[sdbob]

Local guy called me about restarting a 400 with Edelbrock heads that was new, run and parked under a car port with a cover. Last run he thinks 2015. Carb is demon. Roller cam he is not sure hydraulic or solid. I said drain fuel. Remove plugs.Spray some wd 40 or like in cylinders. Turn over try to start. He is afraid of plugs galled in threads of heads. Any ideas I've never worked with aluminum heads. Amazing thing he said engine ran well it was built yrs ago by well known west coast builder,yep you know who.

[25stevem]

Before I did anything like trying to crank the motor over I would put in fresh oil& filter, get a priming drive tool, then yank out the distributor and remove the drivers side valve cover and spin the pump until oil made its way up out of the push rods .

[ZeGermanHam]

Aluminum heads have been commonplace in the automotive industry for many decades, and 7 years is a shorter amount of time than most people change the plugs on their daily drivers with aluminum heads. Tell the guy to just pull the plugs.

[Joe's Garage]

Here's what we would do (so that we didn't have to pull the distributor):

Because he is worried about the plugs being galled, pull out ONE plug - an easy one like cylinder #1. That will put his mind at ease about the plugs being stuck.

Presuming that plug comes right out with no issues, pull out the rest of them. If there is an issue with removing the plugs, stop and rethink the procedure.

Presuming all the plugs came right out, soak the cylinders liberally with WD40. Liberally. Kink the end of the little red hose so it will be directional and then give each hole several shots in different directions. If he doesn't have any WD40, inject a couple teaspoons of ATF into each hole.

Place some shop towels or rags loosely down in the spark plug area to catch the mist that might come out when you crank the engine. NOT stuck into the spark plugs holes or anything like that, just sitting there to catch any spray.

If using an electric fuel pump, disconnect the power lead for the pump. If it is run through a switch on the dash, leave it turned OFF.

Hook up a good battery charger and then crank the engine over in a bursts of a few seconds each until the oil pressure comes up to normal on the gauge.

If he is running a mechanical fuel pump, have a helper WATCH the carburetor while doing this, just in case the float is stuck. If any signs of flooding or gas leakage STOP and fix that before you do anything else.

Once the oil pressure comes up, give it a dozen five-second bursts of cranking to circulate the oil throughout the engine. Wait about thirty seconds between bursts to let the starter cool.

Now, drain the old oil and remove the old oil filter. Fill the NEW oil filter with oil and install it. Refill the oil using something like Valvoline VR1 with a good zinc additive content.

Repeat the cranking in bursts of three seconds or so until the oil pressure comes up with the new oil and filter. Then do a dozen five-second cranks to circulate the new oil throughout the engine.

Remove the WD40-catching rags and install new spark plugs.

To address the stale gas:

Note that we would do this BEFORE we did anything with the engine oil. So, even though it's last in this reply, DO IT FIRST!

If there is an electric fuel pump, disconnect the fuel line going into the carb, install four or five feet of rubber line and pump all the old gas out into gas cans. Then put in five gallons of fresh, quality, high octane fuel similar to whatever he ran that last time he had the engine running.

If there is a mechanical pump, disconnect the rubber line going IN to the fuel pump and siphon the old fuel through that line into gas cans. We use a small $20 electric 'clicker' fuel pump attached to that INLET hose to do this.

Again, put in five gallons of good fresh gasoline, make sure all the fuel lines are attached correctly.

Double check the fuel line fittings, cross your fingers, say a little prayer to the Pontiac gods and fire it up.

Have a reliable helper there while you start the engine and have him holding a fire extinguisher just in case there is ANY issue. Watch for fuel leaks or flooding or any issues.

GOOD LUCK!

[Dragncar]

Make sure the bowl screw are tight. After sitting gaskets shrink up and you can have a fuel leak and burn the thing down if you are not careful.

[sdbob]

Ok guys thanks for all the ideas. We arent going to do anything except lube the plugs for about two weeks. He is afraid of stripping threads, so. I'll wsit.

[Verdoro 68]

The threads are probably already stripped if it came from the West Coast shop I'm thinking of Hoping for the best!

[hurryinhoosier62]

Originally Posted by sdbob

Ok guys thanks for all the ideas. We arent going to do anything except lube the plugs for about two weeks. He is afraid of stripping threads, so. I'll wsit.

Bob, if he is that concerned about galvanic corrosion( caused by dissimilar metals), once you have all the plugs out and inspect the threads re-install the plugs with either Never-Seize copper based anti-seize compound or Champion Spark Plug thread compound. This can be purchased through Aircraft Spruce. I just may have a bottle stashed somewhere in my tool box. I used gallons of the stuff working on aircraft piston power plants. We pulled, cleaned, tested, re-gapped and re-installed spark plugs every 50 flight hours. Never had a stuck plug while using the Champion thread compound.

[sdbob]

I told him we ll apply moderate torque to see if plugs will loosen. Then I don't know what if they dont break lose. Thinking of ways to heat the coolant,even thinking just a heat gun on each plug if they prove tight. ?? Thanks for the idea HH, I'll ck on the Champion anti seize.

