[Bob Timmermans]

Originally Posted by BILL BOWMAN1

Remember the 80’s when we slapped these motors together, fired them up, if the oil pressure was good and no leaks, we ran the snot out of them, without issue, and there wasn’t even the thought of cam or lifter failure??
What the hell happened?

' Progress ' . . . ?

[Stan Weiss]

Originally Posted by i82much

i mean really ... right now i have OF 1.0, rev limiter at 5500 rpm. 1.5 rockers. Very safe, it will probably live forever ...

but there is a part of me that wants to put a snotty 290b6 in there, think about it ... 505 cubic inches ... extra wide ratio muncie ... 3.54 gears ... just rip it up to 6500 rpm every time i drive it ...

but would i really just be giving up power in exchange for a top end that could rev higher?

Yes it will probably live forever.

Was this engine ever on a dyno?

How did you decide where to shift and set the rev limiter?

Stan

[i82much]

Originally Posted by Stan Weiss

Yes it will probably live forever.

Was this engine ever on a dyno?

How did you decide where to shift and set the rev limiter?

Stan

honestly i just picked 5500 because it sounded safe! no dyno yet but might get it to a chassis dyno next year for the heck of it ... i have an RPM on it now but i also have a T2 with an open spacer on the shelf.

[Dick Boneske]

Yes, in the '60's, when most of our Pontiac engines were produced, lifters were about $1.00 each. Cams were $25. We installed them and had very few failures, even with high valve spring pressures.

Today, oils are much better, but something has gone wrong with technology related to cams and lifters. It's amazing to me that, after many years of questionable cams and/or lifters, that on one has the answer as to why.

As evidence of the improvement in engine oil--remember the early Old's V8's and others with noisy lifters? Those same engines today, with modern engine oil, run without the valve train noise.

[grivera]

Another informative video from Powell Machine - reinforces the prevailing issue is machining rather than hardness. That being said, if I bought FT lifters, I would opt for the DLC treatment: https://youtu.be/k_ExoIuTpks?si=Izne7RU87Ol2ZDUw

[P@blo]

Originally Posted by grivera

Another informative video from Powell Machine - reinforces the prevailing issue is machining rather than hardness. That being said, if I bought FT lifters, I would opt for the DLC treatment: https://youtu.be/k_ExoIuTpks?si=Izne7RU87Ol2ZDUw

In the comments section guys are having zero failures with the DLC but the coating can cause the lifter to spin less due to the frictional decrease. As a result there is a different wear pattern on on the cam but is not a concern apparently.

The DLC looks to be a game changer for us engine traditionalists looking to avoid the retrofit roller lifter pitfalls.

[geeteeohguy]

Originally Posted by Dick Boneske

Yes, in the '60's, when most of our Pontiac engines were produced, lifters were about $1.00 each. Cams were $25. We installed them and had very few failures, even with high valve spring pressures.

Today, oils are much better, but something has gone wrong with technology related to cams and lifters. It's amazing to me that, after many years of questionable cams and/or lifters, that on one has the answer as to why.

As evidence of the improvement in engine oil--remember the early Old's V8's and others with noisy lifters? Those same engines today, with modern engine oil, run without the valve train noise.

I'll take it that you meant 'no one'. Well, I have the answer. I got if from many hours of research and watching youtube and reading forum posts by machinists, etc. The answer is POOR MACHINING. Camshafts made with no lobe taper (causing lifters not to spin). Camshafts made with journal sizes out of spec. Lifters with no crown. Lifters with a bad crown. Lifters with standard sized plungers (the only ones available) installed in honed out bores. Hardness does NOT seem to be the issue, but machining does. Watch Musclecar Solutions for more info. Also, people running detergent oil on cam break in. Which has always been a no-no. Even back in the day. Detergent washes the cam and lifter pre-lube right off. No good. I can also say that ALL new parts have about a 20-30% failure rate out of the box. Especially those with rubber components. This was unheard of 20 years ago. Several years ago, I was doing ignition work on a GM vehicle and needed a new HEI coil. Out of six brand new coils, 5 ohmed out bad right out of the box. Henche En Mexico. It's even worse today.