just roll with the punches, follow Paul and Jeff's advice, button the thing up and enjoy it.

[promptcritical]

Originally Posted by NeighborsComplaint

Good luck with that one.

OP is lucky they even repaired the distributor since it was modified (composite gear added). Every product that comes with a limited warranty excludes consequential damages and covers only the product purchased. That's why it is called a limited warranty.

Here are the terms of MSD's stated warranty:

"MSD, LLC warrants MSD products to be free from defects in material and workmanship under normal use and if properly installed for a period of one year from date of purchase. If found to be defective as mentioned above, it will be replaced or repaired if returned prepaid along with proof of date of purchase. This shall constitute the sole remedy of the purchaser and the sole liability of MSD, LLC to the extent permitted by law, the foregoing is exclusive and in lieu of all other warranties or representations whether expressed or implied, including any implied warranty of merchantability or fitness. In no event shall MSD, LLC be liable for special or consequential damages. This warranty is only valid on products purchased from MSD Authorized Dealers."

My point was that if he wants to bitch about it he should be bitching about the parts he got from MSD, not the builder.

[Va68goat]

promptcritical,

I think Paul would agree that I have handled this as well or better than most people so go stir the pot on another thread. Paul and I are cool and we'll get through this without your opinion! As I said before, I still wouldn't hesitate to go through Paul again!

["QUICK-SILVER"]

What brand and part number was the bogus oil filter that caused all this collateral damage?

It needs to be #1 on the don't use it list.

I'm playing nice
Clay

[mgarblik]

I have no idea what he had for an oil filter, but it is hard to blame the oil filter for a defective distributor bushing and the tiny bits of material it shed. Unless they had the factory oil filter bypass blocked and were using a non-bypass oil filter, allot of oil is going to be bypassed in various engine operating conditions. Cold starts and warm-up and any running over 3000 RPM's will bypass some oil around the filter. Generally, the finer the media and the smaller particles it filters, the more it will bypass. Simply can't get all the oil through a fine micron filter all the time. The hope is it will pick-up the particles eventually as the oil makes it through the filter in multiple passes... Problem is, as the bushing continues to fail, more and more debris is dropping into the oil. What I have learned from this very long thread is: 1. an unusual engine related failure. 2. Name brand, good reputation component at fault. 3. Problem found quickly by experienced engine builder 4. Builder has been willing to go way, way beyond normal and usual business practices to resolve the issue. 5. Engine should be back in the car soon, screaming down the street and smiles all around.