[b-man]

Originally Posted by jsn829

Working on the same project for my 70 gto. If I use the new auto trans, I wonder how the speedo will work?? I have a 200r4 (built) that I also could use. The mpg will be great.

I was doing some research and saw there is a conversion tail housing offered for the 4L60E trans to run a speedo cable:http://jagsthatrun.com/4L60_Order.html

I contacted a trans builder that I know who sponsors the Pontiac Drag Days bracket racing series out here, Hubbe's Performance http://www.hubbes.com/. Hubbe says he can set me up with a 4L65E (stronger version of the 4L60E) and a torque converter for around 2K. I'll see if the 4L60E tailhousing/cable driven speedo conversion will fit the 4L65E and if so, I'll have that included with my trans build.

Still busy doing my research, when I'm more certain about what parts I need then I'll start ordering things.

[70 Lemans]

What is the estimated cost of such a transplant? Certainly not planning a project but I’m curious as I’m sure others are too. $10’000 $15”000 Soup to Nuts.

[b-man]

Hoping I don't spend much more than 12K.

The new LS3 crate engine is half the 12K cost if I go that direction, rather than find a low-miles engine from a wrecked 'vette.

It's very easy to spend over 10K for any good street V8 that makes 450+HP along with a good overdrive trans that will handle some power. Exhaust, cooling and fuel system go along with that too.

Rough numbers:

New LS3 crate engine - $6200 (Very easy to spend this much building a top-notch street engine of any brand)

Engine wiring harness, new GM - $900

Complete set of Corvette accessory drives - $800 (aftermarket serpentine belt setups easily cost this much or more)

Vintage Air A/C setup - $1000

Headers - $600

Engine mounts - $150

4L65E trans and converter/Lokar dipstick tube/B&M trans cooler - $2200

Driveshaft - $150

Fuel system (aftermarket stainless fuel tank with internal EFI pump) - $600

Radiator (universal aluminum crossflow) - $200

Cooling fans (4th gen F-body or?) - $150 to $200

That's 13k already.

Whatever it takes, this hobby does cost some money to pursue as we all know.

[b-man]

Found out about a company who makes EFI-ready steel fuel tanks for our older cars, Spectra Premium Industries Inc. located in Canada.

I saw one on Rock Auto for $451.99 plus $75.96 shipping. Still looking around for the best price on it.

Specs on the part # GM37FFI tank/pump combo I'm going to purchase. The pump will reportedly handle up to 550 HP, I'm only planning on having about 450-460 HP:

US Gallon : 20
Liter : 76
Size : 37 1/4" x 30" x 6 3/4"
Strap Set : ST48; SSST48
Comments : W/O VENT PIPE; INCLUDES SENDER ASSEMBLY WITH STOCK-CAPACITY FUEL PUMP 85-115 PSI / 50-60 GPH; (0-95 OHMS); (45° FLARED FITTINGS (SAE) / THREADS 3/8 - 24)
Kit No : LO01

[gto65lvr]

Neat I know spectra made regular tanks but not these very cool and cheaper than the fabbed out tanks very very cool and smart stinking.

By the time you do it your conversion will be a breeze to perform

[ponjohn]

Bman- you might to consider a FAST computer with a speartech harness. I believe they can control autos AND give yo user friendly tune-ability.

I plan on doing this to a 69 GTO. you can not beat the power, fuel economy and size. It is hard to overlook the modern ammenitites like cruise, a/c and heat when doing it a complete retro.

[b-man]

I see Speartech mentioned a couple of times here, I'll see what they have to offer and likely go with their product.

Going to look into purchasing the fuel tank/pump assembly tomorrow, I have another lead on where to buy the SPI tank.

Also going to contact my trans guy (Hubbe) and try to firm up a final price and delivery time on the 4L65E with lockup converter.

I might have to upgrade my exhaust, my current 2-1/2" Dynomax Super Turbo mufflers are only rated for a tad less than 400 HP before they start to restrict the power. New mufflers may be in the cards, or perhaps an entirely new 3" exhaust.

Gotta get this thing going.

[Chief Wanabee]

B-man- cool project. Might want to jump on getting that fuel tank asap - Cdn dollar has dropped a huge amount against USD in the last month or so.

