#61  
Old 07-02-2018, 10:37 AM
Judas Judas is offline
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Originally Posted by Bigd400 View Post
First though I need to get all my parts order to get the chassis ready when it get back. What are the things that should be replaced (safety wise) vs keeping things original??

The front to back fuel and brake lines? Shock will be changed but do you go with the original style or something that preforms better? Springs? Who had the best complete front end kit? Still has the original style ball joints is it worth trying to replicate them?
Well that depends on your build. If your are going for 100pt show car and the car came with 4 wheel drums, thats what you put on. Otherwise, someone running 4 drums in a high powered, heavy GTO has a deathwish IMHO. Hot Rod (or was it Car Craft?) did a test with a Dodge Challenger (IIRC) and a basic disc/drum conversion shaved off something astounding from the stop distance- I think it was like 100 feet from 60mph or somesuch (its been some years, so pardon the lack of clarity on my part, but I should be in the ballpark). I also recall an editor testing a 4-drum, big block 68/69? Camaro and he described its stopping power as 'terrifying'

At the very least it should be upgraded to a disc/drum setup which is a relatively easy conversion with lots of kits and aftermarket support even if you don't elect to get the OEM parts which are cheap and common, as parts go. My car is a resto-mod so I've upped it to 4 wheel discs with a kit from Right Stuff. That might be overkill for a cruiser but I've always hated working on drum brakes because of the clockwork of springs. "Where there are springs, there is suffering."

Brake/Fuel lines: Again, depends on your build. Stock were steel lines but these, IMHO, are basically obsolete in the face of Nickle-Copper tubing that doesnt rust and is soft enough that its super easy to work. Even cheap chinese brake tools can flare/bend them properly. It costs a little more, but worth it to me.

Shocks...I have no info on. Mine are just over-the-counter, stock Monroe units. My car is a cruiser, so stock stuff should be fine. Spings- Mine are original. They seem to work, so I didnt see a reason to change them. If you are thinking of doing some road-racing, these won't cut it though and I'd check the "Race" section of the forum.

My front end (ball joints, etc) are Right Stuff parts. I can't speak to their quality since my car is still 'sleeping' (mostly) but everything fit property except for the end link bolts for the sway bar are a tad too long- they will barely touch the stem of the upper ball joint on both sides. I was able to get mine together, but I have a "TODO" to trim about 1/4in off the ends of those bolts because I don't think these parts should ever be in contact.

Hope this helps!

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Last edited by Judas; 07-02-2018 at 10:40 AM. Reason: typo
  #62  
Old 07-04-2018, 02:23 PM
Bigd400 Bigd400 is offline
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Thanks for the info. It’s definitely hard getting correct parts if you can call them that. Pretty much everything I have ordered so far is similar but surely not same as the original.

The tear down continues. Neat finding some of the original markings. Original shocks partially painted.
180 on the rad support. Would that be in reference to thermostats?
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  #63  
Old 07-04-2018, 03:02 PM
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From what I’ve seen in decades of boneyarding is that all 69 Pontiacs (except firebird of course)had chicken wire on the cowl.

Also the black out paint in back was used on all A and B bodies in very early production unless the car was painted a dark color. I think this only happened for the first few weeks of production and I’ve seen examples from most plants.

There are lots of tricks to assess if a car has original factory installed sheetmetal. For example there seems to be three distinct A body rad support variants as the model year advanced, same for trunklids.

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  #64  
Old 07-10-2018, 11:33 AM
Bigd400 Bigd400 is offline
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Everything is pretty much stripped and just need to go through it all. Try and determine what’s original what’s not and what should be changed and what shouldn’t!

Got a few pictures and questions!

The code on the cowl possible the interior code? 254??

Fuel line routing to the carb. Looks like RAIV was only routed on the passenger and RAIII on the drivers side of thermostat? Any reason for that if that’s the case?

Drive shaft believe it’s suppose to have Red and 2 white stripes? Location seems to be way off from all the pictures I’ve seen. Looks like original ujoints possibly?
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  #65  
Old 07-10-2018, 11:37 AM
Bigd400 Bigd400 is offline
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Two more things. The rad hoses are surely old but doesn’t appear to be the same as any others I’ve seen.

PQ was originally pink and stamped?

I am sure there’s more but that’s all I can think of for now.
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  #66  
Old 07-18-2018, 04:26 PM
Judas Judas is offline
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Wow- twistie shocks. Pretty sure that was original cause I've never seen them in the aftermarket (and I used to work in parts in 1992-ish).

I don't know a thing about markings, but I think its covered in Zarzarine's book which I strongly recommend for the GTO. : https://www.amazon.com/Pontiac-Resto...toration+guide

I am astounded that this book now costs hundreds! Get the e-book!

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  #67  
Old 07-18-2018, 05:12 PM
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They've reproduced those for several years now. Get any date code you want, about $100 a piece.

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Old 07-18-2018, 08:00 PM
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big d 400 where are you located

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Old 07-19-2018, 02:12 PM
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254 is red bucket interior, often marked in wax on the engine side of the cowl.

