[Tom Vaught]

Jon, we had a "Mule" 'demonstration vehicle' (old 1996 Modular 4 Valve Engine/Body deal - think SLEEPER) that we (myself included), drove a lot on the street. It made over 700 HP with 15-20 psi of boost. Manual 6 speed trans deal.

Boost is adictive as was posted here by others (5 psi, then 10 psi, then 20 psi).
Charlie (with the 4 cylinder Turbo 64 Tempest) has pushed his engine to +40 psi of boost and scared himself several times over the years with his combination. He was used to the car, too.

A typical racer who has seen a lot of track time with a sub 10 second race car could probably drive his way out of most "loose" conditions or just get out of the throttle.

The 'civilians' who I rode with that drove the mustang were for the most part incapable of handling a good 500 hp vehicle. So it was a high pucker factor for me every time I got into the car with them. You are just riding along basically.

As you drive a personal Turbocharged vehicle you get more knowledge on what it "will do" under given levels of boost (given a proper tire and chassis deal).

I have known quite a few guys with 800-900 HP 'street cars' over the years using the Vortech supercharger stuff. Fewer Turbo guys with 1000+ real street cars (John Meany and his street Corvette) being one of them. But John had a background driving much faster race cars too.

So your post "For those who are capable of handling this level of power, with a car with the additional modifications; have fun, and be careful!" is excellent advice.

The guy behind the wheel dictates the safety of the vehicle and PEOPLE AROUND HIM ON THE STREET when under higher boost levels.

Just saying.

Tom V.

[carbking]

Originally Posted by Tom Vaught

Jon, we had a "Mule" 'demonstration vehicle' (old 1996 Modular 4 Valve Engine/Body deal - think SLEEPER) that we (myself included), drove a lot on the street. It made over 700 HP with 15-20 psi of boost. Manual 6 speed trans deal.

Boost is adictive as was posted here by others (5 psi, then 10 psi, then 20 psi).
Charlie (with the 4 cylinder Turbo 64 Tempest) has pushed his engine to +40 psi of boost and scared himself several times over the years with his combination. He was used to the car, too.

A typical racer who has seen a lot of track time with a sub 10 second race car could probably drive his way out of most "loose" conditions or just get out of the throttle.

The 'civilians' who I rode with that drove the mustang were for the most part incapable of handling a good 500 hp vehicle. So it was a high pucker factor for me every time I got into the car with them. You are just riding along basically.

As you drive a personal Turbocharged vehicle you get more knowledge on what it "will do" under given levels of boost (given a proper tire and chassis deal).

I have known quite a few guys with 800-900 HP 'street cars' over the years using the Vortech supercharger stuff. Fewer Turbo guys with 1000+ real street cars (John Meany and his street Corvette) being one of them. But John had a background driving much faster race cars too.

So your post "For those who are capable of handling this level of power, with a car with the additional modifications; have fun, and be careful!" is excellent advice.

The guy behind the wheel dictates the safety of the vehicle and PEOPLE AROUND HIM ON THE STREET when under higher boost levels.

Just saying.

Tom V.

Tom - your eloquent post says very well what I was trying to say.

Thank you.

Jon.

[JSPONT]

Most people who have muscle cars always think they drive well. Hell I have had stick cars always, consider myself a good driver (you can ask Charlie with the 4 cyl) but still have scared the poop out of myself with my turbo car. Did it with no one in the car on a clear road. That's how you get to know the car and the limits of the boost level it needs.

[v869tr6]

Originally Posted by BruceWilkie

Carbking, the best part of a turbo'd vehicle is driveability. Driven normally its tame. No need for high numerical gear ratios either.(3.08-3.55 is fine, the turbo seems to like the loading).V869tr6 is doing great with 2.56's. Pretty good mileage too if you can keep your foot out of it. Bury the pedal and yes, it can become scary fast...however you can limit boost and adjust yourself and your vehicle for more as you go.


Besides, even a toyota mini van is too much power for some to be trusted with.

Bruce I built my car with a 3.00 gear and a T400 with a 29-14.5-15 QTP

For my first Dragweek I put a 2.50 gear in but the car just didn't want to 60 ft like it did with the 3.00 gear, went from a normal 1.32 to a 1.42 60 ft.

I now have a 4L80 so I put a 3.25 gear in it now, haven't run the car since the converter was tightened up a second time but it should be about perfect now, also switched to the Big M & H drag radial 390-45-15

Also put a Luhn oil pump in which will move the pickup back a few inches, hoping the oil pickup stays in the oil as the car 60 ft's better. Have been 1.26 now and that was still spinning a bit about 10 ft off the line.

