#1  
Old 12-23-2020, 12:14 AM
Jim Robertson's Avatar
Jim Robertson Jim Robertson is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Abilene Texas
Posts: 1,344
Default Pontiac 350

Starting a thread for all things Pontiac 350. Post up your dyno numbers, track performance numbers and engine combinations. Judgment Free thread.

__________________
Jim
www.raceV8s.com
1972 Trans Am drag car, 3300lbs, 468 ci, Iron D ports, 428 block, 9799103 crank, 9.48 @ 143mph, 6.0 @ 114mph in the 1/8th.
  #2  
Old 12-23-2020, 08:00 AM
taff2's Avatar
taff2 taff2 is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: South Wales in UK.
Posts: 2,172
Default

I used one years back in a turbo combo project, detonation re-positioned most of the ring lands into the oil pan.
I believe it could make for a very good high boost lower (7000) rpm turbo combo, if used with splayed caps,dry decked etc etc. It's still an over square engine despite it's small bore - just look at what the iron 5.3 LS truck blocks are achieving with an inferior deck/small diameter studs. I sonic checked an early 350 a while back, bore walls were around .200" IIRC, and the mains bulkheads were pretty thick too. The block certainly weighed more than a couple of 400 blocks I had.

  #3  
Old 12-23-2020, 10:37 AM
455dan's Avatar
455dan 455dan is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2020
Location: North
Posts: 97
Default

Bruce Fulper built a real potent 350 -several years back,

Can''t remember which mag it was a featured build in.

maybe someone else has a link


IIRC 540 HP on pump gas
\

  #4  
Old 12-23-2020, 11:13 AM
tom s tom s is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: long beach ca usa
Posts: 18,764
Default

Jim,my 366 std deck build is on this site,V heads.Now stay off here and do my intake!LOLTom

The Following User Says Thank You to tom s For This Useful Post:
  #5  
Old 12-23-2020, 11:38 AM
77 TRASHCAN's Avatar
77 TRASHCAN 77 TRASHCAN is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: 31May2013 Temporary home to the world's widest (that we know of) tornado. Lord, NO more Please...
Posts: 6,591
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by tom s View Post
Jim,my 366 std deck build is on this site,V heads.Now stay off here and do my intake!LOLTom


Lol.....

__________________
1977 Black Trans Am 180 HP Auto, essentially base model T/A.
I'm the original owner, purchased May 7, 1977.

Shut it off
Shut it off
Buddy, I just shut your Prius down...
  #6  
Old 12-23-2020, 03:41 PM
AIR RAM AIR RAM is offline
Senior Chief
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Homestead FL
Posts: 412
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 455dan View Post
Bruce Fulper built a real potent 350 -several years back,

Can''t remember which mag it was a featured build in.

maybe someone else has a link


IIRC 540 HP on pump gas
\
Yes he sure did... He copied much of my build!

AFTER I purchased all my parts from R&RE and built my 350 at the Auto Hobby in Aviano Italy. Back then the internet was not what it is today and I purchased all my parts from R&RE while stationed overseas. Spent lots of time on the phone with Bruce talking about the build and spent lots of money with him as well. So he knew exactly what I did to my P350 and he seemed to like it so much he decided to build a similar 350 himself.

I do believe I was one of the first if not the only people to shoe horn a set of 72cc EDL RPM round Ports to a P350 Firebird back in 1997ish...

My engine was .040 bore with 10.75:1cr and ran great on pump gas. I dont recall the cam specs however I still have it, Ill go take a look and see if it has any numbers on it.

over 10 years later I learn that Bruce built and published an article (well after my 350 build) on a similar combination... I kind of expected to read some form of credit given towards my build... but no credit given.

Anyway, the car ran a 13.5 @ 108* <--- Trap speed was good for 12.5x potential but that was with a 10 bolt peg leg (one wheel wonder) . It basically spun one tire all of first and most of 2nd. With traction it would have ran high to mid 11's, I later on added a 4.10 rear gear and an Auburn posi and 6pt roll bars however never got back to the track with that combination. If I had to guess I would say it put down just over 400RWHP and 480ish crank.

