Can the GTO be saved?? - Page 2 - PY Online Forums

stonebreaker · #21 06-27-2004, 10:22 PM

Glenn,

Judging by your complaints, I don't think you really understand the concept of a muscle car at all. A muscle car is minimalist by nature - if it doesn't help performance, then you don't put it on the car.

If I asked you to name the all time best muscle cars, what would you say? An L88 corvette? How about the Buick wildcat? Or <gasp> the Shelby cobra...

All of these cars were about performance first, and keeping your butt warm on a cold day second. All the crap you mentioned, particularly the stereo, just adds weight. Modern cars have to handle and stop as well as go fast, and while the numbers on the GTO are a little down, the fact that the Monaro already has an aftermarket will take care of a lot of that.

Personally, I LIKE the sleeper look - my current daily driver is a 96 impala, completely stock on the outside. I even like the single dual exhaust - the twin dual is a little too much of a giveaway that the car is something more than a fwd 6-banger. I do think the wheels need some work, though. They look too small for the body.

And I absolutely DO NOT want hood scoops. Too boy racer, IMHO.

I'm also not real impressed with the pontiac front end, either. You're right about GM's styling department. I've had the opinion for years now that it was the f-car's styling that did it in - it really sucked! GM's styling department has got to be the worst of any automaker's on the planet.

The 04 GTO is definitely going through some teething problems, but I think once GM gets the details worked out it will definitely take off.

I don't like the wheels on the new car, but I saw a car at a local dealer's tonight that had some beautiful chrome 5-spokes. Looked a little like Fiskes. They were also wider than the stockers, and stuck out a little bit from the fenders. Really gave the car some muscularity without looking ricey, the way hood scoops would.

I really think the car will catch on once they correct some of the styling cues. The basic car absolutely kicks ass.

Sincerely,

Randy Stone

Goathead · #22 06-30-2004, 07:10 AM

Most of the comments above have a lot of merit, but the heading of this title is about survival.

If GM does not address the issues in front of it, including cosmetics, this car will not make it very long. And if they address them too late, it will surely be a flop no matter how fast it is.

If you are going to fill a market nitch, attack it, don't just sit back and provide the minimal, that is embarrassing to it's heritage.

Nickv · #23 06-30-2004, 08:36 AM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>Originally posted by Goathead:
Most of the comments above have a lot of merit, but the heading of this title is about survival.

If GM does not address the issues in front of it, including cosmetics, this car will not make it very long. And if they address them too late, it will surely be a flop no matter how fast it is.

If you are going to fill a market nitch, attack it, don't just sit back and provide the minimal, that is embarrassing to it's heritage.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

For once I believe I agree with you.

stonebreaker · #24 06-30-2004, 08:46 AM

You guys are forgetting something. GM is notorious for lame first-year sales. I'm an impala owner. Take the '91 caprice, since I'm familiar with that. All the car mags hated it - said it looked like a bloated whale. And it did - fender skirts and skinny wheels on that monster looked ridiculous.

But in '92 a GM engineer took one and blacked out all the chrome, cut the fender skirts so he could add wider tires, lowered it, added five-spoke wheels, and an LT1. First-year sales were around 6,000. Second year sales hit 40,000, and the final year sold well over 60,000 impala ss's, after which GM discontinued the platform so they could build more trucks.

So don't give up hope yet!

HUMBLER · #25 06-30-2004, 09:08 AM

GM has an issue with that canceling thing. Notorius quite frankly, let's hope when the new GTO is prrrfect in at least most eyes they don't chop it.

Goathead · #26 06-30-2004, 10:02 AM

For once I believe I agree with you.

Quick, someone check Nick for fever...

Nick, I think drastic changes are needed, you know that. I pray that they happen soon enough to keep the car comming, I really do.

This rushed to the consumer vehicle was not a good idea, especially with the GTO badge put on it to increase sales.

Looking at some of the future drawings, you may see me in one in the next two years, if thing go right....

rainmaker612 · #27 06-30-2004, 10:22 AM

All I can say is the last great GTO was in 1970. Pontiac should just let the GTO rest in peace. It's not just about being fast but the Goat was a beautiful yet mean looking machine. Wanna GTO? Then go buy the real deal.

phendee · #28 06-30-2004, 02:38 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>Originally posted by Goathead:
Most of the comments above have a lot of merit, but the heading of this title is about survival.

If GM does not address the issues in front of it, including cosmetics, this car will not make it very long. And if they address them too late, it will surely be a flop no matter how fast it is.

If you are going to fill a market nitch, attack it, don't just sit back and provide the minimal, that is embarrassing to it's heritage.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I could not agree more. Dam, I'm finally agreeing with you. But your are absoulutely
right! Go after the market big time. GM
has done terrible job of marketing this car.
Alot of people don't even know it has a V8 for
crying out loud.

