[Dauntless1971]

I have a 65 Tempest in need of a Pontiac engine. I found what appears to be a good running 64 326 with 66 093 heads. The heads were rebuilt recently with screw in studs. It seems like it is a decent combo. It comes with a 66 4 barrel intake. Unsure of the cam, if it is a 441 or 254 I am sure it will need to be addressed. Any thoughts of how much larger of a cam to run without going over the top. After all I just have a cruiser. Summit 2800 maybe?

[25stevem]

I would first want to know what you have for cranking compression with those 389 heads on your 326!

[Dauntless1971]

Originally Posted by 25stevem

I would first want to know what you have for cranking compression with those 389 heads on your 326!

Best I can tell the low compression heads on the 326 were supposed to be 70 cc's which had advertised 9.2 ratio. The HO heads at 60cc's advertised 10.5 ratio. And the 093 are shown at 68 cc's at several websites. So maybe my engine would be 9.4 though no doubt with the larger head gasket openings 4.2 inches on the small bore Pontiac it will be less than that. Though I have read someone saying the stock 326 heads are 65 cc's and the HO ones are 55 cc's. Either way should be good.

[25stevem]

It would also be prudent in making a cam pick to know what rear gears your car has.

If you have between 9 to 9.5 comp and at least 3.23 rear gears I would just go with the factory 066 cam which should sound heathy with 326 cid yet make enough bottom end power

[Sirrotica]

The 326 still have a 3.75 stroke so they have a long stroke for low end. Being oversquare, they're like a 455 scaled down.

I had a 67 HO Firebird that came with a 067 cam and I put a tripower setup off of a 66 GTO on it. The car was very quick with a 4 speed and 3.73 gears. It surprised a whole lot of people on the street. I never had headers on that car, but they would have probably added 15-20 HP over the stock exhaust system.

The 2800 would be fine, and if you have the rear gear, a 2801 would be fine with a more aggressive gear such as 3.55 or higher numerically. Now if the car has a 2.56, 2.73 axle in it the 2800 would be better.

I also like the High Energy Comp Cams lines for mild street cars, but they are more money than Summit is.

People always write off the 326 and 350 engines as being too small, but the chevy people have no problem with 327s and 350 SBCs, they love them. If you were talking about a 65 chevelle with a 327 in it, no one would be saying it was too small of an engine to hot rod.

No reason the Pontiac can't be made to run well in the smaller displacement as well. An engine doesn't know who cast the parts up initially when it was new. the best thing about the 326/350 engines is no one wants them, so you can pick them up sometimes for free.

Just curious, does the screen name refer to the 225 Buick, that came in the early CJ5s?

[Kenth]

A standard Pontiac 326 is undersquare AFAIK. Like the 455.

[Sirrotica]

Originally Posted by Kenth

A standard Pontiac 326 is undersquare AFAIK. Like the 455.

Correct, my memory failed me, at my age it happens.

[sdbob]

I had a 65 Lemans 326 3spd stock,in 75. I tried an nos 068 cam I didnt like it. Tried different keys. Still didnt like it. My 2cts. Of course times and tech have changed so might be ok now.

[b-man]

The 066 would be a nice upgrade from the 254 or 441 cam that all the 326 engines used, both 2 barrel standard 250 hp and 280/285 hp 4-barrel HO. The Summit 2800 would also be right in the ballpark.

Interesting to note that standard 326 and 326 HO engines all used the same cam, the performance increase was from higher compression along with the additional breathing afforded by the 4-barrel induction and dual exhaust.

Concerning the compression ratio achieved using the 093 heads (10.75:1 factory rating on a 389), I’m thinking you’ll be in the 8.5 to 9:1 range possibly closer to 9:1.

The factory used the same 9773345 head on both the 10.5:1 389 2 and 4-barrel engines and the standard 8.6:1 326 2-barrel engines. So it would follow that the slightly higher compression more performance oriented 093 heads on your 326 should reflect about the same compression ratio difference.

[77 TRASHCAN]

Sealed Power CS641 is the 066 cam, likely most affordable cam. Not sure if the word "affordable" can be used these days, concerning anything....

[Dauntless1971]

Originally Posted by 77 TRASHCAN

Sealed Power CS641 is the 066 cam, likely most affordable cam. Not sure if the word "affordable" can be used these days, concerning anything....

Yes the word affordable now a days, hell I have to figure by the time I am done getting all the miscellanies parts I need. I will have easy spend 3 or 4 times the amount the original engine sold for.
Thanks I will check on the 066 cam specs.

[Dauntless1971]

Originally Posted by b-man

The 066 would be a nice upgrade from the 254 or 441 cam that all the 326 engines used, both 2 barrel standard 250 hp and 280/285 hp 4-barrel HO. The Summit 2800 would also be right in the ballpark.

Interesting to note that standard 326 and 326 HO engines all used the same cam, the performance increase was from higher compression along with the additional breathing afforded by the 4-barrel induction and dual exhaust.

Concerning the compression ratio achieved using the 093 heads (10.75:1 factory rating on a 389), I’m thinking you’ll be in the 8.5 to 9:1 range possibly closer to 9:1.

The factory used the same 9773345 head on both the 10.5:1 389 2 and 4-barrel engines and the standard 8.6:1 326 2-barrel engines. So it would follow that the slightly higher compression more performance oriented 093 heads on your 326 should reflect about the same compression ratio difference.

