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Pontiac - Boost Turbo, supercharged, Nitrous, EFI & other Power Adders discussed here. |
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#1
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Oddball boost device
Per a 1967 Hot Rod Magazine article (either June or July)-
GM designed/built/tested a very unusual supercharger for intermittent use on street vehicles. Only about 3 psi boost for up to 30 seconds on a mid-size car with an inline six (dropped zero-to-sixty time from 14 seconds to 8 seconds). But it was projected to cost under $100 (1967 dollars of course) and had many features- almost zero maintenance, nothing to replenish (vs NOS systems), and very compact. It used an "induction chamber" (maybe 2' long by 2" diameter) into which compressed air was injected at supersonic velocity, drawing in three times as much ambient air as was injected. Compressed air @ 1,500 psi came from a small onboard tank and compressor- low current draw but took minutes to recharge the tank. I never saw any follow-up on it. Anybody? [If I remembered any wrong numbers I'll correct them when the magazine is returned to me]
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Anybody else on this planet campaign a M/T hemi Pontiac for eleven seasons? ... or has built a record breaking DOHC hemi four cylinder Pontiac? ... or has driven a couple laps of Nuerburgring with Tri-Power Pontiac power?(back in 1967) |
#2
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I have posted about this GM "Boosting" device a couple of times Jack.
We must have the same old magazines. Article was published in the early 60s. The Boosting Device took up some space in the Corvair, and the compressor DID have a long recharge time. BUT, if a person was getting up to speed on the freeway going to work and home twice a day and 8 hours apart it really did not matter much in California. A couple of guys in Research, about 10 years ago, looked at the "Boost" system with a pair of much larger air storage tanks and a more efficient charging system vs the old Corvair days. Made a bunch of air compressor noise vs what people would accept in the 60s for noise and the air noise from drawing in the extra air charge was also higher. You also need a quality "Back Flow" valve or you blow more "emissions (fuel) back into the atmosphere. Tom V. Whether it be a recharging of a "air tank" or a recharging of a vehicle electric system (battery and E-Boost) you still have a long lag time between applications. A Turbo or a Belt Driven Boost system, Roots, Centrifugal, Lysholm, etc is a lot more capable in Boosting Performance.
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"Engineers do stuff for reasons" Tom Vaught Despite small distractions, there are those who will go Forward, Learning, Sharing Knowledge, Doing what they can to help others move forward. Last edited by Tom Vaught; 11-29-2019 at 08:52 AM. |
#3
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A number of things I hadn't remembered well:
The article entitled "Supercharging by Jet" written by Roger Huntington was in the July '67 issue of Hot Rod Magazine. General Motors Research experimented with the "RamAire Ejector" system for 5 or 6 years, but with no plans to produce it. It was capable of 8 psi boost in a "300-400" c.i. V8, for up to 60 seconds. Although the tank is charged to 1,500 psi, the pressure is regulated down to 150 psi before it enters the primary nozzle. The compressor was sized to recharge the tank at the rate of 25-40 psi per mile driven. Test data was given for 0-60 mph: > '58 Chevy 283 went from 12.6 to 8.9 seconds > '?? Chevy 6 went from ??? to 8.9 seconds > '60 Pontiac 389 went from 12.2 to 8.5 seconds
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Anybody else on this planet campaign a M/T hemi Pontiac for eleven seasons? ... or has built a record breaking DOHC hemi four cylinder Pontiac? ... or has driven a couple laps of Nuerburgring with Tri-Power Pontiac power?(back in 1967) Last edited by Jack Gifford; 11-30-2019 at 02:52 AM. |
#4
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The "RamAire Ejector" was tested in a blow-through (carbureted) configuration, so no concern about "back flow".
I suspect you might have missed the point about the RamAire Ejector working on a unique principle, Tom. [I say that because of your analogy of recharging a battery]. The mass of air inducted into the engine is FOUR TIMES (!) the mass of air stored under pressure in the RamAire system's tank.
__________________
Anybody else on this planet campaign a M/T hemi Pontiac for eleven seasons? ... or has built a record breaking DOHC hemi four cylinder Pontiac? ... or has driven a couple laps of Nuerburgring with Tri-Power Pontiac power?(back in 1967) |
#5
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I believe when I read the article in the 60s (I thought pre-1965 and you posted Huntington's article was 1967, close enough after 50+ years).
My understanding was that the system worked like a Car Wash spray Nozzle except that the air from the compressor pulled additional air (you say 4 times the mass) thru the Injector system and into the pressure bonnet on the carb. 1500 psi divided by 40 psi per mile (best case recharge) you would have to drive the car 37.5 miles to get the bottle back to a full recharge. Over 1/2 hour of driving at 60 mph to recharge the pressure tank. Vortech Superchargers are so much easier, even the old Paxton Ball drive Superchargers could do a lot better than that system on the average small engine at 6 or 7 psi of Boost Pressure. Tom V.
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"Engineers do stuff for reasons" Tom Vaught Despite small distractions, there are those who will go Forward, Learning, Sharing Knowledge, Doing what they can to help others move forward. |
#6
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Quote:
Since this is the reference for recharge time. How was the compressor driven? Stan
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Stan Weiss/World Wide Enterprises Offering Performance Software Since 1987 http://www.magneticlynx.com/carfor/carfor.htm David Vizard & Stan Weiss' IOP / Flow / Induction Optimization - Cam Selection Software http://www.magneticlynx.com/DV Download FREE 14 Trial IOP / Flow Software http://www.magneticlynx.com/DV/Flow_..._Day_Trial.php Pontiac Pump Gas List http://www.magneticlynx.com/carfor/pont_gas.htm Using PMD Block and Heads List http://www.magneticlynx.com/carfor/pont_pmd.htm |
#7
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To quote the article- the motor/compressor unit was "quite small and was inaudible and drew negligible current".