[Tom Vaught]

Originally Posted by v869tr6

"Also put a Luhn oil pump in which will move the pickup back a few inches, hoping the oil pickup stays in the oil as the car 60 ft's better. Have been 1.26 now and that was still spinning a bit about 10 ft off the line.

The new Luhn Oil Pump (designed for the 7" depth oil pan) should work very well in that pan based on the info I get from Mark @ Luhn Performance. The images I have seen, so far, say the pump/screen will package well, move lots of oil, reduce pulsations/cavitation in the pump, and allow more durability of the gears driving the pump.

Tom V.

[JSPONT]

Originally Posted by v869tr6

Bruce I built my car with a 3.00 gear and a T400 with a 29-14.5-15 QTP

For my first Dragweek I put a 2.50 gear in but the car just didn't want to 60 ft like it did with the 3.00 gear, went from a normal 1.32 to a 1.42 60 ft.

I now have a 4L80 so I put a 3.25 gear in it now, haven't run the car since the converter was tightened up a second time but it should be about perfect now, also switched to the Big M & H drag radial 390-45-15

Also put a Luhn oil pump in which will move the pickup back a few inches, hoping the oil pickup stays in the oil as the car 60 ft's better. Have been 1.26 now and that was still spinning a bit about 10 ft off the line.

How do you like the M+H tires? They are the only ones who have the size I want for my 17 inch rim. I was curious how they compare to the MT's

[v869tr6]

Originally Posted by JSPONT

How do you like the M+H tires? They are the only ones who have the size I want for my 17 inch rim. I was curious how they compare to the MT's

So far I like them a lot, they don't seem to ball up on the face as bad as the Hoosiers I have run. I haven't run M/T's. Haven't been to the strip with them yet but have a friend with a 2005 Mustang street/strip car that has been 8.41 with a M & H Drag radial.

[Tom McQueen]

Originally Posted by v869tr6

So far I like them a lot, they don't seem to ball up on the face as bad as the Hoosiers I have run. I haven't run M/T's. Haven't been to the strip with them yet but have a friend with a 2005 Mustang street/strip car that has been 8.41 with a M & H Drag radial.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I am hoping M&H will make an 18" rim version of their 390 drag radial. So far, no.

[BruceWilkie]

Originally Posted by v869tr6

So far I like them a lot, they don't seem to ball up on the face as bad as the Hoosiers I have run. I haven't run M/T's. Haven't been to the strip with them yet but have a friend with a 2005 Mustang street/strip car that has been 8.41 with a M & H Drag radial.

Good to know on the tires Ed... keep us posted on them. I'm setting up my 90 firebird to fit the same size on a 12" rim or a 14/32 slick or a Hoosier QT 31/16.5 on a 14" rim. It took some math but I could go as small as 315/60 MT on 10" rim and keep tire outer placement +/- half inch of a stock tire. IMO 3rd gens look wrong with tire more than 1" outboard from stock. Need axle width at 52.5" rim to rim to make this work. The 315's sidewall is only one that would end up 1/2" inboard from stock.




Big power...

BME aluminum rods on a cast factory crank have helped durability on the big power builds. Yes they can be street driven(and last a long time). Cast crank flexes very little compared to forged or billet and aluminum rod somewhat absorbs the power loads and stretch forces. Vs steel rods.


China cast cranks are junk. A few China forgings have broke at the 1000 hp level NA not certain why but suspect quality. Turbo'd motors can make more power at lower rpm than NA at high rpm and generally easier on parts because of it.

Billet crank is obvious best choice and rare factory forgings have proven durable.

Cast factory N crank well prepared especially shorter stroke 3.75 or 4" have also shown they are quite strong if used with an ATI damper and BME aluminum rods and all details attended to.

Poor harmonic control will break any crank and detonation however slight will upset harmonic control so tune up is critical .

[Fast 69]

Originally Posted by Tom Vaught

Try to find a 1967 2 bolt main block, (not drilled for 4 bolt mains), put a set of splayed caps on the block, a 4.0" Good forged crank, and a decent set of heads with a Boosting Device and you will have great durability and lots of HP.

Tom V.

What makes a 67 block stronger that later 400's? When i compared an early 67' (9-66 date) to a 72' (4-72 date, casting # 481988) block, the later block looked to be thicker, heavier cast the main webs? Anyone else done a side by side comparison?