Goathead · #29 06-30-2004, 06:36 PM

I could not agree more. Dam, I'm finally agreeing with you.

The fever must be spreading...

AnthonyHSV · #30 06-30-2004, 08:11 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>Originally posted by Rainmaker612:
Wanna GTO? Then go buy the real deal. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

So your saying we should all buy a Ferrari??? Because aint that the "original" & "real deal"

phendee · #31 06-30-2004, 09:06 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>Originally posted by Rainmaker612:
All I can say is the last great GTO was in 1970. Pontiac should just let the GTO rest in peace. It's not just about being fast but the Goat was a beautiful yet mean looking machine. Wanna GTO? Then go buy the real deal. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Oh brother. You must be really old.

Nickv · #32 07-01-2004, 04:25 AM

LOL!!

HUMBLER · #33 07-01-2004, 05:22 AM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>Originally posted by Goathead:
_For once I believe I agree with you. _

Quick, someone check Nick for fever...

Nick, I think drastic changes are needed, you know that. I pray that they happen soon enough to keep the car comming, I really do.

This rushed to the consumer vehicle was not a good idea, especially with the GTO badge put on it to increase sales.

Looking at some of the future drawings, you may see me in one in the next two years, if thing go right....

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Look forward to that day when you and the rest of the skeptics are on board.

What's that gonna take though? Power, scoops, split dual are all a done deal. What's it gonna take?

Goathead · #34 07-01-2004, 02:58 PM

What's that gonna take though?

Humbler, for me it's gonna take a car that has great big balls, more than any other anywhere near it's price zone, that stares at you from a parking lot standing still and says don't even think about messing with me.

That is what a true GTO was all about....

phendee · #35 07-01-2004, 04:31 PM

It's an opinion if the car looks like "Don't
even think about messing with me". Which I tend to agree with you that it did look like that, but there were plenty of cars faster than
the old goats including the new goat.

stonebreaker · #36 07-01-2004, 05:09 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>Originally posted by Goathead:
_What's that gonna take though?_

Humbler, for me it's gonna take a car that has great big balls, more than any other anywhere near it's price zone, that stares at you from a parking lot standing still and says don't even think about messing with me.

That is what a true GTO was all about....

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I don't know...I really like sleepers. Impalas are known now for being relatively quick for their size (mine has run a best of 11.99), but there are still lots of squirts out there that equate 4 doors with grandpa's car, and it just makes it that much more fun to hand their butts to them. It also makes it a lot easier to suck in the ignorant.

I do think the GTO needs some changes (like going back to the Monaro front end) to really look good. But I prefer a pinstriped suit and Cartier watch kind of look as opposed to warmup suits and gold chains.

Anyway, I never mastered the walk that goes with the warmups - every time I try to swing my arm like that, I hit myself in the nuts...

Goathead · #37 07-01-2004, 05:21 PM

I really like sleepers

Then they should have called this one an Impala. The GTO image is not one of a sleeper, at least in the past it wasn't...

stonebreaker · #38 07-02-2004, 05:37 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>Originally posted by Goathead:
_I really like sleepers_

Then they should have called this one an Impala. The GTO image is not one of a sleeper, at least in the past it wasn't...

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

They sure should've! We knew back in 2002 that GM was thinking about bringing over the Monaro, and we were really gunning for them to rebadge it as an impala. Jon Moss let it 'slip' at a national gathering. Instead, they stick an SS on the fwd version and called the Monaro a GTO. Judging by the reception you and the rest of the old heads gave it, Lutz should have made it a chevy instead of a goat. WE sure would have appreciated it!

KVman389 · #39 07-03-2004, 05:15 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>Originally posted by stonebreaker:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>Originally posted by Goathead:
_What's that gonna take though?_

Humbler, for me it's gonna take a car that has great big balls, more than any other anywhere near it's price zone, that stares at you from a parking lot standing still and says don't even think about messing with me.

That is what a true GTO was all about....

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I don't know...I really like sleepers. Impalas are known now for being relatively quick for their size (mine has run a best of 11.99), but there are still lots of squirts out there that equate 4 doors with grandpa's car, and it just makes it that much more fun to hand their butts to them. It also makes it a lot easier to suck in the ignorant.

I do think the GTO needs some changes (like going back to the Monaro front end) to really look good. But I prefer a pinstriped suit and Cartier watch kind of look as opposed to warmup suits and gold chains.

Anyway, I never mastered the walk that goes with the warmups - every time I try to swing my arm like that, I hit myself in the nuts...

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

wanna sleeper? buy a Serta

stonebreaker · #40 07-04-2004, 12:17 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>Originally posted by KVman389:
wanna sleeper? buy a Serta

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Hmm, I think I might put that one on the tag! Thanks!