[zippy]

Originally Posted by Joe's Garage

Here's what we would do (so that we didn't have to pull the distributor):

Because he is worried about the plugs being galled, pull out ONE plug - an easy one like cylinder #1. That will put his mind at ease about the plugs being stuck.

Presuming that plug comes right out with no issues, pull out the rest of them. If there is an issue with removing the plugs, stop and rethink the procedure.

Presuming all the plugs came right out, soak the cylinders liberally with WD40. Liberally. Kink the end of the little red hose so it will be directional and then give each hole several shots in different directions. If he doesn't have any WD40, inject a couple teaspoons of ATF into each hole.

Place some shop towels or rags loosely down in the spark plug area to catch the mist that might come out when you crank the engine. NOT stuck into the spark plugs holes or anything like that, just sitting there to catch any spray.

If using an electric fuel pump, disconnect the power lead for the pump. If it is run through a switch on the dash, leave it turned OFF.

Hook up a good battery charger and then crank the engine over in a bursts of a few seconds each until the oil pressure comes up to normal on the gauge.

If he is running a mechanical fuel pump, have a helper WATCH the carburetor while doing this, just in case the float is stuck. If any signs of flooding or gas leakage STOP and fix that before you do anything else.

Once the oil pressure comes up, give it a dozen five-second bursts of cranking to circulate the oil throughout the engine. Wait about thirty seconds between bursts to let the starter cool.

Now, drain the old oil and remove the old oil filter. Fill the NEW oil filter with oil and install it. Refill the oil using something like Valvoline VR1 with a good zinc additive content.

Repeat the cranking in bursts of three seconds or so until the oil pressure comes up with the new oil and filter. Then do a dozen five-second cranks to circulate the new oil throughout the engine.

Remove the WD40-catching rags and install new spark plugs.

To address the stale gas:

Note that we would do this BEFORE we did anything with the engine oil. So, even though it's last in this reply, DO IT FIRST!

If there is an electric fuel pump, disconnect the fuel line going into the carb, install four or five feet of rubber line and pump all the old gas out into gas cans. Then put in five gallons of fresh, quality, high octane fuel similar to whatever he ran that last time he had the engine running.

If there is a mechanical pump, disconnect the rubber line going IN to the fuel pump and siphon the old fuel through that line into gas cans. We use a small $20 electric 'clicker' fuel pump attached to that INLET hose to do this.

Again, put in five gallons of good fresh gasoline, make sure all the fuel lines are attached correctly.

Double check the fuel line fittings, cross your fingers, say a little prayer to the Pontiac gods and fire it up.

Have a reliable helper there while you start the engine and have him holding a fire extinguisher just in case there is ANY issue. Watch for fuel leaks or flooding or any issues.

GOOD LUCK!

Just wondering why you wouldn't change oil FIRST before cranking to prime the system? Seems pumping the old and possibly contaminated oil through first would not be logical.

[78w72]

Originally Posted by hurryinhoosier62

Bob, if he is that concerned about galvanic corrosion( caused by dissimilar metals), once you have all the plugs out and inspect the threads re-install the plugs with either Never-Seize copper based anti-seize compound or Champion Spark Plug thread compound. This can be purchased through Aircraft Spruce. I just may have a bottle stashed somewhere in my tool box. I used gallons of the stuff working on aircraft piston power plants. We pulled, cleaned, tested, re-gapped and re-installed spark plugs every 50 flight hours. Never had a stuck plug while using the Champion thread compound.

keep in mind that when you add lube to threads the torque spec changes, usually about 10% less than when dry... & on alum heads that only take about 12lb/ft for plugs, its very easy to over tighten or damage threads.

also, many modern plugs come with a dry anti seize/galling coating on the threads, pretty sure MGK & other brands with this say to not use anti seize on the plug threads. for older non coated plugs a little anti seize is a good idea, just got to be careful when tightening on alum heads.

[hurryinhoosier62]

Originally Posted by 78w72

keep in mind that when you add lube to threads the torque spec changes, usually about 10% less than when dry... & on alum heads that only take about 12lb/ft for plugs, its very easy to over tighten or damage threads.

also, many modern plugs come with a dry anti seize/galling coating on the threads, pretty sure MGK & other brands with this say to not use anti seize on the plug threads. for older non coated plugs a little anti seize is a good idea, just got to be careful when tightening on alum heads.

Seen too many stripped out spark plug bosses in modular Fords, LS engines to not use anti-seize on the spark plug threads. Consider this: we used anti-seize on spark plugs that had cylinder head temp higher than those on liquid cooled automotive engines. We also pulled the plugs an a scheduled basis( equivalent to every 5,000 miles). EVERY active piston powered aircraft had its spark plugs pulled at least one a year( annual inspection). Based on my experience in removing galled spark plugs I will continue to use anti-seize on spark plug threads.