The seller stated it had a small RV type cam.
But I have no idea exactly what cam was used.
And of course not all aftermarket products are better or more powerful than stock.
I do have the 66 4 barrel manifold and 2.25 dual exhaust.
I think 8.8 CR or so is just fine.
I am not trying to build a racer so if the compression was a third of the extra HP.
And something like 275 HP will be fine for now.

[Dauntless1971]

Originally Posted by Sirrotica

The 326 still have a 3.75 stroke so they have a long stroke for low end. Being oversquare, they're like a 455 scaled down.

I had a 67 HO Firebird that came with a 067 cam and I put a tripower setup off of a 66 GTO on it. The car was very quick with a 4 speed and 3.73 gears. It surprised a whole lot of people on the street. I never had headers on that car, but they would have probably added 15-20 HP over the stock exhaust system.

The 2800 would be fine, and if you have the rear gear, a 2801 would be fine with a more aggressive gear such as 3.55 or higher numerically. Now if the car has a 2.56, 2.73 axle in it the 2800 would be better.

I also like the High Energy Comp Cams lines for mild street cars, but they are more money than Summit is.

People always write off the 326 and 350 engines as being too small, but the chevy people have no problem with 327s and 350 SBCs, they love them. If you were talking about a 65 chevelle with a 327 in it, no one would be saying it was too small of an engine to hot rod.

No reason the Pontiac can't be made to run well in the smaller displacement as well. An engine doesn't know who cast the parts up initially when it was new. the best thing about the 326/350 engines is no one wants them, so you can pick them up sometimes for free.

Just curious, does the screen name refer to the 225 Buick, that came in the early CJ5s?

The ST300 has been replace with a 200R4 that should help with off the line get up and go.
Best I can tell I have 2.56 gear ratio now.
Still trying to decide how large of hole I want to dig for my Pontiac.
I did see a one inch wider 10 bolt Pontiac rear axle with posi and 3.42 gears.
And yes I still have a 65 327 11.5 to 1, 202 heads, balanced and all that, built over 45 years ago.
No doubt needs to be refreshed again.
But it is not for a Pontiac.
And I the screen name is because of my 71 CJ5 Renegade I traded for over 30 years ago.

[25stevem]

Even though the heads have been rebuilt I would confirm that new valve springs where installed and how much valve lift you have clearance for before the retainer meets up with the valve seal.
This is assuming that during the head rebuilding process the tops of the valve guides where cut for positive type seals.
This is much easier to check while the motor is out of the car and the same goes for any corrective actions that may need to be done..

The two most popular RV type Cams of years gone by where by Comp Cams and Isky.

The Isky 256 super cam was a single pattern with 202 duration@.050” and with .425” lift , lobe center was 112 and was stated to have a power band of 1500 to 4800.

The Comp cams was the 252H.
This one had 206 duration @.050”, .425” lift and a lobe of 110.
Stated power band was 800 to 4800.

Either of these two cams have more intake duration and lift then the factory 066 cam.
Also either of these cams due to the lobe center difference would have a more noticeable idle note to them.

The 068 cam has 9 more degrees of overlap then either the 066 or 067 cam so in terms of a 326 cid motor it’s easy to see why it was Dog for average street driving!

[Dauntless1971]

The engine I picked up was in a very nice 64 Le Mans convertible that had been swapped for a 455.
Not so sure about removing the heads, though I may have to redo the oil pan gasket.
And I did happen to find a engine run stand that will be used before the engine gets installed.
Though some choice items were removed sadly for me.
He stated he was running roller tip rockers, except there are no guide plates.
And from I have read so far it might be best to stick with stock ones when no guide plates are used.

[25stevem]

Do you still have the poly locks that would have been used to adjust the rockers?

It’s good that you might have to pull the pan to fix a leak.
This way you get to see if the motor was rebuilt with the needed 3/4” pickup tube 60 psi pump and HD driveshaft.

[Dauntless1971]

Originally Posted by 25stevem

Do you still have the poly locks that would have been used to adjust the rockers?


It’s good that you might have to pull the pan to fix a leak.
This way you get to see if the motor was rebuilt with the needed 3/4” pickup tube 60 psi pump and HD driveshaft.

No I will be needing pushrods, and all that go with the rockers. The seller did mention adjustable locking nuts. Though he also stated roller tipped rockers had been used. From what I have read so far when using roller rockers the pushrod does not rotate without using guide plates. So I am still searching if that is correct information.

[Dauntless1971]

Originally Posted by 25stevem

Even though the heads have been rebuilt I would confirm that new valve springs where installed and how much valve lift you have clearance for before the retainer meets up with the valve seal.
This is assuming that during the head rebuilding process the tops of the valve guides where cut for positive type seals.
This is much easier to check while the motor is out of the car and the same goes for any corrective actions that may need to be done..

When I started this thread I did not know the cam was changed from stock. When he mentioned screw in rocker studs I was expecting to see guide plates with them.
They do measure out to 7/16 though. And I can see the oiling holes for rockers in them. I was not planning on removing the heads because the story was they had be overhauled recently. I wanted to drop it in the 65 and run it as is, but it never is that simple it seems.

[25stevem]

Since the valve springs still have the oil shield cups on them then it’s a good bet that the tops of the valve guides have not been cut for positive seals either.

While you have the valve cover off you should measure the distance from the bottom of those oil shield cups to the head because that’s the limit of how valve lift you can run.