#81  
Old 06-25-2011, 07:16 PM
SD455DJ SD455DJ is offline
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Originally Posted by Diego View Post
Dennis, Jeff is over on the v8Buick site. He's somewhat out of the loop with the Internet, though, but you may get lucky. I've got some stuff to work on, so if you don't have any luck finding him there just let me know and I'll find out his contact info in due time.

Also, you raise an interesting point about the Magnum 400's production date. However, I've never had the impression that the 400 stick was a mid-year intro, but ya never know.

Deigo, I saw Jeff today at the Martin Fast Race and asked if he has ever run into anything about T's in his Dad's stuff, but he's been so busy with his new race car (Alcohol NHRA funny car) that he hasn't had a chance and there is alot of stuff. So, no new light to shed other than a gerneral concensus that the 400 4-bbl was most likely available, but just not listed, or ordered by anyone with a 4-door A-body. We'll keep on the investigation.

Jeff was running pretty good in his 350 HO Tempest Custom with a couple of 13.03's @ 107mph. Chris Smetana and his '70 GT-37 was right there with him at 13.03 @109 mph! Dan ran a 12.49 @ 109 mph in his 455 HO T-37 and Rick Mahoney 11.53 @ 121 mph (twice) in the RAII Bird. Julie Pennington kicked Pure Stock butt with an 11.26 in the L-88 Vette!

Dennis

  #82  
Old 06-26-2011, 09:00 AM
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Dang Dennis those d-port indians are flying! Almost makes the RA4 parts seem like a waste of money!

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  #83  
Old 06-26-2011, 03:32 PM
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Dang Dennis those d-port indians are flying! Almost makes the RA4 parts seem like a waste of money!
Hi John, We missed seeing you and Paul there. The weather was great, but actually not for the cars as compared to the cloudy and color weather on Friday. The Pontiacs put on a pretty good show. Rick Mahony's Firebird is simply awesome to watch. Everything is dialed in to wring the most out of every system, certainly the drivetrain and suspension. 11.50's @ 120 in not-so-great air is amazing and a tribute to the Pontiac faithful everywhere.

If you and Paul ever spot a solid '70 4-door LeMans or Tempest sedan, please let me know.

Dennis

  #84  
Old 06-27-2011, 12:16 AM
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One70gt37 has a 70 1/2 GT-37 for sale here. 400 M-21.

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  #85  
Old 06-27-2011, 08:12 PM
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Originally Posted by SD455DJ View Post
Hi John, We missed seeing you and Paul there. The weather was great, but actually not for the cars as compared to the cloudy and color weather on Friday. The Pontiacs put on a pretty good show. Rick Mahony's Firebird is simply awesome to watch. Everything is dialed in to wring the most out of every system, certainly the drivetrain and suspension. 11.50's @ 120 in not-so-great air is amazing and a tribute to the Pontiac faithful everywhere.

If you and Paul ever spot a solid '70 4-door LeMans or Tempest sedan, please let me know.

Dennis
Here's one on Seattle craig's list. Cle Elum is east of Seattle, ~30 mi I think.

http://seattle.craigslist.org/see/cto/2464135056.html

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Old 06-27-2011, 10:16 PM
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Originally Posted by J GLASGO View Post
Dang Dennis those d-port indians are flying! Almost makes the RA4 parts seem like a waste of money!
almost.

John, that was the first time I've ran the car with the new engine. Installed it a week ago and the first run down the track was 13.43 at almost 106 spinning all through first and starting to get a little sideways before I let off. I didn't want to t-bone the 72 455HO GTO in the next lane. Not to mention I really had no idea what to expect the car to do. I'll be racing at POCI if you or Paul happen to make it down to KY

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1970.5 Pontiac Tempest GT-37
400ci 4bbl 4sp 3.90:1
12.73 @ 112.42 2011 Pure Stock Drags
12.71 @ 110.58 2013 Martin FAST/FS race
12.70 @ 111.74 2014 Pure Stock Drags
12.60 @ 111.66 2015 Martin FAST/FS race

1968 Pontiac Firebird 400
TH400/3.08 open
export car - factory heater delete
14.48 @ 95.86 w/ 2.14 60' 2018 Pure Stock Drags
14.47 @ 95.02 w/ 2.16 60' 2019 Martin FAST/FS race
  #87  
Old 06-27-2011, 10:19 PM
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Dennis,

Here's the car I mentioned at Martin



I don't remember much about the car other than I should have grabbed that Tempest fender emblem. I have a buddy who will be at the yard this car is at tomorrow (tuesday), so I may be getting it anyway, lol. I'll send you a PM

Chris

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1970.5 Pontiac Tempest GT-37
400ci 4bbl 4sp 3.90:1
12.73 @ 112.42 2011 Pure Stock Drags
12.71 @ 110.58 2013 Martin FAST/FS race
12.70 @ 111.74 2014 Pure Stock Drags
12.60 @ 111.66 2015 Martin FAST/FS race

