[Scarebird]

Like a lot of guys, one of the first things I did with all the A bodys I had was put on a factory rear sway bar - they do work. But in Mark Savitske's book he notes they bind up the arm and a linked style conventional style bar would work better, this seem to make sense. I always thought no OEM used that style of bar until today when I spotted one on a Jeep Liberty. My thought was you would not see something such as this nowadays unless it worked.

Has anybody ran both style's on a GM A body and note a difference?





Note bar bolts to lower control arm

[NeighborsComplaint]

I understand the need for links on an independent front suspension (changing geometry) but the links would seem unnecessary in a solid axle rear end since the movement of the lower controls arms is in a single plane and the sway bar merely twists under torsion.

[242177P]

I imagine the four link has two planes? Alf Wiebe made a nice (Stock Eliminator)
suspension that used a wishbone for the uppers. If uppers act as a pivot point, it
may no longer bind??

[rjpaige3]

It works, but it's inefficient. The arm mounted swaybar's only saving grace is being cheap and simple. Plus rubber suspension bushings cope with binding better than all the other options.

[HWYSTR455]

It's best to run the joints in the rear suspension, which eliminates all bind. Bar or not, you would still have bind with anything but the joints.


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[HWYSTR455]

The sway bar in the pic in post #1 is basically the same as the typical A body bar, but on top of the lower control arms.



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[Scarebird]

Originally Posted by HWYSTR455

The sway bar in the pic in post #1 is basically the same as the typical A body bar, but on top of the lower control arms.

That was my thought. The next thought is "is that method of mounting bars that bad if it was used in this century or is Mopar just being cheap?"

My vote is the latter.

[HWYSTR455]

Like mounting on the lower control arms? Be it on the sides of the arms or top? I don't think there's any difference in function, I think it was more of a packaging thing than anything.

That method is tucked up close to the diff, and allows a clear shot to the diff center section for a DIY-er jack. Also doesn't limit shock mount variations. Think it's 6 one way, half dozen the other.

One method I've seen and not too keen on is when the ends are mounted to the body, like on F-bodies, to the floor pans. I think there would be more flex there, and dang if I'm going to put more holes in the body than need be. Is it more effective? I think it's a wash, due to body flex, and body bushing flex. The OE mounting where the drop links are mounted to brackets on the frame rails is at least just as effective, once you take body flex into account. I do like using the aftermarket ones that have the flat piece so standard sway bar bushing brackets can be used.

There's an SA Designs book, think it's something like 'Chassis and Handling' or something along those lines, goes over drag, circuit, and other setups, and different types, as well as add-on stuff, like 4-links, leaf, Watts links, etc. That's a pretty good book, gives core design approaches and which works best in what conditions.

I think the big 3 did pretty well at choosing passenger car suspension design types for what the cars were intended. Each have unique pros & cons, all performed well enough to compete with each other. You go through the years and see some types of suspensions that have made their' way to production cars, which stood the test of time, and which didn't. That's a pretty good indication of what works well and what doesn't. For example, you don't see many torsion bar suspensions anymore, and you don't see stuff like torque tubes and coil overs which didn't last either. (Don't get me started on coil overs).

Leaf spring cars are so underrated, they really work well when the correct parts are used. I see so many move away from leafs, makes sense in some cases, but overall I question the move like "why did you do that again?".

I've been occasionally caught up in the current 'trend' of mods and parts, dang that crap always bites me. I'm much more cautious nowadays, tend to think through stuff more before I pull the trigger. Some stuff is no-brainer, some stuff you have to weight the pros & cons, and other stuff I just have to chuckle.

Educate yourself, think it through, and calculate your mods/upgrades, saves a lot of anguish in the long run.

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[HWYSTR455]

Here's one book I really like, written by Herb Adams, common sense approach:

https://www.amazon.com/Chassis-Engin...VHVFTYJ0M59N98


Here's the other I was thinking about, it's actually an HPBooks book:

https://www.amazon.com/How-Make-Your...VHVFTYJ0M59N98

Those two are good reading, well worth the money.

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[HWYSTR455]

Auto Math Handbook is good too:

https://www.amazon.com/Auto-Math-Han...SJTVXHE1WMBP55


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[ZeGermanHam]

Originally Posted by HWYSTR455

You go through the years and see some types of suspensions that have made their' way to production cars, which stood the test of time, and which didn't. That's a pretty good indication of what works well and what doesn't. For example, you don't see many torsion bar suspensions anymore, and you don't see stuff like torque tubes and coil overs which didn't last either. (Don't get me started on coil overs).

I think the bigger determining factor for what stands the test of time and what doesn't is the cost of manufacturing. Just because a particular configuration is used frequently over the years does not mean that it's being used more frequently due to superior performance. It usually just means it's less costly to manufacture. Case in point, torsion beam rear suspension on FWD cars. Widely used for decades, but not as effective as a nice IRS. It's used because it's cheap and easy to package.

That said, the reality is that 99.9% of the general public doesn't need a fully optimized suspension for their daily commute to the office, mall, and grocery store, so there is plenty of latitude for OEMs to continue using technically inferior suspension deigns without any complaints.

[66sprint6]

Is there any situation where the rear sway bar would be detrimental? Like for the ride, for instance. It seems as though for every proponent of a rear sway bar, there is a detractor. I was thinking of installing a factory one, along with the boxed rear LCA's of course, but my son and I installed the air springs inside the rear coils and the handling improved significantly.

[ZeGermanHam]

Originally Posted by 66sprint6

Is there any situation where the rear sway bar would be detrimental? Like for the ride, for instance. It seems as though for every proponent of a rear sway bar, there is a detractor. I was thinking of installing a factory one, along with the boxed rear LCA's of course, but my son and I installed the air springs inside the rear coils and the handling improved significantly.

Technically, with a sway bar connecting the left and right sides of the suspension, it can have a negative impact on ride quality over bumps. The stiffer the sway bar, the more pronounced that effect will be. However, virtually everyone I've spoken to about installing a rear sway bar on a GM A-body says it's one of the best modifications they've done. I think the pros far outweigh the cons. I'm certainly going to be installing the rear sway bar that came with my UMI stage-3 suspension package once my GTO is put back together.