[GOAT WHORE]

Hope it's just that box. Got my fingers crossed for you.

[Jack Gifford]

Originally Posted by Jack Gifford

... Too much hassle...

This was the only point of my post, Jim. I just can't keep up with all these "boxes" that have been developed!

[twooldgoats]

I got back last week from a trip and the MSD Digital 7 had returned from MSD. It all checked out OK, so before I sent the 8+ in for a similar check, I decided to rethink the situation. I had initially followed MSD checking procedures and talked with MSD techs and concluded the problem was box or wiring related and not distributor related. It turns out, though, that the MSD procedures apparently don't apply when the boxes are ganged together. I decided to check out the distributor. A resistance check of the sensor at the track the day the shutdown happened checked out OK, but I had not yet actually removed the cap (a real PITA) and looked around. When I did that, I discovered the issue: the rotor turned freely. Oooops!! I pulled the distributor and discovered the distributor drive gear was missing half its teeth. Yeah, that'll keep it from sparking.

The distributor shaft still turns freely and the oil pump turns freely as well, so it appears the load was just too much for the gear at 7,000+ rpm and the teeth came off. On closer inspection, it appears the teeth each had a slight ridge worn in them. Then, as the teeth weakened, one eventually snapped and half of them sheared off. I'm not sure what caused all this, but I have a good idea. We reused the old gear I had used in the car when it was naturally aspirated, because it showed zero signs of wear. After talking to Paul Carter and Wade at BOP about it, my best guess is it was a combination of the new distributor and the new block that probably caused it. The gear would have taken a set with the old combo and the new combo must have been just different enough to cause a problem on break-in. Incidentally, I had 17 passes on the blown combo + considerable run-in and tune up time. Also, I drive the car everywhere---back and forth to the lanes, up the back road for pre-race warmup, etc. In addition, we're now running a higher pressure oil pump and that might have contributed to the problem as well.

For now, I ordered a new bronze distributor gear and I'll pull it more often to check the break in, even though it's a royal PITA to do that (I know, I'm more into driving than maintenance). Part of the problem about the distributor is that I'm using it for a spark signal since I never got my crank trigger set-up working, so pulling the distributor means re-timing every time I touch it. Maybe I'll work on getting my crank trigger functioning, then the distributor just needs to be in the ball park.

My current plan is to drain the oil, then rinse out the pan to remove any leftover pieces of gear tooth, re-time, fire up and go racing. I checked the Racepak data for the ill-fated pass and discovered the Accumulator did its job and kept good oil pressure while I slowed down, though the oil pump would have stopped turning instantly. That was a good investment.

Jim

[twooldgoats]

I drained the oil, flushed out the pan with methanol and refilled the oil yesterday. I spent several hours today messing with the 3/8" right angle crank trigger pickup and never could get it to work. I did notice that with some grinding, I could get the original MSD 3/4" pickup to fit (with a max of 32 degrees of timing, based on a static check), so I installed it, checked it and it works fine---producing a nice, hot spark while cranking. By moving the pickup from the distributor to the crank pickup, it will be easier to pull the distributor and check the new bronze distributor gear occasionally without having to re-time each time. When I fire it up at Paul's shop next week, we can check timing and see how close it is. I have read sometimes the use of a crank pickup can retard the timing a few degrees. If it does, I may have to do some more grinding on the pickup.

I'm not sure if the 3/8" pickup is defective or just not up to the job. When I look at an MSD cutaway drawing of the 3/4" pickup, I see it's fairly complicated with a pretty good-sized coil inside. It's hard to imagine the 3/8" pickup working well with its much smaller inside space. I did try various clearances from .030"-.070" with no luck. It checks out electrically OK (resistance in range, no shorted wires, etc.).

Jim

[Jack Gifford]

You ever consider using a Hall-effect trigger instead of inductive? Then you wouldn't have to "wonder" if it's doing its job or not- just glance at the LED on the trigger housing! I put such a trigger (Crane) on the engine in my GMC- works great to drive the Timing Control Unit, where I can "dial in" an advance curve, amount of vacuum advance, etc. A Hall-effect transistor activates in the presence of a magnetic field, so the trigger unit is position-sensitive, not velocity-sensitive like an inductive trigger. Being able to statically set timing is a nice feature; put the crank where you want the timing and move the trigger around until the LED illuminates! (magnet wheels are easily available, such as from MSD).

[twooldgoats]

Originally Posted by Jack Gifford

You ever consider using a Hall-effect trigger instead of inductive? ......

I didn't know one from another. I use in the "in for a dime---in for a dollar" planning method. My new crank pickup evolved from the old one that always performed flawlessly. Now that I'm back to the original 3/4" MSD pickup, it's working. Hopefully, I'll have the clearance to achieve 32 degrees of advance. If I do, I'll lock it in and go racing. If not, there's a couple of adjustments the MSD box allows that may yet achieve my goal.

Next Thursday, we'll fire it up and check timing. Friday night I hope to run it at the TNT for the Tucson Dragway Reunion race on Saturday. There's always a lot of old blower cars brought out for that event. Most of them don't go down the track, though.

