[spectramitch]

Has anyone ever seen this much oil entering the combustion chamber? Less than 50 miles street on the motor. I could only get a few strong pulls, so I believe I am still breaking in my engine. I am noticing some smoke out of exhaust at idle and deceleration has some pretty noticeable smoke out of the exhaust. Pretty much every cylinder has it, number one being the worst. Pics are from a borescope through spark plug. Total seal classic race piston rings.

[Dragncar]

Thats a lot of oil.

[grandam1979]

Can you use that scope to look at the valves to see if it’s coming from them? Take carb off maybe?

[steve25]

What was used for valve seals on your heads, the Blue Viton type like pictured here?

There are a bunch of these around now that are packaged wrong, they are for 3/8” stem valves and not 11/32”!

I guy I just ported a set of heads for fell pray to this with the same issue your having.

I myself for another set of heads almost fell pray to this.

I got a set of seals from a local machine shop since I appended to be there and when I got home and opened the bag they where wrong also.

The ID of the right size seals Viton seals for 11/32” stems should measure.311” to .312”.

The symptom goes like this.
All is well until the oil starts to heat up and the intake valve stem starts to get hot.
Then the motor starts to puff out the exh at idle, and of course while running, but it does not seem quite as bad as at idle since it’s being burned near as fast as it’s coming down the stem.

2) If you did not use these types of seals and your using stock retainers, but no stock metal splash shield then if you left out the little rubber O-ring that seals off the bottom of the retainers then you will have a oil smoke issue also.

Also what heads are you running?

3)!Aftermarket heads when port on the roof can break into the rocker stud hole and then if you do not seal those threads the intakes ports will suck oil thru there.

4) Another oil usage condition can come from the number 2 ring being put on the wrong way.

Then it scrapes oil up into the chambers instead of down into the crank case.

There have been known cases where the second rings where marked wrong for
Proper installation.

I pray this is not your case!

I would pull the intake off first and see if and how wet the valve stems might be.
Pooling oil on the backside of intake valves that are closed make for a sure sign of valve seal issues.

Now a question.

You say this is a street motor yet you are running gas ported pistons , why?

[spectramitch]

Its looking like the rocker studs may be the culprit. What sealer is to be used on them? I believe I just used a teflon thread sealant and am regretting that right about now.

[AG]

I put Ultra Grey RTV on the threads and torque to spec, never had a leak.

[steve25]

Teflon tape is ok, liquid will flow some and move when hot and will allow oil to get sucked thru.

[mgarblik]

Thanks for the good pic of the back of the intake valves. Way too much oil in that area. If rocker studs are the suspect, you have some OK suggestions above. My go-to material in these situations is a liquid sealer. Permatex Aviation Form a Gasket in a brush top bottle. Sticky, nasty, brown non-hardening sealer. Load the threads and install, Oil won't get around it once it sets for a couple hours. The pipe sealant with teflon you used generally works pretty well too. But not in this particular case, I guess. Incorrect valve seals are always a possibility as mentioned as well.

[spectramitch]

I sealed the studs with the aviation sealer and verified they are sealed. I idled the engine and killed it, immediately sent the camera in spark plug hole and the oil is still in the cylinders. Im going to let some oil out of the pan to see if maybe its overfilled and splashing too much oil on the walls.

[3X24SPD]

Where are you pulling your PCV from? Valve Cover?
Pull the carb off and take a look in the manifold.
Had a similar problem on motor 20+ years ago.

Fixed it with some baffled grommets and a custom 3D Printed PCV Extension.

[spectramitch]

I have no pcv system just two open breathers on each valve cover. Its the same set up that ran okay on the previous build.

[chuckies76ta]

Steve mentioned your valve seals, but no information from you on the seals. I'm curious. I had oil on some of my valves that I noticed when changing the intake. Turns out my Viton seals had moved off the valve guides. You can shine a light in through the springs to see if they have come of the guides.

[spectramitch]

Valve seals look okay. Im thinking the issue might be unseated rings from glazed cylinder walls. I can see a yellow looking film in portions of the cylinder walls. I bought some seafoam top engine cleaner and will try that. Would it be foolish to think about trying the Bon-ami treatment? If that doesnt work ill have to take it apart and deglaze them.

[3X24SPD]

Never tried it myself, but the old school go-to was a pinch of Comet in each cylinder.
Before you do that though- have you done a compression test or leak down?

[spectramitch]

Pics of the cylinders

[hurryinhoosier62]

Originally Posted by spectramitch

Valve seals look okay. Im thinking the issue might be unseated rings from glazed cylinder walls. I can see a yellow looking film in portions of the cylinder walls. I bought some seafoam top engine cleaner and will try that. Would it be foolish to think about trying the Bon-ami treatment? If that doesnt work ill have to take it apart and deglaze them.

Assembled the pistons in the bores with motor oil? High speed glazing is why I used MMO or ATF when assembling an engine. Try adding MMO to the oil then running the engine fairly hard. MMO burns off the cylinder walls long before it can cause glazing.

[spectramitch]

I did oil up the pistons and rings by hand when installing. Im wondering too if using to much arp assembly lube on fasteners could put to much moly in my oil and cause this issue.

[stevep]

I am having a similar issue with a recently rebuilt 389. It has the blue seals. I will take the springs off and measure the ID of the seal.

[mgarblik]

The close-up pictures of the cylinder walls show allot of fractured and folded metal in the hone job. It will likely take allot of running time for the rings to wear a plateau on those walls, if ever. If the rings win the rubbing contest, the cylinder will eventually seal. If the the cylinder wears the rings out, well, it will not. We generally perform a 4 step hone job to eliminate these issues. 70 grit base to .003". 180 grit next to .001", 280 grit to size. Then finish with 6 strokes of 400 grit for initial break-in. With molly rings, this combination provides fast break-in, generally 1/2 hour of running time. Mineral oil only for break-in. No full synthetic oil until break-in is complete. Was this engine broken in with mineral based oil?

[spectramitch]

It was broken in with Penn Grade break in oil 30wt. Well I guess I should say the break in attempt. Im going to try running the sea foam in it and run it hard. Maybe ill get lucky. What oil do you recommend? Do I still need a break in oil or would some cheap mineral oil work okay for this experiment?