[Qman]

Hi to everybody
I hope all of you had a nice Chrsitmas spending some quality times with the ones you love.

My name is Andreas and I'm 58 years old, located in North-Germany close to Hamburg.
About 10 years ago I bought my first US car a black Corvette C5 Z06


After 6 years I made the upgrade to a C7 convertible:

the white one is mine. That day I drove my first round on the Nürburgring and it was not easy!!
Its the fastest car I owned so far (194 mph on the german Autobahn)

Since 5 years I am a board member of the "Corvette Club Hamburg" which is the biggest one in Germany (160 members). The club is almost 40 years old.

Since ever I love the sound of the older V8 US muscle cars. So I decided to by one and found a 1967 Pontiac Lemans convertible that I will look at next Saturday:
https://suchen.mobile.de/fahrzeuge/d...m&id=311623325

I wonder if some of you can give me some ideas where to look at. May be there is a kind of checklist available that I didn't find here?
Any input is welcome.
I wish you all the best for 2021 and stay healthy!

Andreas

[tempest1964]

Welcome to the forum Andreas. That’s a very nice looking car, although I had a little trouble reading the German. Lol. Others here will chime in with advice on what to look for. A lot of knowledge on this Forum. Good luck and keep everyone posted on your purchase.

[ID67goat]

Looks like a nice Lemans!

Like any old car no matter the Pontiac Chevrolet, Ford you should check these general things:

Check for rust in the: floor boards, trunk, lower fenders, quarter panels, and the bottom of the doors. Look for obvious frame damage, body filler, etc.

Otherwise make sure there are no abnormal engine noises etc. or drivability issues. Most of this should be OK with the the vehicle inspection required in Germany.

I know I probably missed something, but I am sure that someone else will help out with this.

[Radman]

It is a nice looking car. As mentioned look for rust in the doors, fenders, and inside the trunk (Brits will call it the boot) Water can collect in the sides behind the wheel wells at the rear. There should be a drain hole to allow moisture to escape the trunk there. Also, it is a convertible, check the front floorboards for rust. If the top was left down in the rain water will collect there.
If you purchase the car one word of caution: That white interior looks great, but will collect stains from colored paper flyers that are common at car shows here in the US. If you see someone passing out colored paper flyers while you are at a show. GET IT OFF OF THAT INTERIOR AS FAST AS POSSIBLE. I missed a yellow flyer on my back seat. It took me three weeks of scrubbing stain out of my back seat.

[i82much]

Hi Andreas - welcome to the forum! My father, grandfather, and myself are all US Army veterans that were lucky enough to have been stationed in Germany. I was in Wurzburg in the late 90’s. I cannot say enough about how your countrymen made me feel welcome and what a pleasure it was to live for a short time in your beautiful country. I hope to return with my own children some day!

As a side note, I owned a BMW once, and the rest have been Chevies, Fords, Pontiacs, and Jeeps. But I’ve never owned an import - because I was stationed in Germany when I owned the BMW!

You will find a wealth of information, some very knowledgeable people, and have a lot of fun on this board.

[thepontiacman]

Welcome to the Forums.

Good luck with the LeMans.

Nice Vette.

Sent from my Moto Z3 Play using Tapatalk

[sdbob]

Welcome. Racing on Nurburgring circuit,great experience.

[Charlie Brengun]

Hi Andreas,

As you're from the nothern part of Germany.. the southern part of Sweden isnt too far away from you. Lots of nice cars there as well, for example:

https://www.blocket.se/annonser/hela...1957&q=pontiac

For the older US cars Ive seen here, I would say check the body work for rust etc as mentioned and expect some overdue maintenance (which will cost you in time and money) due to people not replacing bushings in the suspension, worn out steering parts and electrical spaghetti under the dash.. things like that.

And if its your first time buying a 'classic' bring a friend who is not in love with the car, preferably knows what he's doing and give you a honest opinion of it.

[Bob Timmermans]

Charlie is right about the electrics , I think that's one of the more hidden problems that are hard to find and fix.
It can be a real nightmare and a serious hazard , it can turn your car into a pile of ashes when not prepared.

I've had a short circuit in my dash ones , scared the bejesus out of me.
One second your just driving and enjoying your car , the other your short stopping running out to lift the bonnet to disconnect the battery.

Heartrate 225 !

And then the aftermath of fixing that . . . laying upside down in the car under the dash . . . jeeez , what a pita that was.

I hope you make the right choise and enjoy the 'new' car for a long time.

[Charlie Brengun]

With a friend I pulled and fixed the entire wiring harass in my car. It was a total mess and took us a good amount of time to fix.
Glad we did though, my car was a firebomb waiting to happen..

If you can't or don't want to do such things yourself, it can become really costly real quick..

For the price of that car you're looking at in my opinion you should see no spaghetti under the dash, no dry rotted bushings in the suspension, no leaky exhaust or other maintenance things and a good decent rust free body... If not walk away but that's just my opinion of course..

[Firedup6975]

Ummmmmmmmm Pontiacs?? ahhhhhhhh after a Lemans, maybe in the classified forum. Welcome!

