#21  
Old 02-07-2020, 09:52 AM
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Originally Posted by panhead59 View Post
Installed dizzy with engine on comp. Stroke. Put balancer on zero. Rotor pointing towards #1 plug wire on cap.
Try it at about 10~12 degrees BTDC instead of zero.
EDIT- As I just noticed steelcityfirebird mentioned already..

Quote:
Originally Posted by steve25 View Post
You have confirmed the 3 things the motor needs to start , but there's a 4th as mentioned, that being compression.
I've always thought of the three things as fuel, fire and compression...what am I missing?

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Last edited by Greg Reid; 02-07-2020 at 09:59 AM.
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Old 02-07-2020, 10:47 AM
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Well yes, compression at the right time on enough of the cylinders I guess to get it to stay running.
Like one cylinder on each rod journal, lol!

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  #23  
Old 02-07-2020, 10:54 AM
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Originally Posted by panhead59 View Post
I ve got a rebuilt 455 that won t start. Got fuel and spark. Lifters adjusted with intake off, so valves should be right. Installed dizzy with engine on comp. Stroke. Put balancer on zero. Rotor pointing towards #1 plug wire on cap. Firing order confirmed. Counterclockwise.. it doesn t even cough or spit !. What have i missed ? One ? Where should vac advance be pointing since that affects rotor to base orientation. Tks
I'm wondering if OP pumped up lifters & did lash set properly.
Setting the balancer @ Zero and putting dist #1 striker on dead on is tough to get started with Zero degrees of initial timing.

I like to set lash with lifters primed on the stand with balancer marked every 90 degrees and follow firing order and set lash on each cylinder @ TDC.

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  #24  
Old 02-07-2020, 10:58 AM
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Ok, I get it. Fuel, Fire, Compression....Timing... Yeah, I can see that as the '4th thing'.

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  #25  
Old 02-07-2020, 06:16 PM
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If you have low or no compression, you don't need to waste time checking spark or fuel. so I check that first. If compression is good in even one bank of cylinders, and there is no backfire, I would bet timing is 180 out if you are getting good spark. A few degrees even 20* out should get some firing. If compression is good, and you see fuel dripping , and even if you have spark to the plug, it may be weak. You can pull a plug and with the plug wire attached, ground the plug to the block and you can visually see and even hear a good strong spark when cranking. And it isn't likely that all 8 plugs would be bad. I would double check voltage at the coil when cranking depending on how you checked for spark before. A remote starter switch can work while ignition switch won't to provide power to the coil when cranking.. Or distributor cap could be bad, or coil weak. Checking compression for me is just one of the easy first steps. I know a lot of people hate it, especially on a new motor, but starting fluid sprayed down the carb ignites easy if there is fuel and compression even with the timing pretty far off. You may get a huge blast of fire back through the carb, so use carefully. Trust me.

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Old 02-07-2020, 06:31 PM
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Having the same issue, taking notes and watching to see what you find. Keep us updated please.

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  #27  
Old 02-07-2020, 10:53 PM
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Ok. I had time to readjust valves today.. no change, still. Not even a sputter. Sat. I ll start with comp. Check then start from scratch, again, with timing. I got a new petronix 3 modual in the mail today. I ll install it if i keep running into deadends. I ll get a new rototr and cap also. Wires and plugs already new. I ll keep ya ll posted. Tks for hanging in there with me. Got 12.47 v to dist. By the way

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Old 02-08-2020, 12:04 AM
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OK,I have posted this before and will do it myself this weekend I hope.Pull all the plugs,put a cork in number 1Trun the engine over with a breaker bad until the cork shoots out.Now pull the dizzy cap and see where it's pointing.That is now number 1 and set the plug wires from there.Now hook up your timing light,turn the key on and rotate the dizzy back and forth until it flashes.Now you will know your for sure on number 1 and plug wire is on number 1.i use a dial back and set it on twelve.I fill the fuel bowls with fuel with a big syringe.Make sure you have fuel when you pump the throttle.Hope this helps and gets you started.EZ way one guy can get it done.FWIW,Tom

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Old 02-08-2020, 01:54 PM
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Is this a flat tappet cam or hyd roller? Posts like this always worry me about the cam going flat.
Are you getting zero sputter or pop from the engine??