__________________
Anybody else on this planet campaign a M/T hemi Pontiac for eleven seasons? ... or has built a record breaking DOHC hemi four cylinder Pontiac? ... or has driven a couple laps of Nuerburgring with Tri-Power Pontiac power?(back in 1967) |
#8
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A very interesting read, following you guys (Tom and Jack). Been away a while, doing the facebook thing when online. Glad to see you guys are still kicking it and staying sharp.
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Just a blind squirrel looking for a nut. |
#9
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Thank You, Mr Brian Baker. Best to you and your family during the Holidays.
Glad to see you posting in the Boost Section. Tom V.
__________________
"Engineers do stuff for reasons" Tom Vaught Despite small distractions, there are those who will go Forward, Learning, Sharing Knowledge, Doing what they can to help others move forward. |
#10
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This has a diagram of the system and a picture of it installed. Does not really give to much more information.
https://books.google.com/books?id=V5...system&f=false Stan
__________________
Stan Weiss/World Wide Enterprises Offering Performance Software Since 1987 http://www.magneticlynx.com/carfor/carfor.htm David Vizard & Stan Weiss' IOP / Flow / Induction Optimization - Cam Selection Software http://www.magneticlynx.com/DV Download FREE 14 Trial IOP / Flow Software http://www.magneticlynx.com/DV/Flow_..._Day_Trial.php Pontiac Pump Gas List http://www.magneticlynx.com/carfor/pont_gas.htm Using PMD Block and Heads List http://www.magneticlynx.com/carfor/pont_pmd.htm |
#11
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Damn, Brian. A blast from the past.
Jim
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****'63 Tempest, 475" IAII, Wenzler Super Chief heads, converted to blown alcohol, Birdcatcher, Littlefield 10-71 high helix. Best pass to date: 7.67 @ 181.59 (1/4 mi.), 4.95 @ 143.67 (1/8 mi.), 1.18 (60 ft) 7.75 @ 178 pass: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Iez3...ature=youtu.be First seven second pass(7.98): https://wwwoutube.com/watch?v=DK17...ature=youtu.be Thanks to Paul Carter @ Koerner Racing Engines |
#12
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Thanks for posting that link Stan.
Hey Mongo- any Pontiac projects?
__________________
Anybody else on this planet campaign a M/T hemi Pontiac for eleven seasons? ... or has built a record breaking DOHC hemi four cylinder Pontiac? ... or has driven a couple laps of Nuerburgring with Tri-Power Pontiac power?(back in 1967) |
#13
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Quote:
I had purchased an original survivor '80 Firebird Esprit from a gentleman in Michigan last year. Phil Danneth (?) I think was his name. The body on it was solid and the interior clean. Plans were to build a 455 for it with my son and play with it. I left my job with Verizon in February of this year and was unemployed for 7 months, so the car had to be sold to pay bills. No plans for now as I am working but still playing catch up with bills. Eventually I'd like to find an altered chassis for the engine/trans I kept from the funny car, or an interesting door car, but not anytime soon.
__________________
Just a blind squirrel looking for a nut. |
#14
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Buy a vehicle that YOU can fit into so that YOU can continue to race (like in the old days but with Ray and Keefer as your "Pit Btches"), at Norwalk).
Boosted of course. Tom V.
__________________
"Engineers do stuff for reasons" Tom Vaught Despite small distractions, there are those who will go Forward, Learning, Sharing Knowledge, Doing what they can to help others move forward. |
#15
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Hang in there Mongo!
I see you have "BB/Funny car" in your signature. I recently read that at the '67 NHRA Nationals Dick Jesse won BB funny car with a Pontiac. Do you know anything about that car?
__________________
Anybody else on this planet campaign a M/T hemi Pontiac for eleven seasons? ... or has built a record breaking DOHC hemi four cylinder Pontiac? ... or has driven a couple laps of Nuerburgring with Tri-Power Pontiac power?(back in 1967) |
#16
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Dick Jesse? Wasn't he Mr. Unswitchable? That "funny car" was outrageous. Center steer but he sat very high and as such his head and top of the cage (if you want to call it a cage) stuck up through the rear roof/window area. It also had some unique tinwork in the body that channeled the exhaust along either side of the chassis and exited up through the rear window and top of the quarter panel area just above the slicks, which forced the tire smoke up through these channels and out the deck of the car on either side, which I understand made for some spectacularly visual burnouts with providing a unique exhaust note.
BB/FC was the '79 Firebird funny car of Dick Rosberg (and later Della Woods) that I found back in 2004 and began restoring. Got the car 85% finished and never ran it under power. Sold it to Mark Coonan 2 years ago as a roller, who plans on dropping a blown and injected BBC with a glide in it. I kept my engine and trans along with the blower set up. I had to sell the Crower 8-port injection earlier this year to help pay bills but that can always be replaced with a more readily available Enderle hat. Tom...the next ride will definitely fit my fat arse, which isn't as fat as it used to be but is still there. I've thought about either an altered, to keep costs down, or a mid-60's door car built to resemble an AWB car from that time period. Either way it will be 14-71 blown and on alky, and I'll be sure to be able to fit in it to drive it.
__________________
Just a blind squirrel looking for a nut. |
#17
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Pretty sure Dick Jesse was running a 421 Pontiac in those years.
__________________
Just a blind squirrel looking for a nut. |
#18
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Thanks Brian.
__________________
Anybody else on this planet campaign a M/T hemi Pontiac for eleven seasons? ... or has built a record breaking DOHC hemi four cylinder Pontiac? ... or has driven a couple laps of Nuerburgring with Tri-Power Pontiac power?(back in 1967) |
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