[x-bird2]

I'm not rich, most would shoot me for what i paid for mine in '98. (2nd least expensive car i've bought out of about 20 over the past 20+ years.) it hasn't gotten the time nor $s it deserves in its resurrection from non-running basket o rust case to primered beast, and bird 72 must hate me for all the articles showing how I've been modifying it over the years (more of those to come). And no, i'll never sell it, it's mine mine mine all mine mine! (read with daffy duck voice--"open sez me!") An I'd've snapped it up had it been any variation of Firebird from 1970-73 given theprice and circumstances through which it came to me.

[2manyT/A'S]

I just KNOW that this is going to open a WHOLE NEW "can of worms",but if the SD 455 gets it's own Forum,then the 455 HO will have to have one,simply because it's FASTER!

[superdutybob]

A guy reads one magazine article that gives the HO the nod and now it's gospel.

You're right, that DID open up a whole new can of worms.

GO BLUE!!!! MEEEEEEECHIGAN #1

[2manyT/A'S]

This thread was getting a bit sleepy!

I figure this will "wake it up" a bit.

[bird72]

Well, which was faster? I remember an old Nunzi article where he supertuned a 72..... Given liberal tuning rules (as in carb and ignition) I would guess they are not that far apart, nod to SD......

[2manyT/A'S]

My recollection of the early T/A & GTO roadtests is that Ram Air III's,IV's,455 HO's & SD455 were ALL capable of high 13's right out of the box.
The Ram Air IV,which is the "dearest" of the lot,was ultimately the MOST dissapointing,considering it's performance potential & hype.
There is really two many variables involved to compare different cars driven by different drivers on different tracks,etc. etc. accurately.
SD's,especially 74's were HEAVIER with the safety bumpers & the majority of them seem to have A/C.
Running against a NON-A/C 455 HO T/A,would give the SD a 200lb weight disadvantage.
SD's were noteable because of the more "Bullet Proof "internals & simply the fact that 455 Ho power levels (from 1971), were MAINTAINED when the competitors were struggling just to meet emissions & fuel economy mandates with small displacement motors.

[165th]

One way to compare which car performed the best would be to compare performance statistics from 'the day'. This is your best way of knowing your are dealing with stock units, set up for the street, and published material that potential buyers in the day could rely on.

For the wildly popular, most rare (oop's, that's a different debate!) 1973 SD-455, I'll gladly volunteer the stat's out of the May, 1973 Car and Driver:

0 - 60 5.4sec
1/4 mile 13.8sec 103.6mph
Tops speed 132

I don't have a copy of the Hot Rod magazine, but I understand the car they tested went 104.3mph in 13.54sec.

If others could post data from similar road tests, that would be great.
Greg

[bird72]

2 many, I have noticed most SD seem to have AC, this always seemes odd to me.

[Jim Rotella]

165th,

The numbers that you've posted are correct, but it should be noted that those times were achieved with the same pre-production 310 HP Super Duty test car with the Ram Air IV style cam. The numbers that I've got from vintage road tests show that both the production 290 horse SD 455 and 455 HO ran in the 14.20's at around 99 mph in stock condition. The two engines were very close in pure stock form with the SD slightly quicker in most cases.

Jim

[2manyT/A'S]

Performance Car Guide 72 gives us a 13.90@102 for a 72 T/A (TH400)
& 14.58@97 for a 72 Formula 400/M21 Top speed 120
High Performance Cars (Sept 72) got 14.04@103.22 on 72 T/A M22 (non-A/C)

Motor Trend (July 73) ran a 15.0@98 & a top speed of 125.69 ( SD 455/TH400/3:42)

Looks like the forged rods were good for 5 MPH!

I'm sure I've got a 71 or 72 Car & Craft that ALSO squeezed high 13's out of a HO. (I'm looking for it)

[Jim Rotella]

Here's some actual road test numbers that I have that haven't been mentioned yet.

'74 T/A SD455, A/C ,auto, 3.08 gears 14.25 @ 100.93, Super Stock 6/74
'71 GTO Judge 455 HO, 4 spd, 3.55, 2 aboard, 14.9 @ 95.0, Motor Trend 10/70
'72 GTO 455 HO, auto, 3.07, 2 aboard, 14.6 @ 95.2, Motor Trend 10/71
'72 GTO 455 HO, 4 spd, A/C, 3.55, 14.24 @ 99.44, Car Craft 3/72
'72 T/A 455 HO, 4 spd, A/C, 3.42, 14.31 @ 98.46, Car Craft 3/72
'72 T/A 455 HO, 4 spd, A/C, 3.42, 14.21 @ 99.44, Custom Car 3/72

As you can see, they are all very similar. I didn't use the '73 Trans Am tests I have because they were done with the non-production 310 horsepower Super Duty engine. That test mule in its original SD form really ran. Too bad they couldn't slip that RA IV cam past the feds. That really would have been something.

Jim

[sdbob]

AC with the SD! I too always thought this was goofy.However remember that the engine almost was canceled.So the only reason I can think of was getting some of the development money back,also some people can't live without air in their area.I thought the engine was on par with the RAIV as far as potential so air shouldn't have beeen an option.I will repeat I still feel very very fortunate to have gotten one.Bob(Mine is pure stock never been apart,ecept for jetting and distributor adavnce.It has gone 14 o's on stock type radial Ta"s.

[Larry Navarro]

I have an old 1974 issue of super stock magazine where the editors tweaked a '74SD with carb/dist tuning, shift kit, rear gears, slicks and traction bars. The car ran high 12's in virtually "stock" form.
I'll dig the issue up and scan-it later.

[Brewster]

Does anyone know what happened to that 1973 Red/White/Blue SD in Michigan that was on Epay? It had 5 + days left and got up to $ 50,100.00 + and then it was gone. Poof!

[165th]

Brew, the item no. is 250054551501. Auction ended Nov. 27.

[Scott455HO]

Yep, reserve not met.

[Brewster]

Ooop's,
I thought it had a couple more days left on the auction.
Figured it would have run higher then that, but its not the most sought after color combo.
However I thought it looked hot.

[Larry Navarro]

somebody must have made him a helluva offer to end the auction.

[schneidsd455]

The auction definitely got pulled early. I started 'watching' it the same day that it got listed, and a couple of days later, "poof".

[Brewster]

Ok, here is a sweet thing just posted for us all to watch:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...m=200053176701

How much will she bring?