Anyway, if I where building a P350 today, I would use the EDL RPM heads out of the box, do a .060+ bore and add a forged crank and run 10-15lbs boost.

SPEED SAFE, NICK

__________________
"The grass is not greener on the other side, its just fertilized with different $h!t"

Last edited by AIR RAM; 12-23-2020 at 04:41 PM.
The Following User Says Thank You to AIR RAM For This Useful Post:
  #7  
Old 12-23-2020, 04:07 PM
455dan's Avatar
455dan 455dan is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2020
Location: North
Posts: 97
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by AIR RAM View Post
Yes he sure did... He copied much of my build!

AFTER I purchased all my parts from R&RE and built my 350 at the Auto Hobby in Aviano Italy. Back then the internet was not what it is today and I purchased all my parts from R&RE while stationed overseas. Spent lots of time on the phone with Bruce talking about the build and spent lots of money with him as well. So he knew exactly what I did to my P350 and he seemed to like it so much he decided to build a similar 350 himself.

I do believe I was one of the first if not the only people to shoe horn a set of 72cc EDL RPM round Ports to a P350 Firebird back in 1997ish...

My engine was .040 bore with 10.75:1cr and ran great on pump gas. I dont recall the cam specs however I still have it, Ill go take a look and see if it has any numbers on it.

over 10 years later I learn that Bruce built and published an article (well after my 350 build) on a similar combination... I kind of expected to read some form of credit given towards my build... but no credit given.

Anyway, the car ran a 13.5 @ 108* <--- Trap speed was good for 12.5x potential with a 10 bolt peg leg. It basically spun all of first and most of 2nd. With traction it would have ran high to mid 11's, I later on added a 4.10 rear gear and an Auburn posi and 6pt roll bars however never got back to the track with that combination.

Anyway, if I where building a P350 today, I would use the EDL RPM heads out of the box, add a forged crank and run boost.

SPEED SAFE, NICK
Wow - learn something new every day.

So your engine was the catalyst for the build.

I just remember reading the article and being kind of blown away by the HP the pump gas 350 produced for its time. Seems like the writer was so surprised that they Tore the engine down because they did not believe it was really just a 350 cube engine.
Yeah I don't remember any credit given for the 1st iteration or builder, just Bruce RRE.

My hat is off to you Sir.

It would be great to have your complete build listed, Kind of a "Broke the mold" engine.

heck I have couple P 350's sitting , maybe someday with the right project car.


Last edited by 455dan; 12-23-2020 at 04:28 PM.
  #8  
Old 12-23-2020, 04:38 PM
Bill Eveland's Avatar
Bill Eveland Bill Eveland is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Glasford Il
Posts: 3,650
Default

Not going to bring up this guys name , as im not sure if this guy is on here but had a potent 354 build... this was his reply

.455SD rods, light venolia pistons, RAIV 722 heads ported to 310 cfm, ( far easier with aluminum heads we have today) 2.02/1.71 valves, 59cc chambers, pistons .005" out of the hole, stock gm head gaskets because they match the bore, today I'd use a victor intake, instead of the cut and wielded, ported Holley street dominator, 2" to 2 1/8" headers. 1050 dominator on a homemade tapered wood spacer of if a 2x6,( that was 2 tenths over the 800!!!) Cam was a custom backwards grind by UD Harold, 274/267 @.060", lift was .620"/.600" on a 111 LSA. Dual point Borg Warner distributor set up on an old sun machine. Added a second oil feed in the mains,

__________________
Illinois Outlaw Gassers

6.27@107
9.97@131
  #9  
Old 12-23-2020, 04:39 PM
ponyakr's Avatar
ponyakr ponyakr is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: North Louisiana
Posts: 7,621
Default

Can't talk about Pontiac 350 engines, in the race section, without mentioning all the quick national record holding '74 Venturas that have run, thru the years. They've won big races & got class wins at Indy.

