[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Some more "new" News on Ram II GTO's today .

The "mind blower" / "secretive" Hardtop I had mentioned before in the past - has changed hands and is in a shop for resto.

I imagine by now at least a few guys on here know a little about the car.
It started out as just a block that a PY member landed on - then he tracked down the car - and got it too.

The reason I didn't want to discuss it is because it bends all the rules.
It pre-dates any other known RamAir II car and pre-dates the 05C rule.
I had already signed off on the math , Mattison at PHS has signed off on the car too.
It is Legit

Special build that ordered via Royal Oak
Red , white interior , white vinyl top
Automatic
A/C
2.93 posi
Not a typo

See what I mean ?

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

The next "new" News is another Convertible GTO RamAir II , I'm pretty sure he said 4spd
Will confirm
Not on our list.

Discovered in Florida
In the same shop now for resto as the Red MindBlower Hdtp

Aegena Blue
White Interior , White Top
o m g

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

On the Bird side
- guys who followed the Bird Ram II thread should remember the guy in California who joined and his Dad special ordered a Special Paint 68 Bird Ram II 4spd in Windward Blue.
And he/they still had it !
All original

That car has been sold (twice)
And waiting at the same shop as the other two Goats I just mentioned.

[Mcronk]

Wow! Thanks for sharing! Any chance we might get to see the documentation on the "mind blower" car?

Royal Oak was well connected so someone in the "know" must have pulled some strings to get that car built. Jim Mino told me the earliest date codes for RA II parts was C118. So technically it is feasible a car could have been built in April. I wonder how they priced the car since it did not follow the standard pricing for the RA II package?

I also have to wonder how it ran with a 2.93 gear and the RA II cam in a automatic and then add in hot summer days with the A/C on. At least it did not break the rule of no steeper gear than 3.23 with A/C (3.42 with F body second gen). By the way are you at liberty to say what shop is restoring these cars?

[Mcronk]

The convertible found in Florida, was this recently? Did it have its original engine/drivetrain? Every 68 I see I check the build date! LOL! I have lived in Florida all my life. Lots of people moving here (and bringing their cars/collections).

[Keith Seymore]

Originally Posted by RA1John

I spoke with a friend who worked at the PMD engine plant back in the 60s and he stated that all engines were built according to vehicle build orders. Engines weren't built up ahead of time and set aside until they were ordered (other than for replacement).

Just to make sure I understand: when you say "all" - does that mean ALL (like including garden variety powerplants) or "all SPECIAL" (meaning just unique, low volume, interesting engine codes)?

Incidentally - that's how the bodies were built. All bodies were built to order; they didn't build a bunch of generic bodies to pull from. So it's easy for me to imagine engines were built up the same way.

Originally Posted by RA1John

Also, during production, if there was an engine problem at the vehicle plant, is it logical to assume that PMD engine would provide the vehicle plant with another broadcast code correct engine according to that specific application?

Yes (assuming they had enough parts to build another). This is true all the way up to a complete vehicle: if a whole car got lost or smashed they would build a replacement unit to that same specification.

Originally Posted by RA1John

Likewise, would it have been possible during the '68 MY that a customer could order an engine with a broadcast code and not get an "SR" engine?

I don't understand the question; do you mean could a customer order a complete engine over the parts counter by using the specific broadcast code (aka part number) he wanted, and not get an SR engine? No - it would still be a service engine, because it wouldn't have a VIN stamped on it (since it wasn't installed in a vehicle at the assembly plant).

K

[Keith Seymore]

Originally Posted by Mcronk

Could a person go to a dealer and order a block over the counter?

Yes.

Originally Posted by Mcronk

If so would this block have a EUN (quality control/inventory purposes) a block code (per customer order) but no VIN stamp (since it was not installed on the assembly line and not a warranty replacement)?

No - no EUN (which was stamped on a completed engine), no VIN (since it didn't go in a completed vehicle), and no code (since a couple different engine part numbers could conceivably be built up from the same bare block).

K

[Keith Seymore]

Originally Posted by Mcronk

Every 68 I see I check the build date! LOL! I have lived in Florida all my life. Lots of people moving here (and bringing their cars/collections).

Congratulations, btw - I saw your picture in the latest Smoke Signals (or somewhere).



