[64speed]

My machinist was using the summit mini starter I provided him to bump the engine over today and he said it worked about three times and then either hung up or something I wasn’t clear and busted every tooth off the starter drive. He put an AC DELCO full-size starter on it so we can break it in tomorrow but he told me it would never come off with the headers on and that I needed to look at other Mini starters. Anybody got a recommendation? I looked at the dyna Force from MSD. The price is up there but the reviews are phenomenal. What is everyone else using? I looked at the starters on summit and Butler’s website. My friend bought the 180 dollar something one from Butler and it was not machined correctly right off the bat so that’s a no go. How about ROBBMC?

[Mike Davis]

I have used the Summit starter for years (actually have 3 starters) and never had an issue. This was cranking a 11.5:1 440CID engine in my 66. John Langer runs one as well and I am sure he is over 14:1 compression. Sounds to me like he did not have it shimmed right.
I am currently running the CVR and it seems to be working well.

[64speed]

I asked him specifically about the shimming and he said it worked beautifully for the first three turn then it just ripped every tooth off on the fourth

[Ducks Goat]

I've used a Summit and Powermaster for years with no issues as well.

[Scarebird]

No issues here.

[Formulajones]

We've used the Summit and Powermasters here. I personally haven't had an issue, but I tend to avoid starters that don't have a pinion support but at a weak moment I've tried a couple, and with Pontiacs you don't have a lot of choices either. I never kept them on for very long and when removed they sure had some play in them, but were working okay.

Dad on the other hand has been through a few starters. He started with a Summit, and it spit the gear off. C-clip failed and the gear just fell on the ground. He slid it back on and got it home. Put a C-clip on it and used it for a short period before he decided to try a RobbMC. On the first one the gear came loose. Sent back to Robb and he admitted the retention ball wasn't installed with Loctite. Fixed it for free. Recommended more shims so I did. It then proceeded to chew the teeth right off the gear. In a pinch dad installed another Summit starter, again with no pinion support. It's been on for about a year and it's starting to sound pretty bad. I don't know how many starts it has left in it. So he called Robb and sent the chewed up starter back for repair. This time $75 for a new gear and solenoid and it's good to go. Going to install that shortly with a new flexplate this time.

At least with the RobbMC you get excellent customer service and he stands behind his work, and turn around is quick.

[Scott65]

I didn't have good luck with the Summit starter. It may have made a couple of years, but I don't drive my car very frequently. Failed at the Southern Nationals in Dallas. Very bad timing, hacked me off. David Butler if I remember correctly offered to loan me one, but it didn't fit. Made the rest of the race, and the shootout on a stocker, then bought an IMI. It's been on there ever since(knocks on wood) About 15 years now if memory serves me.

[77poncho]

i have the summit mini starter.. no issues.. had about 3 years.. had heat soak issues with the big full size starter tho.. this is the starter i have.. also im running a 461..

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/sum-820311

[64speed]

Maybe I just got a bad one because the teeth stripping off is a unique failure to me as well. I will take it to United rebuilders which is a locally owned one man shop here in town. They rebuilt my Kubota starter for 80 bucks when Kubota wanted over 600 bucks for a replacement. I will ask them what they think the cause of failure was and then let them rebuild it if they deem it worthy. Like I said my machinist said it was perfect three times then just spit the teeth in the floor on the fourth go round. We shall see.

[NeighborsComplaint]

Powermaster here. No starting issues other than an occasional groan on a hot start. I could not clock it for best clearance and the positive lug points straight at a header tube with about 1/4" clearance on my '71.

Before that I had a high torque Delco style that heat soaked all the time even with a high temp solenoid and went to a Ford Solenoid on the fender. It worked very reliably until I went with my Milodon pan and realized I would never get it out to replace it without dropping the driver side header.

[TCSGTO]

The Summit starter I was running turned the 455 over with no problems for years but struggled with the 517 when it got hot. I run a lot of initial advance. I replaced it with a Powermaster Ultra-Torque that spins the engine over in all conditions easily. It’s pricier than the entry level Powermaster XS but worth it.

Had a pinion gear issue with a RobbMc also and it had the pinion support. I’ve heard they changed the way they retain the gear since then.

[Scott Stoneburg]

Ive been using a Power Master mini starter for many years. The same starter was on my 462, now on my 474. Never have any issues relater to the starter. I'm sure the Summit starters are good. Probably just got a bad one. That's the main issue, .IMHO, with knock off starters. ( or any knock off product) the quality control is hit or miss.

[TAQuest]

Just a heads up; With Doug's headers the big one fits and you can easily take it on and off while the engine is installed in the car.

[Firebob]

I've run CVR, IMI, MSD Dyna Force and am currently running a Powermaster mini. All of them worked fine for me till they quit. The last one, the MSD, seemed like the best one. It should for the price tag. When it started giving me trouble I called MSD and they said they don't do their rebuilds in-house anymore. They actually send them down the street to powermaster to have them rebuilt. Sent it to them and, surprise, they said it wasn't worth rebuilding. All burned up inside from cranking it with insufficient voltage. They were nice enough to sell me a new powermaster mini. Seems fine. Its a little smaller so better clearance around it for cooling or removal.

[78w72]

another summit starter user with no problems after 5+ years on a 10.75:1 467. ive also read that the summit is the same part as a powermaster just reboxed. & did you buy the starter new? if so summit will most likely replace it.

have read positive reviews on robbmc starters.

[Lee]

A few months back, my buddy was having starting issues. He had a Jeg's mini starter, which is likely the same as Summit's. The motor would turn over fine for several times, then for no rhyme or reason, you'd just get a soft solenoid "click" when you turned the key. We installed better cables, cleaned terminals, repaired questionably previously sliced wires, shimmed it up and down.... No difference.

I had a CVR mini starter that I was going to use for something else. I threw it on to test. It has been on for months now, and now problems.

[JUDGE3]

I would use only starters with the pinion support. I don't recall the vendor but its a well known one. think its BOP? iv'e not used it, but supposed to be a good one.

if you think pulling headers to change a stock starter is a hassel, wait till the unsupported mini breaks a few teeth off your expensive flexplate. tranny pull time.

for me, I decided not to use headers this time around so I went back to a high torque stock type powermaster.

thought: most drive these cars as hobby cars. so not that often comparing to a daily driver. so seems to me a heat shielded stock starter WITH headers should last a long time, which at the time it fails, its not that big a deal to loosen the header and change it. the grief of the mini is not worth it. been there done that, and yes I had it installed exactly to spec.

[68WarDog]

Power Master XS torque starters

[68lemans462]

Ive never had any problems with my ROBBMC starter (without pinion support).

[Formulajones]

Originally Posted by TCSGTO

Had a pinion gear issue with a RobbMc also and it had the pinion support. I’ve heard they changed the way they retain the gear since then.

I was wondering about that. We used the pinion support as well, and when the gear fell loose, Robb told us he didn't use Loctite on that little bb ball. When I first saw it I didn't like that retention method from the get go.

So this go around I see he offers what is a gen II starter. I assume with some updates as you mentioned. He said it's a ford style starter with more gear reduction.

So dad's thought was to have this current Robb starter fixed and also buy the new Gen II and have one as a backup. But when Robb fixed this one he told dad it is a Gen II. So I guess the Gen II still has the same gear retention method, which I was bummed about. Oh well.