[andrewb70]

Originally Posted by b-man

Andrew,

..........

1.) What is the part # for the LS7 cam?

I'm all for running OEM stuff in this engine rather than aftermarket for longevity's sake. LS7 427 cam specs: Duration @ .050 211/230,.593/.588 lift with 1.8:1 rockers, lift will be reduced to .560/.555 with stock LS3 1.7:1 rockers (fine by me).

2.) Exactly what rubber (or urethane?) engine mounts/OEM steel frame mounts do I need to make the Edelbrock (P/N 6701) adapter plates work? Link to adapter plates:http://store.summitracing.com/egnsea...+115&x=23&y=11

I assume I'll need to source some Chevelle pieces here. I've done some searching/reading on a couple of different sites and I see different combinations of wide/narrow/short/tall Chevelle engine mounts and frame mounts mentioned for the A-body swaps. Which direction do I need to go here?

3.) How much ground clearance do the Edelbrock (P/N 65073) LSX swap headers offer? How far do they hang below the frame rail on your car Andrew? Link to headers:http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=EDL%2D65073&N=700 +4294923429+400065+4294839039+4294918680+429479936 5+115&autoview=sku

4.) Which oil pans will work with the engine in this mounting position, either factory or aftermarket?

I noticed while reading through your thread that you bought an aftermarket pan from Autokraft for your '70. Since buying that pan have you learned anything more about other pan options for the A-body cars?

I am really leaning towards running an un-modified factory pan. I know my car won't have the cornering ability to require anything more than a factory pan. I'd like to retain any additional bottom end reinforcement the thick cast aluminum pan has to offer, even though that added stiffness may be more sales hype than fact. Also trying to keep costs in check here, I really don't want to spend $400-$600 on an aftermarket pan and possibly relocate the oil filter.

The Corvette pan that the LS3 engine comes with is supposed to be fairly compact, but I'm considering the GM factory LH8 pan which is even more compact and supposed to be a good fit for early GM F & A-body LSX conversions (2008 Hummer H3 Alpha pan w/gasket & bolts: P/N 12614821, pickup/screen: P/N 12608593). P/N 19212593 is for the kit that includes the pan, pump pick up, dipstick, hardware, gaskets, and windage tray http://paceperformance.com/index.asp...&ProdID=245308.

I've seen a picture of the LH8 pan in a '64 Lemans with a BRP mounting kit but I'm not sure if the engine is mounted in close to the same location as mine will be. It looks to sit a bit higher with the BRP kit than I want mine to sit, not sure. The engine mounts look tall, and it appears the engine is sitting high to help the accessory drives clear the frame/steering components with minimal cutting/grinding. Link to thread with pics:http://www.pro-touring.com/forum/showthread.php?t=43481 The LH8 pan looks to hang about 1" below the crossmember, not a big issue as I'm assuming the Edelbrock headers will hang about that far below the bottom of the frame rail as well.

Thanks again to you and to everyone else here who have taken the time to help me with their constructive input.

So far it looks like the Edelbrock engine mounting plates and headers will be on order pretty soon, still up in the air on the oil pan and exactly what OEM engine mounts I'll need.

Bart

Bart,

I am sorry for the late response, but let me see if I can tackle some of your questions.

1. No clue. LOL. I got mine from Jeff Schwartz. Give him a call. I think he has a couple of new, take out, LS7 cams sitting around that were taken out of new crate engines. http://www.schwartzperformance.com/

2. Used the exact same parts that I had with the BBC. I have reproduction Chevelle big block frame stands and Energy Suspension, tall/narrow poly mounts.

3. I haven't measured the ground clearance, but the Edelbrock headers tuck up nicely. I can take a measurement if this is critical. I will say that they are the best fitting headers I have ever owned.

4. For me, the only option was the Autokraft pan. From everything that I have read, non of the OEM pans will work the the Edelbrock mounts. I needed to use the Edelbrock mounts because their engineer claimed that their mounts will position my bellhousing in the exact same location as it was with my BBC. This was critical for me since I did not change the transmission. My shifter needed to be in the same location as before. As it turned out, Edelbrock designed the mounts as promised and my shifter is in exactly the same location as before. I asked if I can use the CTSV pan, but the Edelbrock engineer told me I could not and sent me pictures that showed where the pan hit. Believe me, they really wanted an OEM pan to work, but as it stands none do. So with that I got the Autokraft pan because it is the only steel pan that retains the oil filter in the stock location. That was the critical feature for me. I would never use the LH8 pan. It hangs 2 inches below the front crossmember. That just looks hideous.