K

[68pongto]

With all this talk about new found RA II cars, I thought I would post an update on my car. It is car #6 on the rollcall and a very early car with a 05C build date. I am shooting for the GTOAA nationals in June, but with every day that slips by, I am realizing that it is going to be difficult to make that. I will definitely have it done for MCACN in November. I have test fired the engine and most everything on the chassis is done. I have moved on to the body and cut the doors in last weekend with some Verdoro Green basecoat.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Originally Posted by Mcronk

The convertible found in Florida, was this recently?

I'm not sure about the timeline , but evidently within the past year or so.
All I really know is its definitely documented properly as Ram II .

Originally Posted by Mcronk

Wow! Thanks for sharing! Any chance we might get to see the documentation on the "mind blower" car?

I have a copy of the PHS from the past , but its trapped in a worn out laptop.
Not sure what the new owner wants to share on it , or if the shop wants any publicity about
the cars being there.
Its a major known high end facility and the cars will be primo .

If I am recalling correctly - the added cost to #347 , for Ram II upgrade , was handled in the special equipment charge box .
Not handwritten memos like we have seen on a few of the other early documented cars.

The most amazing and genuine cross reference for documenting the car is at first only the block was discovered.
Automatic coded Ram II block ,,,, okay cool find.
Then the PHS by sending in the VIN from the block.
Oh Boy .... Shocker !
That's when he contacted me.
Told him it was too far out to go public yet , and having the actual car would mean a lot more overall than just telling about a block with mind blowing PHS.

He was already in process of locating the car - eventually it was located - and he eventually bought it.
I wasn't really looking forward to piecing this together for you guys back then , or even how to present it.
It sort of drifted from my memory after a while.

Until a conversation yesterday

Just to refresh everyone - all RA option #347 1968 GTO's were to have 4.33 gears
Whether Ram1 or Ram2 , Auto or 4spd
AC was not an available option with #347 engine option.
2.93 axle with AC is just asking for a bath in gasoline with some of the flint sparking nay sayers.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Originally Posted by 68pongto

... an update on my car. It is car #6 on the rollcall ...

I can't ever view any pictures from that web host - been that way for a while.
Really glad you keep making gainful progress on your car.
It should be a real wicked machine

Guys , his is one of the three Ram2 GTO's that muscle_collector had stored away for years and years.
Then TheBoss got it
Then 68pongto got ahold of it

[OG68]

As the saying goes; Never say never.

Fascinating story BVZ. I'll be waiting for the next episode.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Another brief convo today , forgot to ask about a couple of things that I meant to.
Hopefully another time
They are about to hit Barret-Jackson and will be away until next week.

But the Aegena Blue/White/White Convertible 4spd was gathered about a year or so ago.
The kicker is - it was supposedly a known car in certain circles for a good while.
That will definitely be the most attractive drop-top when its done.

The collection has gathered 5 Ram2 cars counting the Aegena Blue Convertible

The others are
Muscle_Collectors former Aegena Blue/Blue Automatic GTO Hdtp
MindBlower Red/White/White Automatic GTO Hdtp (they have coined it as Pilot Car)
Muscle_Collectors former Special Paint- Rally Green Bird 4spd
Special Paint- Windward Blue Bird 4spd

And they hope to add one more Ram2 car .

Plenty of other amazing cars gathered into it as well
Top Shelf Stuff like crazy

[Mcronk]

Originally Posted by Keith Seymore

Congratulations, btw - I saw your picture in the latest Smoke Signals (or somewhere).



K

Probably the picture Tim Dye took at the POCI Nationals this past summer. I had pulled my 68 GTO RA II car under the hotel awning as one of several thunderstorms rolled in. I had a couple of rags stuffed in the open hood scoops to keep the rain out! LOL

[Mcronk]

Originally Posted by 68pongto

With all this talk about new found RA II cars, I thought I would post an update on my car. It is car #6 on the rollcall and a very early car with a 05C build date. I am shooting for the GTOAA nationals in June, but with every day that slips by, I am realizing that it is going to be difficult to make that. I will definitely have it done for MCACN in November. I have test fired the engine and most everything on the chassis is done. I have moved on to the body and cut the doors in last weekend with some Verdoro Green basecoat.

