[Ron]

The last time I saw Mike Coopers car he did not have a crank support. I don't know that he has installed one as he also said it would cost lots of money to modify his car to accept one. Has things changed.

[grnmnstr]

Just curious, has anyone ever done 3 keyways?

Is it stronger, can it be done, is it necessary or overkill??

[Tom Vaught]

Quote:

" Originally Posted by wheelspin.................

We get it, Tom. How about taking your own advice and leaving your ego @ the PY Forums door .
Les

Actually that statement did not come from me, it came from the owner of the Turboforums website. I have a hard time following the rule some times.

Quote by the KING "CHIT STIRRER" on the PY Board (Brian baker):

"Ditto"

Now that is funny big man.

I was told today that Mike Cooper had made some very good changes to his car. It was running well, making great power, and was leaving hard.

I was also told that Travis would be tuning for John Welter at the Norwalk race. Great to see Travis show up at Norwalk, he has tons of friends there.

Tom Vaught

[Brian Baker]

I stuck a wink and a pounding laugh next to the comment, Tom...maybe shoulda' stuck a rib poker in there too (LOL).

Mike had two issues that needed addressing in the past, but what do I know:

Had no crank snout support & timing cover was a stressed member as a result of the front motor plate being mounted between timing cover and water pump...not an ideal situation for the kind of power he's making. Hopefully they've been addressed.

[Tom Vaught]

I think at one time Mike Cooper had dimensions on where to drill a IA-2 Block for a crank support but did not follow thru on that deal.

He may or may not have a crank support on his engine today. Some people use a much thicker wall thickness crank hub snout so there is more wall thickness in the keyway area and they make the snout out of steel. They then run a much larger seal in a modded Pontiac timing cover. Travis says this is pretty commonly done on some engines similar to Pontiacs with small hub seals and crank snouts.

Tom Vaught

[Sirrotica]

Originally Posted by Steve Barcak

As of 10 minutes ago I will be attending the Norwalk event! I am so glad to be able to make it.
I'm going on the cheap cheap ( bus ) because things are a bit squeaky right now but, at least I get to go.
I'd like to meet and visit with as many Pontiac fans as is possible. Please say hello. I'll be wearing the Pontiac Heaven attire of course.
Special thanks to Sirrotica for helping me on this deal, could not make it without them. They will have a booth selling their fine Pro Pontiac t shirts in the midway and I will be with them or just walking around.
My cell is 480-899-7873 so I can be easily located.
looking forward to attending again for the second time. 1st time was in '06.

Steve, we are more than happy to invite you to enjoy the Norwalk Pontiac experience with us. Steve has always been great to my wife and I at his own event and we have no problem helping him get to the Tri Power Nationals as our friend and guest. I talked to Steve today at length and he will also be giving my wife and I a much needed hand at our T Shirt booth on the Manufacturers Midway.

Stop by and meet Steve, owner and operator of Pontiac Heaven, and Promoter of his own Pontiac Heaven event that is going into it's 12th year just outside of Phoenix. Steve also owns some of the rarest Pontiac artifacts from the Pontiac M/T era and is the only person I know that has a Nitro FED powered by a blown Pontiac 389 derivitive, as well as blown Pontiac jet boats and many other rare Pontiac projects too numerous to mention. when you use the term PONTIADDICT, Steve is probably the type of guy you think of.

I might even get him over to one of Ohio's premier Sprintcar races on Friday or Saturday nite to see winged Sprints sidweways at 100 MPH on dirt. I also extend an invitation to anyone else to the Sprintcar races if your so inclined to attend.

BTW Steve, that's a great looking shirt your wearing in that pic of yourself....................

[Brian Baker]

Originally Posted by Tom Vaught

I think at one time Mike Cooper had dimensions on where to drill a IA-2 Block for a crank support but did not follow thru on that deal.

He may or may not have a crank support on his engine today. Some people use a much thicker wall thickness crank hub snout so there is more wall thickness in the keyway area and they make the snout out of steel. They then run a much larger seal in a modded Pontiac timing cover. Travis says this is pretty commonly done on some engines similar to Pontiacs with small hub seals and crank snouts.