If you don't mind moving the engine back I have seen swaps that use the 4th gen F-body pans. Keep in mind that moving the engine back can present problems with the heads hitting the firewall if you ever have to swap transmission. When the seal in my hydraulic TOB blew I had to pull the trans. With the engine in the stock location I was able to really tip the transmission down and service it without an issues. I can see if the engine was further back the heads might hit the firewall.

I hope that helps.

Andrew

[Northern Goat]

B-Man
I am doing an LS2/T56 swap into my 71 Bird. Here is my 0.02

ATS - I ordered their clutch master and bracket. Not cheap, but awesome products. I think he is one man show so communincation is poor.

BRP (Muscle Rods)- I purchased their header and they are amazing. A true bolt in. Shawn is a great guy to deal with, very knowledgable and helpful. They are doing a LS into a 64 Tempest as well.

Howell Industries - Modified the stock wiring harness for my swap. No issues with them.

I got the Spectre gas tank within a week and it fit great.

I can only tell you how all the pieces fit as the car is still in the body shop, but I can tell you everything went together well.

[gto65lvr]

This is great no nonsense straight up info love it keep it coming everything major has just about been addressed. Very good to know about the E swap brakets and having the trans in the proper position.

Still curious about the BRP engine mount swap about the location. Also the LH8 pan versus the other steel pan in relation to ground clearance. I agree i would not like it so low past the front x member.

I have a funny feeling I will be doing an LS swap in my future onto one of my A bodys.

[b-man]

Andrew, do you know the part # or what year/engine application the Corvette fuel filter/regulator that you used is for so I can order one?

Also, would you have any part #'s handy for your reproduction Chevelle big block frame stands and Energy Suspension, tall/narrow poly mounts? The same for your Autokraft pan?

I would also really appreciate a couple of header measurements when you have some time:

1) From the bottom of the lowermost header tubes to the bottom of the framerail, how far they hang below the frame. A ground clearance measurement on your car won't be useful.

2) From the bellhousing to engine interface (where the engine and bellhousing bolt together) to the end of the header collector. This will help me see if there will be any header collector interference with my column shift linkage.

I posted in a thread on the Pro-Touring forums http://www.pro-touring.com/forum/showthread.php?t=48410 a couple of days ago asking Phil at BRP MuscleRods about the location of the engine/trans using their mounts & heads, no response yet. I have a feeling their stuff doesn't mount the engine where I want it. Also not sure if their headers are 409 stainless like the Edelbrock ones.

That's fine, because now I know the Edelbrock stuff will work along with the Autokraft pan. Just trying to look at different options.

Thanks again to everyone chiming in with useful info.

[andrewb70]

Originally Posted by b-man

Ordered my SPI fuel tank, my lead could only come in a few dollars under my best price so far (Rock Auto), so I decided to place my order while I was on the phone.

Andrew, do you know the part # or what year/engine application the Corvette fuel filter/regulator that you used is for so I can order one?

Also, would you have any part #'s handy for your reproduction Chevelle big block frame stands and Energy Suspension, tall/narrow poly mounts? The same for your Autokraft pan?

I would also really appreciate a couple of header measurements when you have some time:

1) From the bottom of the lowermost header tubes to the bottom of the framerail, how far they hang below the frame. A ground clearance measurement on your car won't be useful.

2) From the bellhousing to engine interface (where the engine and bellhousing bolt together) to the end of the header collector. This will help me see if there will be any header collector interference with my column shift linkage.

I posted in a thread on the Pro-Touring forums http://www.pro-touring.com/forum/showthread.php?t=48410 a couple of days ago asking Phil at BRP MuscleRods about the location of the engine/trans using their mounts & heads, no response yet. I have a feeling their stuff doesn't mount the engine where I want it. Also not sure if their headers are 409 stainless like the Edelbrock ones.

