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#1
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Antifreeze in bell housing
A while back I posted that I had antifreez in the bell housing on my unfired 428. Must be from a freeze plug as there’s nothing on top of the motor anywhere. So I just pulled the tranny and everything down to the block plate. Still trying to fathom how antifreeze can seep past the block plate and end up in the bell housing. I guess if it worked it’s way over the crank. Anyway, which one of these freeze plugs would be the culprit? No sign of anything anywhere other than the large center plug seemed it’s possibly wet where it meets the block. Any ideas?
Thank you guys!! |
#2
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The big plug is the cam tunnel plug, no anti-freeze there. The smaller one hides the oil plug that some forget to re-install during a rebuild, no anti-freeze there.
If anything, my guess is that the anti-freeze was seeping from the O-ring gasket/seal where the front of the intake mates to the wate pump/timing cover, running down/back the valley pan, and down the back of the block where it showed up. The seal does not seal well if not correctly seated. The intake must be left loose, then the long bolt that is fitted to the front of the intake where the O-ring seal seats, must be torqued down first to draw the intake forward and putting pressure/crush on the O-ring seal so it does not leak. Once tightened down, then you torque down the intake bolts. If you torque down the intake first, the intake will not move the needed forward distance to crush/seal the water O-ring between the timing cover and front of the intake and you will get an anti-freeze/water leak which can be hard to find/determine because the leak can be intermittent, only leak under high cooling system pressures, or dry up/evaporate before you locate it. Other than a head gasket leak or a bad intake gasket seal at the rear water passage, my money is on the O-ring seal at the front of the intake. |
#3
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Thats the back of the camshaft, wouldn't be my first guess for sure. Can you hook up a pressure tester and watch it?
__________________
'65 Tempest 467 3650# 11.30@120.31 |
#4
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Pressure tester will be the best way to check this.
It will help you to pinpoint every leak. Many times there are more than one.
Good luck! |
#5
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Well I know for sure it was not from the front of the motor. There was nothing in the valley pan at all, bone dry. Nothing along the head to intake points. When I did put a pressure gauge on it at 15lbs for 24 hrs I got a drop on the thermostat housing and the water pump, nothing at the intake to timing cover seal. The water pump and thermostat housing have been redone already. Nothing leaked anywhere else, nothing in the Bell housing. Was 15lbs too much? It leaked into the bell housing over a few month period and didn’t drip out until I moved the chassis from one side of the garage to the other and was bouncing it back and forth to toll it over the lift hind between the towers, as I was doing it alone.
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#6
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My 1st check will be the heater hose nipple on the back of the passenger head.
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#7
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Checked that and was dry.
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#8
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Just to clarify, this is sitting in the garage, not running with the body off.
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#9
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Need to clarify further how it is sitting right now? So is it in the chassis with the body off and the cooling system hooked up with a radiator and able to be pressure tested now? If it is, I would pressure test it again now that you can see everything. 15 lbs. pressure is fine. If the leak is tiny, put pressure on the system and leave it there for a few days. Should find your leak. You can put a florescent dye in the coolant and use a black light if you like. It is not at all uncommon for core plugs, (freeze plugs) to ooze a little coolant on a fresh rebuild. That's why most shops, builders use a sealant on the OD to help seal. As the block rusts, which is pretty quick, they generally seal up. Also why most manufacturers put stop leak in the cooling system AT THE FACTORY on new vehicles because of all the aluminum parts that don't rust immediately and may leak when new. If the engine is out of the car now and cooling system empty and dry, a smoke machine can be used to fill the cooling system with smoke and look for a leak path. These smoke machines were primarily used for emission leaks but can be used very effectively for all kinds of leaks. Possibly a local shop could loan/rent you one for a day.
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#10
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Yes car is body off, motor is in chassis and I can refill it. I hope water pump doesn’t ooz also. What’s the lowest I can put it on?
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#11
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Normal radiator cap pressure is between 13 and 16 lbs.
So whenever the engine is running and heated up, it will be around 15PSI.
I'd second the thought to check all the expansion (freeze) plugs. It doesn't take much of a seep to get a drip or two of antifreeze out of one. Maybe the one at the rear of the driver's side head, opposite the heater hose fitting? I much prefer to chase large coolant leaks - MUCH easier.... |
#12
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I agree, a big leak isn’t easy. 24hrs at 15psi and nothing in the back. Just caused two leaks up front
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#13
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Could be leaking from timing cover, down to oil pan flange, then traveling to bellhousing?
Or block screw that is leaking, down to pan, etc. Or head gasket? I would think it would be easy to find with nothing in the way?
__________________
John Wallace - johnta1 Pontiac Power RULES !!! www.wallaceracing.com Winner of Top Class at Pontiac Nationals, 2004 Cordova Winner of Quick 16 At Ames 2004 Pontiac Tripower Nats KRE's MR-1 - 1st 5 second Pontiac block ever! "Every man has a right to his own opinion, but no man has a right to be wrong in his facts." "People demand freedom of speech to make up for the freedom of thought which they avoid." – Socrates |
#14
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Nothing wet anywhere!!
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#15
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I had a similar issue years ago and it turned out to be a core plug at the back of the passenger side cylinder head. You would never look in that location normally.
Tom V.
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"Engineers do stuff for reasons" Tom Vaught Despite small distractions, there are those who will go Forward, Learning, Sharing Knowledge, Doing what they can to help others move forward. |
#16
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I’ll check that too.
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#17
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I believe I posted in your previous post, about the coolant ports of the back of the heads, as Tom has mentioned. post# 15. I had the same thing happen to me and it was running down the back of the block. I had actually installed thread in fittings and the passenger one was leaking. Will probably on show when engine is hot and pressure on coolant system.
http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...d.php?t=840653 |
#18
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put some pepper in the radiator and see if it seals it up...
__________________
1970 firebird, 468, e heads, |
#19
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Pepper? I was told about tabs you put in that are still in my shopping cart on eBay but never pepper.
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#20
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Coarse ground pepper, raw eggs, oatmeal, ground up corn cob, probably 100 other home remedies all are supposed to provide the miracle cure for radiator leaks. Myth Busters tried about half a dozen of them in one episode. Some actually worked a little. If you decide to go the stop leak route, GM cooling system tabs work pretty well.
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