[se428bandit]

Years ago i sold a 1972 Lemans to a dealer and he shipped it over to Hamburg. I always wondered if it's still around, since you live over there have you ever seen this car over there?

[stuta]

Welcome Andreas

Bringing a car buddy along for the inspection is great for a couple of reasons.
Four eyes are always better than two, and also to keep your emotions in check while looking at a potential purchase.
Sometimes we talk ourselves into "I can fix that...that's not a big deal to repair this" if no one is there to smack us on the back of the head.
If at all possible, get that car on a lift ! Even if you must pay a garage to give you access for the lift. You will always see much more on a lift than trying to crawl on your back. If you don't know what you're looking at, that car buddy you have along should.

Ask for any paperwork on repairs, or history on the car too.

It may sound obvious, but drive the car! Sometimes the car will talk to you while on the drive, and give you clues to what's wrong : )
If the engine is COLD, open up the cap on the radiator. ONLY IF ENGINE IS COLD! How does the coolant look? See any oil in the water?
Pull the oil dipstick...oil fresh? Is it milky grey? (oil in water)
If she is cold on first start up, let the owner start her up while you stand behind her and look for smoke out the tailpipe...(blue) White would be coolant. You'd smell it too either way!
If there's smoke only on initial cold start, that would be the boots on the valve guides, or the guides themselves..or both.

After she's all warmed up, now you're looking for smoke out the back from other problems. Bad rings or valves. Pull the oil fill cap while she's running and look for smoke coming out. That would be called "blow by" from bad rings. The worse the smoke...the more the rings are worn out.
Look for leaks on top of the engine as well.
Gas around the carb, coolant pooled up anywhere.....etc.

With an auto trans...pull the dipstick and check the fluid too. Smell burnt? Should be red, not
brown. With the car running, and your foot on the brake, go from drive to reverse. She should go directly into each gear without much hesitation. While driving her around, you'd be able to feel if the trans was slipping too.

Oh yeah, make sure you put the conv. top ALL the way down and up. Put every window up and down. After she's warmed up, put the heat on and try the blower fan on all settings. Move the heat from the floor to defrost and feel if it's blowing out in both places.
Try the radio, horn, blinkers, wipers low and high speeds, headlights (high and low beam), reverse lights, tail lights, brake lights....again, that's why you brought a friend to look at all this from outside.

Added to all the other things mentioned by the other members, this should give you the confidence to pick up a classic

Wow....I'm sure I missed something
Good Luck, and Happy New Year

Cheers
Stu

[Qman]

Dear Guys,

thanks for all the helpful advices!
My buddy and me had a look to the gold Lemans. Unfortunately it was not what I expected. Frame and body were realy good w/o an serious rost. Body mounts were "ok".
Things I didn't like was the gearbox was very oily with drops of red oil.
Passenger rear brake cylinder was wet
All 4 tires need to be changed
Test drive: hard shifting of gears
Motor was very powerless. I know its an old one but 290 HP should work with more enthusiasm.
The seller wanted to have min. 38k.
As well the owner was not really burning for his car if you know what I mean. It was dirty and he said he never cleans his car underbody for the oil...
So, not my car.

On the way back home my buddy found an interesting Bonneville 1967 just a side step from our way.
I mean I wanted a convertible but as this also a cool car I gave it a chance.
2h later we were stadning in front of a garge and the owner opened it. Something really huge was covered by a green cover. After he took the cover of I was really surprised how beatiful this car is!
Car was imported 2017 from a collector in Georgia.
New paint in US 5 years ago looking very good!
Interieur, dashboard, door panels in very good contions (except the arm rest driver side).
All tires new in 2017. Motor (6.6L) and TH400 complete revised (matching number). Not a single leakage. A/C is working.
No rust. The car drove perfectly. Way better than the Lemans. Instant throttle response and very smooth shifting!
So finally I bought the car.

Here are some pics:


















I paid 34k USD incl. a new technical revision what is called TÜV in Germany and has to be done every 2 years. An independent auditor checks the whole car for serious rust, oil leakage, breaks, lights... everything that is needed for safe driving.

Once I have it home I will post some more pics.
...Can't wait for it...

Bye Andreas
PS, I hope my english is ok and does not cause too much "pain"

[Qman]

Originally Posted by se428bandit

Years ago i sold a 1972 Lemans to a dealer and he shipped it over to Hamburg. I always wondered if it's still around, since you live over there have you ever seen this car over there?

In Hamburg we have once a year an US Car meeting. Next time I will look for it!

BR
Andreas

[Greg Reid]

Well, I love A-bodies but it would be hard to walk away from that one. Looks to be in excellent condition and honestly, they are just so much 'more car' than the A bodies.
That one is a beauty! Too bad it's not a two door.

[prostreet64]

That is one great looking Bonnie!

[stuta]

Great job checking out the conv., good move to walk away from that mess.
Now you have an awesome 67 to cruise the countryside in.

My first big car project as a young man was a 67 Executive sedan in the same color. She was a gigantic car.... so I definitely love your new ride!
Good luck with her, and congratulations

[OCMDGTO]

Wow nice car there Qman

[camerjeff]

Very Nice Bonne! Congrat's I can no imagine driving that car around town in most of Germany.

Enjoy the ride!!!!