1968 Pontiac Firebird 400
TH400/3.08 open
export car - factory heater delete
14.48 @ 95.86 w/ 2.14 60' 2018 Pure Stock Drags
14.47 @ 95.02 w/ 2.16 60' 2019 Martin FAST/FS race
  #88  
Old 06-28-2011, 06:43 PM
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Originally Posted by gloryrestoparts View Post
Dennis,

Here's the car I mentioned at Martin



I don't remember much about the car other than I should have grabbed that Tempest fender emblem. I have a buddy who will be at the yard this car is at tomorrow (tuesday), so I may be getting it anyway, lol. I'll send you a PM

Chris
Pm'd ya. Dennis

  #89  
Old 06-28-2011, 06:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Lemans1970 View Post
Here's one on Seattle craig's list. Cle Elum is east of Seattle, ~30 mi I think.

http://seattle.craigslist.org/see/cto/2464135056.html
Lemans1970, Thanks for the CL ad. I'll check this out. Dennis

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Old 06-28-2011, 07:08 PM
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Dennis,

Certainly. I've kind of lost track as to why you wanted another car ... because the body on the one you have is in need of a lot of work?

From this craigslist ad, this thing strikes me as being relatively straight and original ... if so, it would seem a shame to use as a parts car?

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Old 06-28-2011, 10:04 PM
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Dennis,
The CL ad is 90 miles from me. BUT I am in AK. Won't be home until the weekend. It is on the east side of the Cascade Mts. in WA. Good highway (mostly interstate) all the way.

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  #92  
Old 06-29-2011, 12:13 PM
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Dennis,

Certainly. I've kind of lost track as to why you wanted another car ... because the body on the one you have is in need of a lot of work?

From this craigslist ad, this thing strikes me as being relatively straight and original ... if so, it would seem a shame to use as a parts car?
Lemans1970,

The prime reason(s) we are looking for a solid body is due to rust through in the front floors, the sides of the front cowl (behind the lower front fenders from mouse nests), trunk floor (a portion replaced with flat sheet metal), both rear quarter panels in the typical places, and was repaired from a moderate hit in the rear end years ago. So, if we can find a solid shell, or cheap driver, we'll consider it. We aren't desparate and don't want to destroy a perfectly good car for this, but if we can find one easily, then we'll probably act on it.

The green LeMans on CL in Washington State is a little too far and costly to be quite frank. Chris (gloryrestoparts) sent the pictures of the 2 Tempests in the bone yard that his friend frequents fairly regularly. If one of these is solid, straight, and priced right, we'd make the trip to kick it up. We can also drive and enjoy the car the way it is, since it is still presentable. Or, we could repair the floors, trunk, (the cowls are hidden) and just live with the rear quarters the way they are, which is another option.

We need a complete blue interior as well, especially the dash and plastic pieces. We'd love to find blue, but if we can get any color we would dye them. 4-door sedan stuff is getting very challenging to find these days.

DJ

  #93  
Old 06-29-2011, 12:15 PM
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Dennis,
The CL ad is 90 miles from me. BUT I am in AK. Won't be home until the weekend. It is on the east side of the Cascade Mts. in WA. Good highway (mostly interstate) all the way.
Hi Jack,

Thanks for the offer, but we'll try closer to home first. Dennis

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Old 06-29-2011, 05:32 PM
Lemans1970 Lemans1970 is offline
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Lemans1970,

The prime reason(s) we are looking for a solid body is due to rust through in the front floors, the sides of the front cowl (behind the lower front fenders from mouse nests), trunk floor (a portion replaced with flat sheet metal), both rear quarter panels in the typical places, and was repaired from a moderate hit in the rear end years ago. So, if we can find a solid shell, or cheap driver, we'll consider it. We aren't desparate and don't want to destroy a perfectly good car for this, but if we can find one easily, then we'll probably act on it.

The green LeMans on CL in Washington State is a little too far and costly to be quite frank. Chris (gloryrestoparts) sent the pictures of the 2 Tempests in the bone yard that his friend frequents fairly regularly. If one of these is solid, straight, and priced right, we'd make the trip to kick it up. We can also drive and enjoy the car the way it is, since it is still presentable. Or, we could repair the floors, trunk, (the cowls are hidden) and just live with the rear quarters the way they are, which is another option.

We need a complete blue interior as well, especially the dash and plastic pieces. We'd love to find blue, but if we can get any color we would dye them. 4-door sedan stuff is getting very challenging to find these days.

DJ
Sounds like a reasonable plan ... and yah, I saw you were in Michigan and thought this a little too remote ... but thought I'd just post a link to someone else's car. Thought it looked like a real nice, clean vehicle, but then I would not have guessed that yours has the amount of rust that you have identified, so I guess one doesn't really know until you actually get into it. If I had the available dough, I would consider buying it myself ... this thread has now gotten me interested in 4 dr Lemans as you almost never see them.