[Tom Vaught]

Lots of info on the board if you do a good search.

Sometimes you can get screwed up by just looking at the main web width where the main cap sits and not look at the underside of the webbing where the crank clearance "cut-outs" are and parting lines in the castings are.

You also need to look at the pan rail thickness as the rails also support the block structure, and the "cut-outs" at that location.

Most who actually have spent a lot of time comparing two blocks side by side (in depth)
agree that the 67 2-bolt (not drilled for 4 bolt main cap bolts) can be a very strong stock block (with splayed caps).

Did the 72 block you looked at have holes for straight 4 bolt main caps drilled?

Straight caps are always weaker vs a splayed cap design as the outer 4 bolt main bolt drillings weaken the main web area in the area of the "cut-outs".

Tom V.

ps Marty Palbykin ran a splayed cap 67 400 block for 3 years (at 1600 HP) with a best ET of 6.96 seconds (quarter mile) and 206 mph.

If you could build a Turbocharged 1959 block with splayed caps it might be even stronger vs the 67 block.

[Fast 69]

Thx for the reply Tom. They are both undrilled 2 bolt blocks. Ive got s couple 59' blocks also but not sure the added expense for an adapter and starter is justified. Ill probably use the 67 block and add the splayed mains.

[johnta1]

Read this thread, toward the end of it is a lot of good info:

Block thickness



Larry (LMSRacer) had a lot of great pics of the areas.

[Tom Vaught]

Thanks John W. The thread you posted would provide a lot of info to the question in Post #50.

Tom V.

[Fast 69]

Great information indeed! Thanks!

[70 bird]

Originally Posted by johnta1

Read this thread, toward the end of it is a lot of good info:

Block thickness



Larry (LMSRacer) had a lot of great pics of the areas.

That thread needs a sticky!!!!!!

[ponjohn]

Resurrecting this thread.

I noticed not one person said that hard block was a necessary ingredient.

Will a 3" main 2 bolt block live at 800hp at 5500 rpm with only 2 bolt mains?

[Tom Vaught]

Originally Posted by ponjohn

Resurrecting this thread. Will a 3" main 2 bolt block live at 800hp at 5500 rpm with only 2 bolt mains?

Example #1:
How about this, Luhn Performance made 863 HP at 5400 rpm with a 2 bolt main 455 block and the only issue was seeing the main caps creep a bit (which was corrected with proper size and length dowel pins on the rebuild).

Now everyone knows that a 3.00" main engine has a stronger block vs a 3.25" main block.

So I would give it a good chance that it will live a long time.

Example #2:

Charlie 66 basically has 1/2 of a V-8 engine, (using a 3" main crankshaft) and decent pieces (BUT STILL A FACTORY CRANKSHAFT AND A FACTORY BLOCK).
40 PSI of boost and many, many, trips above 6500 rpm and the engine held together.

The one difference I believe was that he used steel main caps on his engine. Obviously he also ran good rods and pistons and a good flowing cylinder head.

Build the engine properly and I think it will live at 800 HP a long time.

Tom V.

[GTOGEORGE]

Originally Posted by Tom Vaught

Example #1:
How about this, Luhn Performance made 863 HP at 5400 rpm with a 2 bolt main 455 block and the only issue was seeing the main caps creep a bit (which was corrected with proper size and length dowel pins on the rebuild).

Now everyone knows that a 3.00" main engine has a stronger block vs a 3.25" main block.

So I would give it a good chance that it will live a long time.

Example #2:

Charlie 66 basically has 1/2 of a V-8 engine, (using a 3" main crankshaft) and decent pieces (BUT STILL A FACTORY CRANKSHAFT AND A FACTORY BLOCK).
40 PSI of boost and many, many, trips above 6500 rpm and the engine held together.

The one difference I believe was that he used steel main caps on his engine. Obviously he also ran good rods and pistons and a good flowing cylinder head.

Build the engine properly and I think it will live at 800 HP a long time.

Tom V.

Now everyone remember when you build these 800+ HP factory block 2 bolt main engines and they break Tom will reimburse you BECAUSE HE SAID IT WILL LIVE A LONG TIME! LOL
Just KIDDING!!


GTO George

[Tom Vaught]

Originally Posted by GTOGEORGE

Now everyone remember when you build these 800+ HP factory block 2 bolt main engines and they break Tom will reimburse you BECAUSE HE SAID IT WILL LIVE A LONG TIME! LOL
Just KIDDING!!

GTO George

Good Afternoon, George.

Tom V.