[redgto366]

I have just stumbled across a car that was advertised as a 70 455HO GTO. When I get there the car has all the makings of a Judge spoiler, glovebox emblem, stripes and decals and Ram Air parts with a 455HO engine out of car and a 67 400 installed. I am waiting to receive PHS to see what I really have here, but my question is did they really make this combination? I have heard that they did make 455HO Judges in 70. Does anyone know of any that exist? Any comments would be welcomed, Thank You.

[68bird400HO]

Yes, there were some 1970 Judges factory built with 455s. They are quite rare as I think the production number was south of 50. The 455HO in 1970 was a D-port motor, unlike the 455HO roundport motors of 1971-72.

[redgto366]

I am aware of the differences between the heads and know all the casting numbers. Its just that I was on my way to look at a 1970 GTO that I was told to be an original 455HO 4 speed car, no mention of Ram Air or anything. Upon arrival I notice a dozen old vehicles in the yard and sum up that at least I'm not wasting my time this guy must know about his cars. As soon as I see the GTO I notice the spoiler and Judge decal, no biggy plenty of these cars got striped and spoiled. Walk up to interior and 1st notice formula wheel, I say thats a plus then out of corner of my eye I see Ram Air pull cable, now I'm like HO/RA car? Open door poke in interior and there it is Judge glovebox emblem, now my heads spinning, what happened here? I quickly open the hood noticing a Ram Air hood minus pans and flappers, further inspection finds the RA parts in the trunk. Now for a full hour discussion I never mention the word Judge and neither does he, as a matter of fact the word never came up and that baffled me that he never even mentioned anything about the goofy graphics all over the car. But he did talk an awful lot about this car being owned by his buddy and that it was the baddest biggest engined GTO going and mentioned hundreds of times 455HO this 455HO that. So I make a deal and leave a deposit and say that I will buy the car if it does indeed come back as being one of the 455HO cars that he claims it to be. I am now waiting on PHS to see what this mystery cars true pedigree is. My gut is it comes back a Judge, but where these guys confused by the RAIV and 455? Is it a base RA3? Or a 455 GTO that was turned into a Judge clone in the 80s? We will soon find out....

[MescaBug]

The 455 1970 HO used the RA3 cam.

The Judge came with the RA3 engine, RAIV was available has an option. The 455 was available late in production.

You said it came with a 67 HO 400. In any case, its not matching number. The PHS will tell. If its really a Judge with the 455HO, it is indeed, a rare car.

[OVERULD]

Good luck -hope it turns out to be a gem!

BJ

[Kenth]

Too bad Pontiac used the 068 (H.O.) camshaft for the 1970 D-port RamAir-engines......

[The Boss]

If it's an original 4spd car then it's not a Judge.

They only built 14 Judge Hardtops and 3 Judge convertibles with the 455HO motor in 1970 and they were all automatics.

[johnta1]

Possibly it's a real Judge, and someone put the 455 engine in it?
(why they keep saying it's a 455 HO)

Anyway, hoping for the best for you.
Either way sounds like a nice car.

PICS are required also.

[birdsandgoats]

Is it this one ? http://nh.craigslist.org/cto/3136330431.html

[redgto366]

Thats the one, do you know anything about it? I'm waiting on PHS tomorrow to see what it comes back as. I feel like a moron because I realized after seeing car this morning and getting flustered that I never checked for the 12 bolt. I also hadnt seen the car advertised on craigslist until after as a local friend of mine turned me on to the car that he was told to be a 455HO GTO. Im thinking that this car was a RA3 Judge that may of had at one time a 455 transplant. I will let everyone know hopefully tomorrow. Either way I think that this may be an interesting car as it seems to be an original RA car.

[redgto366]

Originally Posted by The Boss

If it's an original 4spd car then it's not a Judge.

Thanks, Boss thats what I was thinking I had heard. And has anyone seen an original build sheet? Is the 455HO called out as an added money option? I'm thinking this car comes back as RA3 Judge, but cant understand it not being sold that way.

[Judge273]

Love a good GTO mystery, and all the possibilities.

Looks like a solid car from pix. Thought I saw blue paint beneath white paint?

But, I would start with: Did VIN show its a 1970 GTO? 242370xxxx....

PHS will fill in blanks from there as you know.

Good luck!!

[redgto366]

Originally Posted by Judge273

Looks like a solid car from pix. Thought I saw blue paint beneath white paint?
But, I would start with: Did VIN show its a 1970 GTO? 242370xxx

Very solid car, above average for what we usually find in this part of the country. No sign of blue paint apparent during inspection and it may even be original paint. Car is real 242 car so definitely GTO, only thing is I was going to look at a 455HO GTO because I have had a complete engine sitting here since 1984 and thought I found a body for it. Not even sure Im interested in a Judge without matching numbers, now if it comes back as a RAIV things may be different.

[The Boss]

You said the 455 was out of the car - was it there? - was the vin on it?

Mike, if the blue you are speaking of is below the trunk lip - I think that may be a reflection of the sky on the top of the rear bumper. The floor boards and inner doors sure do show a lot of evidence of white.

[gtojon]

Very cool, these are the stories that keep the hobby so interesting. I too think I see the blue paint under the white, look at the pic with the trunk open. Also seeing alot of white overspray. My guess is a blue/blue Judge, I am hoping for a IV for you, maybe that was the "baddest" engine the owner is speaking of. Now we wait.

[redgto366]

Originally Posted by The Boss

You said the 455 was out of the car - was it there? - was the vin on it?

Mike, if the blue you are speaking of is below the trunk lip - I think that may be a reflection of the sky on the top of the rear bumper. The floor boards and inner doors sure do show a lot of evidence of white.

I can see how the way I wrote that may be misunderstood, but the only engine that is there is the 67 400 installed in it NO other engine. And again about the blue what people are seeing in that picture is what Boss said the top of the rear bumper the other strip which looks to be along trunk lip is reflection of sky in rear window I saw no evidence of blue paint, but I started to get flustered as to what I may have found and missed alot of things while I was there.

[71 lemans sport 455]

Wondering if the owner watched Two Lane Blacktop a few to many times with the 455 mach 4.LOL.Any pics of the trim tag.What plant was it build.Canada will indicate if its a judge on the trim tag.Good luck hope PHS comes back in your favor

[1lms]

Easiest way to tell for a factory 455 car is the use of the 455 only frame mounts. Much larger for the 455 and not usually changed when swapping motors.

[indymanjoe]

Hope its a rare car that gets saved.actually just being a Pontiac i hope it gets saved LOl Fun thread nontheless..

[The Boss]

The Formula wheel is from a late 70's TA or Firebird - they were all black for the first 5 or 6 years.