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  #30  
Old 02-08-2020, 03:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by panhead59 View Post
Ok. I had time to readjust valves today.. no change, still. Not even a sputter. Sat. I ll start with comp. Check then start from scratch, again, with timing. I got a new petronix 3 modual in the mail today. I ll install it if i keep running into deadends. I ll get a new rototr and cap also. Wires and plugs already new. I ll keep ya ll posted. Tks for hanging in there with me. Got 12.47 v to dist. By the way
Are you sure you have that voltage to the distributor while cranking? It could literally be your ignition switch or a bad wire that is suppose to provide power while cranking. You can get the starter turning the motor but not be getting distibutor voltage, even if you get voltage with ignition switch in the run/ on position I would run a wire directly from battery to coil while cranking. Very simple check.

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Old 02-08-2020, 04:48 PM
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Tom s- i did what u suggested with timing light. It dies light up when i move dizzy. Ta man- flat tappet cam. I did reuse cam since it only had about 1500 miles on it. (Long story) I had machinist look it over. He said it looked good. Timing chain installed with both shafts "mark" set at 12 oclock. Dmac- yes i have 9.75-10 to dizzy while cranking and spark to plug while cranking. I'm getting frustrated to say the least. I keep going back and redoing everything i know of and following up on all posts (suggestions). Anybody else have any ideas or ckecks i can do ? Heck, i'm ready to offer a reward ! Rotor and cap r ready to be picked up at store but i doubt thats it as i have spark at plugs
.

  #32  
Old 02-08-2020, 04:56 PM
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Yep still no pop, sputter, backfire., anything. Ive moved dizzy a tooth or two all different ways. Moved dizzy while cranking. I'm about outta things to try/check. Heck, im 62 and have been messin' with this stuff since around 14 yrs. Old. Frustrating for sure.

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Old 02-08-2020, 04:59 PM
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9.75 volts at the distributor is very minimal voltage cranking. It's acceptable, but low. I would expect 11.0-12.0 volts cranking with a fully charged battery and proper voltage drops. But I don't think it would keep it from starting or at least trying. Was the compression verified to be OK, indicating all the valves are closing on the compression strokes? Couple other things that haven't been mentioned. How long has this car been out of service? How old is the fuel is what I am after here. You say the engine is getting fuel and that's great, but is it still combustible? As a quick check, if you have a spray can of wd-40. spray a nice dose in the carburetor and give it a crank. If it has compression, the distributor is in the general ballpark, and it has spark. IT WILL do something. May not start but it will at least sputter or cough. Wd-40 is much safer to use for this than starting fluid. I don't recommend that stuff. Too volatile for testing. Good luck


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  #34  
Old 02-08-2020, 05:00 PM
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  #35  
Old 02-08-2020, 05:04 PM
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I confirmed by removing a few plugs and cranking. All had strong blow on finger. I could use a gauge, but thats a lot of cranking, which i'm unsuccessfully trying to keep at a minimum. I readjusted valves.

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Old 02-08-2020, 05:17 PM
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Yeah battery a little weak. Charging as i go. Wd 40 test. Same result. Cranks good but no start.

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Old 02-08-2020, 05:20 PM
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2-3 months downtime. I thought about old fuel but we have non ethonol gas that i use. Plus ive dumped some new down carb., now wd 40. I don't think its a gas issue.

  #38  
Old 02-08-2020, 05:52 PM
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Did you verify the firing order at the distributor cap and that it is COUNTER- CLOCKWISE

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  #39  
Old 02-08-2020, 06:11 PM
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Don't rule out a bad coil. Might fire outside the cylinder but not under compression.

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Old 02-08-2020, 06:17 PM
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Yes firing order correct. And counter clockwise. Ok i have some progress FINALLY. When hooking up wires to dizzy the tape fell off that was marking location. There's 3 wires. Red and black go directly to coil, and to petronix (dizzy).Then there was/is a black with red stripe wire. I didn't really know where it went since my tape marking it had fallen off. I put it to black or ground. Tracing it leads me to the wire plug/connector on firewall. Most likely going to ign. Switch. So i switched it to red wire spot going into dizzy. Bingo ! Shes not started yet but shes raising hell ! Popping, spittin' buckin' ! Gotta quit for today ( 3 yr. Old "princess" time ) but at this point, i feel like she'll be running tomorrow. Lets hope ! Tks for all the interest and help. I'll let ya know how it runs tomorrow !

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