[Greg Reid]

It seems to me that some people in this thread are missing the point regarding the MAIN problem here...It's not the guy's attitude or that he's dragging his feet....Not really something you can talk out and negotiate to make right.
The real problem is that he put the quarters on incorrectly. I'm not a body buy by profession but I've done enough cutting and patching to know that this problem alone is a MAJOR screwup that will drive the labor costs up, probably double the original quarter replacement labor costs.
When you replace a rusted quarter, you can cut that rusty quarter out and not care what happens to it in the process, but to reposition a new pair of quarters and re-install them taking proper care to preserve them...Well, that's a problem no one is going to want to deal with.
He simply doesn't want to do it.....Truly, he's the only one that can be expected to do it since it was his mistake....But, anyone else you approach to do it is not going to want that job.
He really ought to refund you a good portion of your money and let you have the car back. He should eat the loss because of his mistake.
Unfortunately, you'll lose too...but frankly, you made a mistake as well. You picked the wrong guy. It happens. Sometimes you just have to take a loss.

In summary, he owes you a big refund and you get your car back. Then, start fresh at attacking the quarter fitment problem.

[mrtonegto]

Greg,
I can accept what your saying, the real problem in reality is the lower quarters. I went by there yesterday to get the time I can pick my car up today (15th was the deadline).
I saw that he had undercoated underneath the trunk and the fender extensions on both sides. Not to be accusatory but looks like a good way to cover up giving the extensions a beating and bodoing them up. Will know more after dissecting the job.

[Greg Reid]

Originally Posted by mrtonegto

Greg,
I can accept what your saying, the real problem in reality is the lower quarters. I went by there yesterday to get the time I can pick my car up today (15th was the deadline).
I saw that he had undercoated underneath the trunk and the fender extensions on both sides. Not to be accusatory but looks like a good way to cover up giving the extensions a beating and bodoing them up. Will know more after dissecting the job.

Well, if you think you can straighten it out just moving the lower quarters out, that's good...but I think I'd still get it from him and do it myself. He still owes you some money back in my opinion. That undercoating is just one more thing I wouldn't want on my car. The longer he keeps it, the more you'll probably have to undo.

[wytnyt]

im a bit confused when in your demands that there be NO filler be used on the quarters
when looking at your initial pics,its obvious theres several panels that required filling.
perhaps ill get blasted for this but it seems your trying to make it harder than needed on this bodyman perhaps because he made a mistake and now your nit picking out of retaliation
some of the fault should be on you,,,,you picked him
your talking about alot of un necessary work putting quarters on without using any filler at all
even from the factory the pillar had almost a 1/4'' lead in the seam .

[mrtonegto]

Wytnyt:
Thanks for the feedback, I appreciate the straight talk. I'd agree with you completely but that's not what I meant to imply (no bondo on the quarters).

I need to clarify what was done and what the issues were. I was not speaking of the upper quarter panels - they were shrunk with a stud gun and definitely needed filler in spots.
It's the lower quarters, they had been replaced by a previous owner and it was a bad job. Those lower qtrs were cut off, as were the original and badly rusted trunk extensions.
The body guy in question then installed new trunk extensions and lower quarters. Sure, the weld seem needed filler - not a problem.
But then I found that the lower quarters were too far out and the bumper wouldn't fit (3/4" past the bumper on both sides).

That is when I said I don't want the cure/fix to be that he pounds on the new sheet metal in order to make it bend into shape - ie. don't pound it and then fill it with bondo.
He was pulling on them with a come-along, pulling one against the other. It's all rigid with plenty of 90* bends to prevent them from "giving".

And guess what? I picked up the car today - after having to call the sheriff and get him to release it - the trunk extensions were pounded inward (toward the quarter skins) and the rear of each one was cut away and welded flat and up against the quarter skins. He then figured he'd cover up the mess by spraying undercoating all over the area along with the bottom of the trunk. I had told him months before I DO NOT want my undercarriage sprayed with any undercoating when he offered it as an "add on".

So, in short......... why would I want to pay to install totally new sheet metal and then have it pounded on, deformed and covered in undercoating - and I expect filled with bondo?

[Greg Reid]

How was pounding the extensions "in" towards the quarterpanels supposed to make the quarterpanels come closer together at the bottoms? More flexible?
Seems to me that the thing to do would have been to cut the lower quarters back out, make a few cuts to the trunk extensions to reposition, reweld them and then reinstall the lower quarters.
Now, sounds like you need a complete redo. New extensions to replace the "modified" ones and cut the lower quarters back out and reweld everything.

[22times]

I would love to see some pics. I installed my own while this was all going on and I just want to compare my work to what yours look like........

Glad you got your car back and that you can start moving forward with it again.