Bill Rink ran quick in Stock, & is still quick with his '74 GTO, in SS.

Also been some quick '77 Birds running a 350, in Stock & SS. Mike Morgan still runs one in a '77 SS Formy. He's won class at Indy & has been R/U to Bill Rink several times.

Member Adam Strang ran some 10.80's with his 350HO powered '68 Bird Stocker.

My Pontiac friend, who is also a member here, won quite a few dirt races with a Pontiac 350.

The Following User Says Thank You to ponyakr For This Useful Post:
  #10  
Old 12-23-2020, 05:21 PM
455Grandville's Avatar
455Grandville 455Grandville is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: St Genevieve County
Posts: 1,536
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by AIR RAM View Post
Yes he sure did... He copied much of my build!

AFTER I purchased all my parts from R&RE and built my 350 at the Auto Hobby in Aviano Italy. Back then the internet was not what it is today and I purchased all my parts from R&RE while stationed overseas. Spent lots of time on the phone with Bruce talking about the build and spent lots of money with him as well. So he knew exactly what I did to my P350 and he seemed to like it so much he decided to build a similar 350 himself.

I do believe I was one of the first if not the only people to shoe horn a set of 72cc EDL RPM round Ports to a P350 Firebird back in 1997ish...

My engine was .040 bore with 10.75:1cr and ran great on pump gas. I dont recall the cam specs however I still have it, Ill go take a look and see if it has any numbers on it.

over 10 years later I learn that Bruce built and published an article (well after my 350 build) on a similar combination... I kind of expected to read some form of credit given towards my build... but no credit given.

Anyway, the car ran a 13.5 @ 108* <--- Trap speed was good for 12.5x potential but that was with a 10 bolt peg leg (one wheel wonder) . It basically spun one tire all of first and most of 2nd. With traction it would have ran high to mid 11's, I later on added a 4.10 rear gear and an Auburn posi and 6pt roll bars however never got back to the track with that combination. If I had to guess I would say it put down just over 400RWHP and 480ish crank.

Anyway, if I where building a P350 today, I would use the EDL RPM heads out of the box, do a .060+ bore and add a forged crank and run 10-15lbs boost.

SPEED SAFE, NICK
That’s impressive, and that guy sure has a bad rep.

__________________
Two 1975 455 Grandvilles &
'79 455 Trans Am
‘69 Camaro SS 396/375 (owned since ‘88)
‘22 Toyota Sequoia V8
‘23 Lexus LS500 awd
‘95 Ford F-super duty 4wd 7.3 p-stroke
& countless Jeeps & off road vehicles.
  #11  
Old 12-23-2020, 07:22 PM
PontiacJim1959 PontiacJim1959 is offline
Suspended
 
Join Date: Dec 2019
Location: Gastonia, NC
Posts: 492
Default

Here is the build for the Royal Pontiac 1969 350HO Firebird that ran in the Super Stack class, SS/J, that pulled an 11.92 1/4 mile time.

The other build is the Fulper specs for the 540HP 350CI magazine article.

Attention must be given to the valve-to-bore clearances when using the larger valve heads and the bore will need to be notched if it does not have them.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	1969  Royal Pontiac 350HO Firebird.JPG
Views:	419
Size:	51.2 KB
ID:	556756   Click image for larger version

Name:	Pontiac 350CI - 540 HP.jpg
Views:	390
Size:	78.4 KB
ID:	556757  

  #12  
Old 12-23-2020, 11:11 PM
Stan Weiss's Avatar
Stan Weiss Stan Weiss is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Posts: 5,000
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by PontiacJim1959 View Post
Here is the build for the Royal Pontiac 1969 350HO Firebird that ran in the Super Stack class, SS/J, that pulled an 11.92 1/4 mile time.

The other build is the Fulper specs for the 540HP 350CI magazine article.

