[poncho-mike]

I was going through some small parts and I found a NOS emblem I bought for my 1970 Formula back in the late 80s. The original emblem was held in place with two small pins cast into the emblem. The replacement emblem had an adhesive backing. I didn't really trust the adhesive, so I re-used my original faded emblem.

The p/n on the box is doesn't match up with the p/n Firebird Central and Classic Industries states was the original emblem p/n. Their ads show the original p/n is 8704055. I can make out a couple of the digits on the box, which appears to be 2XXXXX55. It looks like a trunk emblem. Does anybody have any other p/ns for the 1970 trunk emblem?

Mike

[unruhjonny]

Mike;
Could you please, please, please post pictures of this part & the box/number?

I bought two of these years ago from a seller who said they were leftover parts from a dealership;
A couple months ago someone here posted something to the effect of suggesting that there was a part number for this 'phantom' badge - but it was the number for the two-sided-taped latter design.

If the pictures of your badge look anything different than what I currently have, I would be earnestly interested in buying your badge.

[Formulabruce]

I will take one off my trunk lid and look

[Held for Ransom]

http://www.forums.maxperformanceinc....d.php?t=817618

Post #21.

[unruhjonny]

HFR;
fair enough, but one guy's internet post, is just that, a post...
In post #27 a superseded parts number list was posted to which you replied:

You're comparing the '75 design PN to the new PN, so they should look the same, not going back to the 8704055 design.

I seem to recall that thread no finding resolution about hte authenticity of this "first design" trunk bird ever being issued from GM adhesive backed;
So my reply to PonchoMike was:

Mike;
Could you please, please, please post pictures of this part & the box/number?

I am looking for the proverbial piece of dead-lock evidence to lay this one to rest.

[77 Canamman]

Originally Posted by unruhjonny

Mike;
Could you please, please, please post pictures of this part & the box/number?


A couple months ago someone here posted something to the effect of suggesting that there was a part number for this 'phantom' badge - but it was the number for the two-sided-taped latter design.

As being that aforementioned someone, I merely posted a pic from an auction that stated there was a part number for a hybrid emblem.

[unruhjonny]

hey!

I mean absolutely no offense;
I would very much like to get to the bottom of this tiny piece of overlooked trivia - in a sea of second gen birds that all have spoilers

[77 Canamman]

Originally Posted by unruhjonny

HFR;
fair enough, but one guy's internet post, is just that, a post...
.

Way to go in an effort to discredit my information..

[unruhjonny]

Originally Posted by 77 Canamman

Way to go in an effort to discredit my information..

bah-ha-ha!

[poncho-mike]

Here's that I think the p/n is:
Digit 1 = 2
Digit 2 = 3 or 8
Digit 3 = 1 or 7
Digit 4 = 3 or 5
Digit 5 = 3 or 5
Digit 6 = 3 , 5 or 8
Digit 7 = 2
Digit 8 = 5

I was working on my 70 Formula arond 1988 - 1989, so that would have been around the time I bought it.

Mike

[poncho-mike]

I posted before reading the whole link. The p/n is 20193825.

Mike

[77 Canamman]

Originally Posted by poncho-mike

Here's that I think the p/n is:
Digit 1 = 2
Digit 2 = 3 or 8
Digit 3 = 1 or 7
Digit 4 = 3 or 5
Digit 5 = 3 or 5
Digit 6 = 3 , 5 or 8
Digit 7 = 2
Digit 8 = 5

I was working on my 70 Formula arond 1988 - 1989, so that would have been around the time I bought it.

Mike

That part number was released in late 1990.

[22687]

Can't help with any part #s at the moment but might be able to add to the confusion�� About 20 years ago I was prowling around a swap meet and got talking to a guy who specializes in badges and emblems which he displays by make. He always has nicely displayed and interesting stuff so I make a point to spend some time looking at the Pontiacs even though I didn't have one then (it was during my brief foray into the world of Corvettes until a return to sanity). A lot of NOS and, while not cheap, he's a good resource. Anyway I noticed he had an NOS nose bird for a 70 (with the little post under the beak) as well as several of the later lucite deck lid ones with the double sided tape. I mentioned that I had recently got rid of a 71 Firebird. He asked me if I knew much about 2nd gen cars and I said I did a little. He went to his trunk and brought back a GM box, opened it up and showed me one of the painted style for the deck lid with the posts. Said he'd gotten it in a box of GM emblems from a small dealership that was closing or selling out. Anyway, he went on saying he'd never come across another like it and he'd never seen one on a car. I told him I had never seen one either and that my 71 was the lucite type but with the 2 posts. It stuck with me that it appeared to be an exact copy of what I'd had on my trunk but that the bird was only painted (no clear coating over it) the chrome and paint were perfect and there were no marks on the post for the speed nut so it was definitely NOS. I continued through the show but, the more I thought about it the more I convinced myself that I was looking at something oddball - maybe early 1970 only or something. I went back bought it and threw it on the shelf. Figured some day I'd either have another car to put it on or I'd put it on the wall. Mainly I bought it on a hunch. After I bought my Formula on 2003 I dug it out and installed it, again on a hunch that it was a 70 only thing. I have since come across one or two used ones at Norwalk but never knew the back story. It fit the holes in the deck perfectly and I kind of like that it's a little different. I was curious to read above that they were originally coated over the paint. Never seen one like that and it puzzles me why this obviously new one came out of the box with only paint. Another mystery?