Rich

[mrtonegto]

I agree Greg, that would be the correct way, and the professional way, to fix the problem.
He also should have cut out some of the filler piece that was welded into the outside-rear-lower filler of each wheel well. That would allow the lower quarter to be moved inward (measurements show they're outward more than an inch compared to a virgin car). I hope I'm making sense there, I'm talking about the piece of the lower wheel well that is directly behind the tire and often a victim of corrosion/rust-through. Since that section is too far out, it's makes for more serious "modifications" to get them to fit within the bumper.

22times, I'll definitely post more pic's - we took about 100 of them yesterday to document the condition of the car, the hood, lid, doors and all the parts. But, in post #47 (first two pic's) you can plainly see that the lower quarters hanging like a drape vs. at the angle of a '65 bumper. That clearly is not the configuration of lower quarters on a '65. I would try to get a measurement off of a know virgin car and measure the distance from the front and rear tips of the lower quarters to the chassis (of course, in a 45 year old car the body might not be centered - mine was because I installed new body bushings while it was at the painter). But if your bumper fits with, IMO, about a half inch of clearance outward and there are no signs of twisting of the lower quarters (like there is on mine) - you did well.

Thanks for the encouraging words guys - more pic's to follow.

[gtome]

Maybe I missed it somewhere, but are you going to try to do the work yourself, or find a new bodyshop?

[SPEEDZONE]

I'm curious why you chose this guy in the first place? Was it price driven? Based on what I see in the pics, and what you have said, the guy is a hack. The shop looks very dirty, unorganized, and unprofessional. Does not have a paintbooth, then surprised that your doors had dust in them when he's spraying them in the open? And I dont care what anyone says, using naval jelly, a wire brush, and Pore 15 to eradicate rust issues are not the proffesioanals preffered way to eradicate a rust problem. One look at this shop and I would have walked out. There is no shortcut to a quality job in body and paint. The adage : "The poor quality remains long after the low price is forgotten" definitely applies here.

[mrtonegto]

Chose him based on two of his cars that were very impressive. Seen too many shops where the looks of the shop and their quality are two totally different things - but I accept your opinion.
The car was to be shot in a friends paint booth about 10 miles away - why he painted the doors I'll never know........ guess he was trying to impress me with him getting something done.
I accept your opinion too on the NJ - I don't agree but that's OK - it's America until BO gets done with it!
The price was higher than other bids by 1000. to 1500. and he was paid extra for installing the lower quarters (I paid for the panels).

But you're jumping to conclusions about the low price.............

So what have we resolved..............LOL

[mrtonegto]

Sorry GTOme, thought I hit enter earlier and I didn't.............

No I'm not going to try to do it myself, not only do I not have a place to work on it but I'm my own worse critic!

Have spoken to a few shops already and I think I'm close with one guy who has done some great stuff and happens to have an opening. He has seen the car right after I got it back and we spent 3 hrs. going over it, comparing notes and telling stories.
He is talking to his guys about the job this w/e and I'll call him tomorrow for the decision. He primarily does restorations and has done a beautiful '66 GTO and a '71 Camaro that I saw at a show on Saturday. Taking on my car is different since its just paint and body - I'll put it all back together, polish the trim, etc.

[GTOWoody]

Good luck with the new guy and getting your car done. I would write a complaint to the Better Business Bureau as well, so that if anyone else goes to use the guy they can see the issues you had. Don't forget you can also give a company a rating on Google. I may not look at all the reviews but I do notice the Star rating and make sure to follow up if I see any issues posted.

[mrtonegto]

Thanks GTOWoody, I'm not sure I want to give the guy a bad rating.

How would he pay me back after the court decision???? LOL

Just kidding, you know I'd hate to see anyone else go through this.

[mrtonegto]

Got my first bid today to fix the mess and paint the car.

The guy noticed that the trunk hinges were altered by someone in the past.

So now I'm looking for two good trunk hinges (65 Lemans/GTO)..... anyone?

[22times]

Hey Tone,

I am waiting on my wife to get back from Walmart with our sim card to go out and take some pics for ya. I have one pic folder already that shows them clamped on, just not welded yet. They are welded in now.

I might wait until tomorrow if it gets too late, better light.

You want them via email? I need an addy.

Rich

[mrtonegto]

Hey Rich,

I've got time so you don't have to rush. The magistrate's clerk advised me that all small claims cases her have to go through arbitration here first.

I'll send u my email via a PM.

Thanks for taking the time.

Tone

[michaelroy]

You are welcome to look at the ones on my part car if you like.
michaelroy

[mrtonegto]

Thanks Michaelroy:

BTW, haven't heard back on the club membership, the boy with the vert next to u this w/e was working on that.

[mrtonegto]

You know this entire thing has been - and continues to be - a fiasco. Makes you question your faith in your fellow man sometimes.

But I've got that faith renewed from the help I've gotten from 22times (Rich). He's gone out of his way to take a bunch of pics that are going to be a great help in presenting a court case.

It's guys like Rich that make this hobby and this forum so worthwhile.

Thanks again Rich