Those hoses look original but hard to distinguish between factory installed and early dealer service replacement.

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  #70  
Old 07-21-2018, 10:18 AM
Bigd400 Bigd400 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by north View Post
254 is red bucket interior, often marked in wax on the engine side of the cowl.

Those hoses look original but hard to distinguish between factory installed and early dealer service replacement.

Thanks! I did a bit of searching to see what original might look like but it’s hard to tell and it really is no big deal just neat to relive the history of the car. Funny though the stripe is on the very bottom.

In that searching I did come across a picture posted by Judge273 which I do believe is an original photo of a RAIV with the fuel line routing on the drivers side. Which is kinda interesting. As all I have read or seen is it’s suppose to be on the other side.

On another note. The hood looks awesome striped!
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  #71  
Old 07-21-2018, 10:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by north View Post
From what I’ve seen in decades of boneyarding is that all 69 Pontiacs (except firebird of course)had chicken wire on the cowl.

Also the black out paint in back was used on all A and B bodies in very early production unless the car was painted a dark color. I think this only happened for the first few weeks of production and I’ve seen examples from most plants.

Dad's 69 has both of these features factory. Funny because he's had a lot of "so called" Pontiac experts try to tell him it's not original. Oddly they are still in disbelief when he tells them he bought it new, it came this way.

Finally though more of this is coming to light.

  #72  
Old 07-21-2018, 12:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Baron Von Zeppelin View Post
Hey Jones , was your car built in Baltimore Plant ?

We have never been able to source a build sheet from any 69 Baltimore A-Body cars.
Yours would be great to see , if that is the case.
Thanks
Wait a minute, is this true? I thought there were several Chassis and Body broadcasts from Baltimore cars posted here before? I know I have a couple.

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  #73  
Old 07-21-2018, 12:42 PM
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The pic that you posted in original post looks to be a inspection paper with interior code on it.

I found similar piece behind my rear seat and it has 4267 in size numbers like yours. Mine has places on edge for typed in numbers. It has a number that matches one on my trim tag. The rest of the sheet was gone and haven't seen a whole sheet yet. I never found a build sheet.

Baltimore built 4th week Jan.

Good Luck with your GTO.

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Last edited by thepontiacman; 07-21-2018 at 12:46 PM. Reason: add pic
  #74  
Old 07-21-2018, 01:39 PM
Baron Von Zeppelin Baron Von Zeppelin is offline
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Originally Posted by MikeNoun View Post
Wait a minute, is this true? I thought there were several Chassis and Body broadcasts from Baltimore cars posted here before? I know I have a couple.
Nope, none from Baltimore @ 1969

Only a few samples each - of the other A-Body plants @ 1969

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Old 07-21-2018, 02:20 PM
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Ok, here you go, a Body and Chassis broadcast from two different Baltimore GTO's. The Chassis Broadcast is a hardtop, the Body Broadcast is a ragtop, Canadian delivery.

Mike
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Old 07-21-2018, 04:02 PM
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Thanks for posting those broadcast sheets. conv on that sheet was Liberty blue like mine. Mine was built 1D.

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  #77  
Old 07-21-2018, 10:15 PM
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Yes my car is from Baltimore and it has the black tail panel and chicken wire screen on the cowl. I bought it new (original owner).

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Old 07-22-2018, 12:19 AM
Baron Von Zeppelin Baron Von Zeppelin is offline
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GTO JONES , could you take a clear picture or a scan of your Baltimore Buildsheet for us please ?
Would really be something unique to see one.

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Old 07-22-2018, 12:37 AM
Baron Von Zeppelin Baron Von Zeppelin is offline
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Originally Posted by MikeNoun View Post
Ok, here you go, a Body and Chassis broadcast from two different Baltimore GTO's. The Chassis Broadcast is a hardtop, the Body Broadcast is a ragtop, Canadian delivery.

Mike
Thanks for sharing those Mike !

I have a Chassis Sheet from a 69 GTO Vert IV 4spd , but its too blurred to make out very much info from it. Was billed "export" but think it was a U.S. service man buyer and stayed here in the States.

Really looking for like what would be a full buildsheet - like the ones from Arlington and Framingham in 69. Baltimore used the same format in 1970 as they did.

ANY build document is a good document - regardless.

These broadcast sheets are in way too good of condition to have been pulled from hidden points within the car. Such as floorboard, seat springs, gas tank.
Guessing they were provided in some other manner with the car to the owner at purchase point, perhaps.

This GTO Ram4 Vert was all original - unrestored - matching #s .... at least up until 10 years ago . No idea about it now.
Think it was Expresso Brown






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  #80  
Old 07-22-2018, 12:52 AM
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The build sheet was on top of the gas tank and in bad shape when we removed the tank some 30 something years ago in the Ohio weather. I do have all the paper work from PHS and the window sticker I display in the window. I'll look for the packet and see what's in it. Since we moved at lot is still in boxes.

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