If all does well that weekend, it's on to Pontiac Heaven in Phoenix on April 18th. Lord willin' and the creek don't rise, I should run quicker there than Tucson---if it'll hook up.

Jim

[twooldgoats]

I dragged the car out to Paul's shop yesterday and we re-installed the distributor with the bronze gear and it fired up just fine. My static timing came in at 27 degrees advance, so we were able to adjust the pickup down on the crank to get to 32 degrees. That leaves a little room for any future adjustments either way. The "old" MSD 3/4" pickup seems to work fine.

I won't be able to make it out to the track here in Tucson this weekend, so I look forward to running next week at Pontiac Heaven. I'll spend some time this week looking the car over and--toward the end of the week--setting my Phoenix tuneup.

Jim

[twooldgoats]

It was the best of times. It was the worst of times. My weekend sucked from the perspective of my race program. Going through tech, I was told my seat belts expired at the end of March (WTF!!!). Sure enough--they were re-certed for two more years in March, 2013. I can't believe how quickly those two years went by. They let me run anyway, which was nice of them. They also informed me that my window net was expired as well. Last I checked, the ribbon-type nets didn't need re-cert, but that changed for NHRA this year, I guess. They let that slide, too. Oh, and they suggested a car as quick as mine should have a tow vehicle as well.

When I went to make my first pass on Saturday morning, I did my usual giant burnout and then blew the tires off about 40' out. Same thing on the second try, so I hung it up for the day and thought vaguely it must be bad track prep. On Sunday morning, it occurred to me I hadn't checked the tread wear indicators on the slicks for some time, so we jacked up the back, spun the tires and discovered no wear indicators left at all! So much for track prep--"operator error" was closer to the mark. I gave up the idea of running for the day and, as I was driving the car up on the trailer, the ramp extenders (my home-made wood pieces) slipped and I managed to tear off the right side of my fancy home-built air splitter. Sigh..............

Now, I did say it was the best of times as well. My daughter, son-in-law and two grandkids flew in from Colorado Springs to attend Pontiac Heaven. I was disappointed I couldn't put on a show for them, but I did get to spend a lot more time with them than I would otherwise have had. I also had more time for watching the racing and talking to some people as well. I met Glenn Gibbons--who runs the Pouncing Poncho--for the first time Sunday, even though we've both been sponsors of Pontiac Heaven for years.

So, new slicks are on the way from Summit, the belts arrived today and I ordered a window net from the local speed shop that will be here in a week. As for the air splitter, It's always been a real pain to load the car since I put it on, even though I included a removable center section, so I cut it off. I'll try running next time out without it and see how it feels at the top end.

Jim

[gtofreek]

You need to put a cow pusher on that thing Jim! Heck, the picture in your sig even looks like a steam train!

[Steve Barcak]

Originally Posted by twooldgoats

It was the best of times. It was the worst of times. My weekend sucked from the perspective of my race program. Going through tech, I was told my seat belts expired at the end of March (WTF!!!). Sure enough--they were re-certed for two more years in March, 2013. I can't believe how quickly those two years went by. They let me run anyway, which was nice of them. They also informed me that my window net was expired as well. Last I checked, the ribbon-type nets didn't need re-cert, but that changed for NHRA this year, I guess. They let that slide, too. Oh, and they suggested a car as quick as mine should have a tow vehicle as well.

When I went to make my first pass on Saturday morning, I did my usual giant burnout and then blew the tires off about 40' out. Same thing on the second try, so I hung it up for the day and thought vaguely it must be bad track prep. On Sunday morning, it occurred to me I hadn't checked the tread wear indicators on the slicks for some time, so we jacked up the back, spun the tires and discovered no wear indicators left at all! So much for track prep--"operator error" was closer to the mark. I gave up the idea of running for the day and, as I was driving the car up on the trailer, the ramp extenders (my home-made wood pieces) slipped and I managed to tear off the right side of my fancy home-built air splitter. Sigh..............

Now, I did say it was the best of times as well. My daughter, son-in-law and two grandkids flew in from Colorado Springs to attend Pontiac Heaven. I was disappointed I couldn't put on a show for them, but I did get to spend a lot more time with them than I would otherwise have had. I also had more time for watching the racing and talking to some people as well. I met Glenn Gibbons--who runs the Pouncing Poncho--for the first time Sunday, even though we've both been sponsors of Pontiac Heaven for years.

So, new slicks are on the way from Summit, the belts arrived today and I ordered a window net from the local speed shop that will be here in a week. As for the air splitter, It's always been a real pain to load the car since I put it on, even though I included a removable center section, so I cut it off. I'll try running next time out without it and see how it feels at the top end.

Jim

Jim, sorry to learn about your woes. The track manager told me about the expired tags, etc. Glad you got to run anyway, they normally are not that flexible on a car as quick as yours. Not sure how my ins policy would have worked by them letting you go should there be an accident. Anyway, I wanted one of your passes from the tower while announcing and saw you blow the tires off. I wondered why as most of the other cars seemed to hook up fine. Glad you found the issue. Thank you for your support and attending. It gets harder and more expensive every year to do this and I need all the help I can get. Take care, Steve pontiacheaven.org