  #95  
Old 06-29-2011, 05:43 PM
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Sounds like a reasonable plan ... and yah, I saw you were in Michigan and thought this a little too remote ... but thought I'd just post a link to someone else's car. Thought it looked like a real nice, clean vehicle, but then I would not have guessed that yours has the amount of rust that you have identified, so I guess one doesn't really know until you actually get into it. If I had the available dough, I would consider buying it myself ... this thread has now gotten me interested in 4 dr Lemans as you almost never see them.
Lemans1970, Where are you from?

Yeah! Isn't that weird? I really am into the 4-door cars because of this dang Lemans we bought. It is sad that they are really hard to find these days. Who would have ever thought???

Dennis

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Old 06-29-2011, 06:12 PM
Lemans1970 Lemans1970 is offline
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Lemans1970, Where are you from?

Yeah! Isn't that weird? I really am into the 4-door cars because of this dang Lemans we bought. It is sad that they are really hard to find these days. Who would have ever thought???

Dennis
I live in the Seattle-Everett area. They don't ice the roads out here (at least not with the really corrosive stuff, think they use epsom as opposed to table salt), so things seem to hold up a little better than in the midwest in that regard.

As to the 4 dr, I even kind of got used to the bench seat and column shift ... its different. Everybody seems to want or go after the GTO's (myself included), but this or your car has a 'unique' appeal to it ... wouldn't at all mind owning, cleaning it up or restoring as original. Even with the 350 ci motor, it makes a nice cruiser with a little kick.

Then again, there is also the 4-dr wagon thread that has me interested in them ... this can be addictive. I've had my Pontiac since 1974 (well, in the family since then), so I guess I just like the old boys ...

  #97  
Old 06-29-2011, 10:05 PM
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LeMans1970,
Where abouts in the Everett/Seattle area are you at? My son lives in Marysville and has a '69 Cat w/400/400 and a '78 Gold TA. I go up to see him quite often. Maybe stop by and see you one of these times on the way north?

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  #98  
Old 06-29-2011, 10:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Diego View Post
You have to break up the quotes individually using code, which is what I did. No worries, but I don't have the time to address each one at the moment. :-)

Regarding the number for 400 Tempests/LeManses, want to say it's for all of them and not GT-37s. It could have been for all trannys too, but can't remember for sure, so it's best for someone else to chime in and clarify.

Do you have a jpeg of the order form?
Hi Diego, here is one, found it on PY members UPC-WU2 GT37 site...interesting to note that the form under transmissions, notes 4 speed option not available with just the 6 cyl. engine, but the 400 engine options still list as Hydramatic only. That looks like it could cause some confusion if you weren't reading carefully.

As a comparison, the LeMans Sport/GTO order form, under transmission, clearly lists 4 spd N/A with the 6cyl and the 2 and 4bbl 400 engine options ...as well as under the engine option list showing the 2 and 4 bbl 400's as Hyd. only.

Dennis, that silver Tempest would be a cool find...so it still exists somewhere?
I look forward to any updates on your car...and any other oddball ones that may pop up too. Who would of thought 5 pages on "Just a 4 door."

I threw in a 4 door ad too!
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  #99  
Old 06-29-2011, 10:38 PM
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Just found this...maybe something, maybe nothing? I don't know...seems interesting the mention of a bypass code. Quick Dennis, rip a head off!LOL. Geez Pontiac were good, hiding 400's as 350's.
http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...ht=factory+ads

  #100  
Old 06-30-2011, 04:22 PM
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Hi Diego, here is one, found it on PY members UPC-WU2 GT37 site...interesting to note that the form under transmissions, notes 4 speed option not available with just the 6 cyl. engine, but the 400 engine options still list as Hydramatic only. That looks like it could cause some confusion if you weren't reading carefully.

As a comparison, the LeMans Sport/GTO order form, under transmission, clearly lists 4 spd N/A with the 6cyl and the 2 and 4bbl 400 engine options ...as well as under the engine option list showing the 2 and 4 bbl 400's as Hyd. only.

Dennis, that silver Tempest would be a cool find...so it still exists somewhere?
I look forward to any updates on your car...and any other oddball ones that may pop up too. Who would of thought 5 pages on "Just a 4 door."

I threw in a 4 door ad too!
70Steve,

Those are the early order forms that have the 9/69 date in the lower left corner. I'm sure Pontiac updated these on a regular basis as options/packages were released during the model year, ala the GT-37 for instance. I would like to know when Knafel offered their Magnum 400's to the public. Was it earlier or did it coincide with the GT-37 introduction. Maybe the Glasgo's could shed some light on this. I have quite a few PM's from folks that either owned of knew of a 400 4-spd 2-door LeMans or LeMans Sport, but no solid evidence yet either like a build sheet, PHS, or window sticker.

If I remember correctly, John Sawruk didn't know where the car was or even if it existed anymore. The original owner passed away and knowone knew the owner history of the Tempest. He was working with Jim Mattison to hopefully find a trail or an invoice sheet from that or a similar A-body. I wish I had more information to share on that Tempest. That would be one special car.

Deigo, do you know anything else about that car?

Dennis

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