Attention must be given to the valve-to-bore clearances when using the larger valve heads and the bore will need to be notched if it does not have them.
On the Fulper engine do they give cam spec's? Does it say at what RPM it made 540 HP?

Stan

__________________
Stan Weiss/World Wide Enterprises
Offering Performance Software Since 1987
http://www.magneticlynx.com/carfor/carfor.htm
David Vizard & Stan Weiss' IOP / Flow / Induction Optimization - Cam Selection Software
http://www.magneticlynx.com/DV
Download FREE 14 Trial IOP / Flow Software
http://www.magneticlynx.com/DV/Flow_..._Day_Trial.php
Pontiac Pump Gas List
http://www.magneticlynx.com/carfor/pont_gas.htm
Using PMD Block and Heads List
http://www.magneticlynx.com/carfor/pont_pmd.htm
  #13  
Old 12-24-2020, 08:03 AM
F/S GTO F/S GTO is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Jericho, Vt, USA
Posts: 98
Default

'68 Firebird NHRA Stock Eliminator 350 HO combination. The best it went was 10.80 @123 mph. Minimum weight is 3220 weighed 3300. I was still finding the sweet spot with the clutch that I just had freshened so the 60 ft was off.
.080 over bore,block filled halfway up the coolant holes,stock stroke,Eagle rods and CP pistons. Stock 140 intake and Q-jet carb, .420 lift cam and #18 heads that flow 200 cfm.
Shift at 6200 rpm and cross the finish line at 7k.

Did some updates this past summer the motor is back in the car for next summer,hoping for some 10.60's.


Last edited by F/S GTO; 12-24-2020 at 08:12 AM.
  #14  
Old 12-24-2020, 08:50 AM
ponyakr's Avatar
ponyakr ponyakr is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: North Louisiana
Posts: 7,621
Default

"...The best it went was 10.80 @123 mph...weighed 3300...stock stroke, Eagle rods and CP pistons. Stock 140 intake and Q-jet carb, .420 lift cam and #18 heads that flow 200 cfm.
Shift at 6200 rpm and cross the finish line at 7k.

Did some updates...hoping for some 10.60's. "

Now, for all you "experts" that do all sorts of calculations, exactly how much cam & head flow is "supposed" to be needed to make that much power ?

  #15  
Old 12-24-2020, 09:07 AM
F/S GTO F/S GTO is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Jericho, Vt, USA
Posts: 98
Default

It's not just how much the motor makes for power but also the car it's going into.

The Following User Says Thank You to F/S GTO For This Useful Post:
  #16  
Old 12-24-2020, 09:19 AM
ponyakr's Avatar
ponyakr ponyakr is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: North Louisiana
Posts: 7,621
Default

The quickest 350 powered '74 Stocker I'm aware of has run some real low 11's. Don't think it's dipped into the 10's, yet.

It's driven by Brad Koivisto. Was a GTO for years. This year, I noticed that it has a flat Ventura hood. Don't know if he got tired of having to deal with the shaker, or if there is a performance advantage, when running without it.

Reminds me of the 1974 US Nats. Al Vanis won Stock, in a Ventura. Rock Running won his class, in a '74 GTO.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Brad K. 11.06 .jpg
Views:	275
Size:	46.5 KB
ID:	556784   Click image for larger version

Name:	US Nats Winner .jpg
Views:	292
Size:	66.4 KB
ID:	556785   Click image for larger version

Name:	Rock Class US Nats .jpg
Views:	263
Size:	88.2 KB
ID:	556786  


Last edited by ponyakr; 12-24-2020 at 09:32 AM.
The Following User Says Thank You to ponyakr For This Useful Post:
  #17  
Old 12-24-2020, 10:24 AM
Stan Weiss's Avatar
Stan Weiss Stan Weiss is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Posts: 5,000
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by F/S GTO View Post
'68 Firebird NHRA Stock Eliminator 350 HO combination. The best it went was 10.80 @123 mph. Minimum weight is 3220 weighed 3300. I was still finding the sweet spot with the clutch that I just had freshened so the 60 ft was off.
.080 over bore,block filled halfway up the coolant holes,stock stroke,Eagle rods and CP pistons. Stock 140 intake and Q-jet carb, .420 lift cam and #18 heads that flow 200 cfm.
Shift at 6200 rpm and cross the finish line at 7k.