Tom Vaught

Still doesn't account for the "thin" crank snout itself, but I can see the benefits of snout to hub engagement.

[Jack Gifford]

Originally Posted by Robert C.

1) ... Ever wonder why a moon keyway? It has less of a stress riser then a flat square cut keyway. It is deeper in the center and has more contact...
2) ... I would like a soft key...

How about if you and I "agree to disagree"?

I gave considerable thought to the above concerns while building up my hemi. My itty-bitty small-bore 6-71 at 8% over didn't create the load that you guys have, but I was striving for every ounce of reliability during long seasons of competition.

1) Instead of two Woodruff keys, I milled a single full-length crank keyway, all the way to the front of the snout. I use a full-length straight key. If you do-the-math, you'll see that unit loading on one full-length key is somewhat lower than with a pair of Woodruff keys. While set up to mill it, I also increased the width a few thou, mainly in the interest of perfectly flat/true sides of the keyway- they get a little beat up over the years, with imprints of Woodruff keys. I first ground a tiny radius on the corners of the end mill's flutes, so I could reduce the stress-risers at the corners.

2) I made a key from pre-heat-treat something-or-other (can't remember without looking it up) in the neighborhood of 32 Rockwell-C. Not truly "hard", but much harder than as-rolled mild steel. I could imagine a mild steel key getting distorted more easily, and sooner-rather-than-later allowing some room for the hub to work back-and-forth on the crank. Yeah, you'd like to think that the torque on the snout bolt would prevent any hub movement, but in real life it's difficult to keep the torque from going away a little bit during hectic sessions on the track.

Although this approach served me well, I don't have a baseline to compare with (mild steel woodruff key or keys), so I don't have any empirical evidence to demonstrate the soundness of my thinking.

[Jack Gifford]

Originally Posted by grnmnstr

Just curious, has anyone ever done 3 keyways?

Is it stronger, can it be done, is it necessary or overkill??

I don't know whether it's been done.
Yes, it could be "stronger", but only if the orientation of all six keyways (three on crank, and three in the hub) is spot-on. If any one keyway is, say, one degree off, the load won't come close to being evenly divided among the three keys.

I can't comment on the necessity/overkill question, as I have no experience with spinning big blowers at high speeds.

[GTOGEORGE]

To go back to the ORIGINAL question Dil starting in the first post in the thread..........who's going to be at Norwalk and try to qualify for the KRE Quick 16 and what do you think the BUMP will be this year. I'm thinking we got a tad bit side tracked in the thread.

I should be there and it's looking like a 8.30 or quicker bump. I all depends on the "doorless" car side of the qualifying!

[SupergasDil]

If all goes as planned, Sweet Willy (500 Plus) should be in the show with the new funny car capable I believe of mid to high 7's.

[GTOGEORGE]

I was just wondering ...............maybe there should be class for the Blown dragster/funny cars kinda a No - Door class), anything goes in the power department, they could run in a Chicago still eliminations we could call it Ultra Pontiacs. Since basically they have no place to race (Frantic 4 only allows door cars and only 1 power adder) and I'm sure they would like to knock some heads together and do some real racing. The Quick 16 just doesn't seem to fit them (you know it's that evil bracket racing thing that some racers are afraid of). Funny cars seem to be popping up everywhere now. I think it woiuld also be a great show like the Frantic 4 & Quick 16. Now how about some Sponsors putting some Bucks for these guys!


GTTO George

[johnta1]

Are you talking of a heads-up race, first to the finish line deal?

[GTOGEORGE]

johnta1 quote: "Are you talking of a heads-up race, first to the finish line deal?"

Yep....................heads up - balls to the walls!



GTO George

[SupergasDil]

Looks like George is installing his tranny this week. I should have my new 40 splined axles Tuesday or Wednesday.

Does anyone know the guy with the 68 GTO or have any pictures? I understand he's got a Kauffman engine similar to mine with a Big and Ugly.

Anyone else thrashing to get their car going for the BIG SHOW ?

[triathlonx13]

Originally Posted by SupergasDil

Anyone else thrashing to get their car going for the BIG SHOW ?

I think more people are scrambling right to the night before the trip out and then still have things left to do when they get there!

We're in the same situation... nothing changes.

.