That's fine, because now I know the Edelbrock stuff will work along with the Autokraft pan. Just trying to look at different options.

Thanks again to everyone chiming in with useful info.

Corvette filter/regulator combo ACDELCO Part # GF822 1999-2003 Corvette

Chevelle frame stands Year One Part # FM36

Energy Suspension engine mounts: http://www.energysuspension.com/pages/mt_tr1.html

Autokraft Oilpan: http://www.autokraft.org/products/

Give me a few days and I will get you the header measurements.

Andrew

[b-man]

Originally Posted by andrewb70

Corvette filter/regulator combo ACDELCO Part # GF822 1999-2003 Corvette

Chevelle frame stands Year One Part # FM36

Energy Suspension engine mounts: http://www.energysuspension.com/pages/mt_tr1.html

Autokraft Oilpan: http://www.autokraft.org/products/

Give me a few days and I will get you the header measurements.

Andrew

Thanks Andrew.

Just ordered the SPI tank and GF822 filter/regulator from Rock Auto (got a 5% discount using their current discount code 831778737458, this code expires December 21st).

Ordered the Autokraft oilpan and FM36 Chevelle frame stands too.

I'll order the Edelbrock headers and mount adapters along with the 3.117G Energy Suspension urethane mounts (tall/narrow) from Summit Racing after I see the results of the header measurements. The Edelbrock headers don't look overly long for a long-tube header, seems like they would be good to clear my ol' Granny column shift linkage.

After I get all of these items delivered I'll order the new LS3 engine with Corvette accessories and get my 4L65E trans built up.

Trying to keep moving forward.

[Skip Fix]

After driving my wife's 02 Avalanche and it's 5.3 and my 04 GTO with just an LS1 I to am impressed with these motors, broad torque curve also.

Sounds like a neat deal!

[Larry Navarro]

yeah Skip, my '07 sliverado has the 5.3 with "torque management". Gm's solution to busting up driveline components. It's a turd performance wise.
My old '96 vortec had better response.

[440GP69]

my 06 silvy doesn't have it and Mine flies for a truck!

[78 GHOST]

I'm a little late to this party, but..

wouldn't a dry sump solve a lot of problems (at a large cost.)

I noticed the LS7 available for around $13K. All the dry sump crap adds another $2000+. You'd be well past your budget, but 505 HP would be really kewl.

Nice project Bart!

[b-man]

Originally Posted by 78 GHOST

I'm a little late to this party, but..

wouldn't a dry sump solve a lot of problems (at a large cost.)

I noticed the LS7 available for around $13K. All the dry sump crap adds another $2000+. You'd be well past your budget, but 505 HP would be really kewl.

Nice project Bart!

The LS7 is over twice the cost of the LS3 as you know. Both use the same heads, with the LS7 having them CNC ported for about another 20 cfm of flow along with some lighter valves.

The Autokraft oil pan already has road race baffling built right in, and the sump shape solves any engine to chassis fitment problem. Done deal, I'm already signed up. No way will my Tempest corner hard enough to need the dry sump oiling system, not that I wouldn't want it.

It's pretty easy to add another 75 to 100 HP to the LS3, it could be done for a grand or two. A set of headers brings it right up to 450-460 HP, keeping the mild (fuel efficient) stock 204/211 cam. The LS3 is simply the performance bargain of the decade in my eyes.

$6200 buys you an all-aluminum V8 engine (about 430 pounds total weight I'm pretty sure) with port EFI, big-time head airflow, a hydraulic roller cam and rockers, a lightweight heat-rejecting tuned intake, and more. You couldn't even purchase a bare aluminum aftermarket Pontiac block for the entire price of this engine.

It's all economics, I'll be getting the biggest bang for my performance dollar here. The engine makes great power, and is far lighter than any aluminum-headed iron-block Pontiac engine. Makes the car handle, a must-have for me.

Pulled the Tempest out of the garage after spending half the weekend cleaning up and making some room to work, it's on.

[Lemans64]

Are u gonna change out the front springs or just cut a coil, the weight diff of the engine should make it sit high?? I used the stock replacements in mine, but have SBC and had to cut 1 coil off to get the upper control arms off the rubber stops. just another though for the process. LOL.

Rick