Did some updates this past summer the motor is back in the car for next summer,hoping for some 10.60's.
Adam,
Thank you for the additional information. I have added it to your 350 entry on the list. If I have missed anything, typed something in wrong, or you would like anything updated please let me know. Since you maybe the only stick car on the list can you share who's clutch you use?

PMD Heads and Block List.
http://www.magneticlynx.com/carfor/pont_pmd.htm

Stan

__________________
Stan Weiss/World Wide Enterprises
Offering Performance Software Since 1987
http://www.magneticlynx.com/carfor/carfor.htm
David Vizard & Stan Weiss' IOP / Flow / Induction Optimization - Cam Selection Software
http://www.magneticlynx.com/DV
Download FREE 14 Trial IOP / Flow Software
http://www.magneticlynx.com/DV/Flow_..._Day_Trial.php
Pontiac Pump Gas List
http://www.magneticlynx.com/carfor/pont_gas.htm
Using PMD Block and Heads List
http://www.magneticlynx.com/carfor/pont_pmd.htm
  #18  
Old 12-24-2020, 10:34 AM
Stan Weiss's Avatar
Stan Weiss Stan Weiss is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Posts: 5,000
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ponyakr View Post
"...The best it went was 10.80 @123 mph...weighed 3300...stock stroke, Eagle rods and CP pistons. Stock 140 intake and Q-jet carb, .420 lift cam and #18 heads that flow 200 cfm.
Shift at 6200 rpm and cross the finish line at 7k.

Did some updates...hoping for some 10.60's. "

Now, for all you "experts" that do all sorts of calculations, exactly how much cam & head flow is "supposed" to be needed to make that much power ?
There is NO fixed calculation for HP per cfm. Based on the estimated HP on the list he is at 2.5 HP per cfm.

Stan

__________________
Stan Weiss/World Wide Enterprises
Offering Performance Software Since 1987
http://www.magneticlynx.com/carfor/carfor.htm
David Vizard & Stan Weiss' IOP / Flow / Induction Optimization - Cam Selection Software
http://www.magneticlynx.com/DV
Download FREE 14 Trial IOP / Flow Software
http://www.magneticlynx.com/DV/Flow_..._Day_Trial.php
Pontiac Pump Gas List
http://www.magneticlynx.com/carfor/pont_gas.htm
Using PMD Block and Heads List
http://www.magneticlynx.com/carfor/pont_pmd.htm
  #19  
Old 12-24-2020, 11:01 AM
F/S GTO F/S GTO is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Jericho, Vt, USA
Posts: 98
Default

All I'm going to say it's sintered iron!��

  #20  
Old 12-24-2020, 11:33 AM
wbnapier wbnapier is offline
Chief Ponti-yacker
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Encinitas, CA
Posts: 590
Default

For those of you interested, this gentleman has a multiple series Pontiac 350 build on Youtube. The first video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cdNhF-UCsX4

__________________
1965 Pontiac GTO
455/469 w/ #48 Heads, '65 Tri-Power
9.25:1 CR
Stump Puller Cam
Muncie M22W 1st-2.56 2nd-1.75 3rd-1.37 4th-1.00
3.55 Rear Differential
Front: 225/60R15 Height: 25.6"
Rear: 275/60R15 Height: 28"
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:49 AM.

 

About Us

The PY Online Forums is the largest online gathering of Pontiac enthusiasts anywhere in the world. Founded in 1991, it was also the first online forum for people to gather and talk about their Pontiacs. Since then, it has become the mecca of Pontiac technical data and knowledge that no other place can surpass.

 




Copyright © 2017