[Formulabruce]

I can put some of this to rest, or not?
Back in 1970 ALL emblems had their respective part numbers, and at the Plant they used bins of speed nuts.
At the dealer, you could NOT order the Emblem. You had to order a "Kit". It was not called a kit, but it had a different part number, and included the speed nuts or clips as needed.
So you have the part number on the emblem, and the part # for the Box with emblem and nuts.
On a front Grill Emblem you got the two small brackets for the posts, and the two speed nuts and the Actual Emblem , and a new # on the box.
Have verified this .

[unruhjonny]

Originally Posted by 22687

Can't help with any part #s at the moment but might be able to add to the confusion�� About 20 years ago I was prowling around a swap meet and got talking to a guy who specializes in badges and emblems which he displays by make. ...

You lucky bum!!

I have kept my eyes open (although not vigilantly) for an NOS trunk bird for a looong time - and never found one.

as far as i know the trunk bird went like this:

1) "1st desing"; attaching stud, and tiny locating stud
2) "2nd design"; attaching stud, and tiny locating stud
3) same as #2, but no studs, with taped back

This trunk bird here in question seems to (me at least) be an anomoly, because other than the one part number page that 77 showed - which (iirc) shows a part mumber which replaced #3(!?), and this box that i now see, there is no mention of this badge anywhere...

[Held for Ransom]

Mike, do you have a picture of the emblem?

Originally Posted by 77 Canamman

Way to go in an effort to discredit my information..

I don't want to discredit your use of the PN, just the physical appearance of the part. Here is a listing from the '76-81 MPC. Along with an NOS '75-6 PN and an NOS '76-80 PN. And, what someone was trying to sell with no packaging and '76-80 PN used in description.

[Held for Ransom]

Originally Posted by 22687

Can't help with any part #s at the moment but might be able to add to the confusion�� About 20 years ago I was prowling around a swap meet and got talking to a guy who specializes in badges and emblems which he displays by make. He always has nicely displayed and interesting stuff so I make a point to spend some time looking at the Pontiacs even though I didn't have one then (it was during my brief foray into the world of Corvettes until a return to sanity). A lot of NOS and, while not cheap, he's a good resource. Anyway I noticed he had an NOS nose bird for a 70 (with the little post under the beak) as well as several of the later lucite deck lid ones with the double sided tape. I mentioned that I had recently got rid of a 71 Firebird. He asked me if I knew much about 2nd gen cars and I said I did a little. He went to his trunk and brought back a GM box, opened it up and showed me one of the painted style for the deck lid with the posts. Said he'd gotten it in a box of GM emblems from a small dealership that was closing or selling out. Anyway, he went on saying he'd never come across another like it and he'd never seen one on a car. I told him I had never seen one either and that my 71 was the lucite type but with the 2 posts. It stuck with me that it appeared to be an exact copy of what I'd had on my trunk but that the bird was only painted (no clear coating over it) the chrome and paint were perfect and there were no marks on the post for the speed nut so it was definitely NOS. I continued through the show but, the more I thought about it the more I convinced myself that I was looking at something oddball - maybe early 1970 only or something. I went back bought it and threw it on the shelf. Figured some day I'd either have another car to put it on or I'd put it on the wall. Mainly I bought it on a hunch. After I bought my Formula on 2003 I dug it out and installed it, again on a hunch that it was a 70 only thing. I have since come across one or two used ones at Norwalk but never knew the back story. It fit the holes in the deck perfectly and I kind of like that it's a little different. I was curious to read above that they were originally coated over the paint. Never seen one like that and it puzzles me why this obviously new one came out of the box with only paint. Another mystery?

A lot of times, NOS didn't always mean the same quality that was placed on the car when newly built and were "seconds".

[unruhjonny]

Originally Posted by Held for Ransom

Mike, do you have a picture of the emblem?



I don't want to discredit your use of the PN, just the physical appearance of the part. Here is a listing from the '76-81 MPC. Along with an NOS '75-6 PN and an NOS '76-80 PN. And, what someone was trying to sell with no packaging and '76-80 PN used in description.

HFR, thank you for your post.

For the record, a great deal of the posts that I make, are when I'm away from home.

Your posted jarred me into doing something;
I have an NOS in box trunk bird;
It the "second design" adhesive backed part;
the number is 20193825.
To me, it seems to be clear that the adhesive backed "1st design", still at this point may not be a GM part, because I can find no conclusive evidence of GM ever selling it this way.

[poncho-mike]

My part is identical to the second part in Held for Ransom's post. I am pretty sure I bought it from a GM dealer around 1989. The outline is smoother than the more stylized bird. I'm re-using Held for Ransom's image.

[bird72]

That rounded edge bird is incorrect for early ones and don't understand why it is even referenced. I have to repaint my trunk now thanks to a mystery damage chip (bad) that occurred in a shop. I put the 75 style bird on just recently (NOS), and after repaint will put the jagged wing early style repro on after, the round edge one is cool (and taller than the original) but bugs me on incorrect, I like the jagged wing one much better anyway. If the repro fades I will just put a new one on every few years, who cares.