]

Absolutely beautiful! Sometimes I think I should have a concourse restoration done on my car. However it has 61,000 documented miles (original engine/transmission long gone) and retains a lot of originality (seat covers, dash, headliner, door panels, etc). Some of the reproduction parts do not faithfully represent the originals. I also like to drive my cars, though I have not driven mine much since I got it. The car is a nice high end driver quality in the worst places and #2 in other areas (engine compartment). At my age I just cannot get excited about tackling a full frame off project. The cost to have someone else do it to concourse is probably close to six figures. I have all the correct engine parts (except carb/distributor) and a correct M21 dated 3 to 4 weeks before car invoice date. It retains its original 4.33 rear axle. It also would need a color change from Midnight Green to Verdoro Green.

[Mcronk]

Originally Posted by Baron Von Zeppelin

I'm not sure about the timeline , but evidently within the past year or so.
All I really know is its definitely documented properly as Ram II .


I have a copy of the PHS from the past , but its trapped in a worn out laptop.
Not sure what the new owner wants to share on it , or if the shop wants any publicity about
the cars being there.
Its a major known high end facility and the cars will be primo .

If I am recalling correctly - the added cost to #347 , for Ram II upgrade , was handled in the special equipment charge box .
Not handwritten memos like we have seen on a few of the other early documented cars.

The most amazing and genuine cross reference for documenting the car is at first only the block was discovered.
Automatic coded Ram II block ,,,, okay cool find.
Then the PHS by sending in the VIN from the block.
Oh Boy .... Shocker !
That's when he contacted me.
Told him it was too far out to go public yet , and having the actual car would mean a lot more overall than just telling about a block with mind blowing PHS.

He was already in process of locating the car - eventually it was located - and he eventually bought it.
I wasn't really looking forward to piecing this together for you guys back then , or even how to present it.
It sort of drifted from my memory after a while.

Until a conversation yesterday

Just to refresh everyone - all RA option #347 1968 GTO's were to have 4.33 gears
Whether Ram1 or Ram2 , Auto or 4spd
AC was not an available option with #347 engine option.
2.93 axle with AC is just asking for a bath in gasoline with some of the flint sparking nay sayers.

Thanks again for keeping us informed/updated. You still rarely see these cars anywhere whether it be the top auctions or events like MCACN. I do know of a legit Bird 4 speed. A friend owns it and has been working on it for a while. Never left the town it was originally sold in. He has had it for quite some time.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Your car really looks Great , Mcronk
I like the midnight green that's on it.

Totally forgot to mention before about the MindBlower RedAir2 Air car
Its also pretty loaded with other options too.
Gonna be a knockout

[Cammer-6]

White Elephant in the room...
what was build date of this one?

Did the $ amount match the RAII option charge?

In this hobby Ive always said not to use words like "never" and "always"
Like the Z-28 convert
or the C60 Z28 that was from Hawaii.

Originally Posted by Baron Von Zeppelin

Some more "new" News on Ram II GTO's today .

The "mind blower" / "secretive" Hardtop I had mentioned before in the past - has changed hands and is in a shop for resto.

I imagine by now at least a few guys on here know a little about the car.
It started out as just a block that a PY member landed on - then he tracked down the car - and got it too.

The reason I didn't want to discuss it is because it bends all the rules.
It pre-dates any other known RamAir II car and pre-dates the 05C rule.
I had already signed off on the math , Mattison at PHS has signed off on the car too.
It is Legit

Special build that ordered via Royal Oak
Red , white interior , white vinyl top
Automatic
A/C
2.93 posi
Not a typo

See what I mean ?

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Yes , the math works.
That was something I did about 3+ years ago .

Since I can't access my files , I don't want to rely solely on memory about the build week of the body or the date of the BHC .
But for sure they both pre-date 05C and May 15 rules of thumb.

I won't speak with him again until mid/late next week.

Am of the impression they will be sharing the data on all the cars that I have mentioned that they now own , that are not already fully represented on our Ram2 Bird / Goat Registry lists.

BlueBonnet GTO Vert RamBlue2

MindBlower RedAir2 Air

GreenLantern Firebird RallyAir2

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Found a YouTube video of MCACN 2023 and there is footage of the Windward Blue 68 Bird.
So that car is finished.
I don't really like the HO type stripe down the side but otherwise, it is Killer

The VooDoo Green Bird that Mattison-PHS used to own with low low miles was there too.