[78w72]

Originally Posted by hurryinhoosier62

Seen too many stripped out spark plug bosses in modular Fords, LS engines to not use anti-seize on the spark plug threads. Consider this: we used anti-seize on spark plugs that had cylinder head temp higher than those on liquid cooled automotive engines. We also pulled the plugs an a scheduled basis( equivalent to every 5,000 miles). EVERY active piston powered aircraft had its spark plugs pulled at least one a year( annual inspection). Based on my experience in removing galled spark plugs I will continue to use anti-seize on spark plug threads.

that wasnt directed at you or suggestion you not use anti seize in the situation you describe... its meant to let others know that using anti seize on spark plugs or any threads changes the torque spec, & with aluminum heads being so low to start with, its easy to over tighten & damage threads.

also the point that many modern plugs already have an anti seize/galling coating on them so more is not needed. if the plug threads are dark or black they are most likely bare raw metal, but if they are a shiny like NGK's they probably have a coating & dont need additional anti seize. that being said, i usually use a light coating of anti seize on aluminum or other parts that are exposed to high heat or corrosion etc, but i know to adjust the torque spec accordingly.

https://ngksparkplugs.com/en/resourc...ut-spark-plugs

[Formulabruce]

Originally Posted by hurryinhoosier62

Bob, if he is that concerned about galvanic corrosion( caused by dissimilar metals), once you have all the plugs out and inspect the threads re-install the plugs with either Never-Seize copper based anti-seize compound or Champion Spark Plug thread compound. This can be purchased through Aircraft Spruce. I just may have a bottle stashed somewhere in my tool box. I used gallons of the stuff working on aircraft piston power plants. We pulled, cleaned, tested, re-gapped and re-installed spark plugs every 50 flight hours. Never had a stuck plug while using the Champion thread compound.

As said... COPPER is the key. The 3rd Dissimilar metal insures no seize. COPPER anti - Seize.... yes, Napa has it, and No its NOT Silver colored... In a world of more lightweight components, this is a must have for everyone's tool box.

[1968GTO421]

Here is the NAPA copper anti-seize:
https://www.napaonline.com/en/search...ound/201805507

[hurryinhoosier62]

Originally Posted by 78w72

that wasnt directed at you or suggestion you not use anti seize in the situation you describe... its meant to let others know that using anti seize on spark plugs or any threads changes the torque spec, & with aluminum heads being so low to start with, its easy to over tighten & damage threads.

also the point that many modern plugs already have an anti seize/galling coating on them so more is not needed. if the plug threads are dark or black they are most likely bare raw metal, but if they are a shiny like NGK's they probably have a coating & dont need additional anti seize. that being said, i usually use a light coating of anti seize on aluminum or other parts that are exposed to high heat or corrosion etc, but i know to adjust the torque spec accordingly.

https://ngksparkplugs.com/en/resourc...ut-spark-plugs

The spark plug companies can say what they want. Ford and GM said the same thing…”no need for anti-seize on spark plug threads for aluminum heads”. I doubt any engineer or public relations “expert” ever had to remove a seized spark plug from an aluminum head; I have. I’ve never seen a dry anti-seize that was worth a red spit. The compounds I listed WORK.

[Formulas]

All this hand ringing over 2 issues that probably are not a factor, the time to oil a cylinder was right before storage to prevent and the time to put on anti seize and worry about plugs was on install, what's done is done i would start it up

in 1976 i bought a GTO that sat in a Ohio car port unused for 4 years without an air cleaner on it pumped up the tires jumped the starter solenoid with a screw driver and drove it away, guess i was just living crazy dangerously at that time
it also needed an entire ignition, plugs, cap, rotor, wires, points, condenser, and had 3 bent pushrods run hard put away wet. lol

a heat cycle would be your friend IF there was a plug issue

[b-man]

Siphon out as much of the old gas as you can and put as much fresh gas in as you think necessary.

Start it and get the oil good and hot then change it along with the filter.

Drive the damn thing.

I recently bought a 1960 36hp air cooled VW 1200 that had been sitting 15 years, it was said to be a good running engine. I checked the dipstick and the oil level was okay and I could see right through the oil on the stick so it obviously wasn’t super dirty. Hooked the fuel pump up to a gas container and squirted some into the float bowl vent to fill the carb. Fired right up and idled nicely after a couple minutes of warmup. All I did to it was put another set of good used spark plug wires on it and bolt the muffler back on that came with it.

It’s really not a big deal.

[78w72]

Originally Posted by hurryinhoosier62

The spark plug companies can say what they want. Ford and GM said the same thing…”no need for anti-seize on spark plug threads for aluminum heads”. I doubt any engineer or public relations “expert” ever had to remove a seized spark plug from an aluminum head; I have. I’ve never seen a dry anti-seize that was worth a red spit. The compounds I listed WORK.

thats fine if you use it, but again not directed at you. simply mentioning that lube on thread changes the torque for guys that arent aware of that, the very low torque rating of alum heads spark plugs is easy to over tighten even when dry. the OPs friend doesnt seem to be too mechanically inclined & the suggestions to use anti seize didnt mention the torque change.

ive never seen GM specifically state not to use anti seize on plugs that are already coated with it but im sure its been mentioned before... raw metal into aluminum is different & i agree with using it & use it myself. but manufactures did lots of stupid things related to future owner maintenance or not using lube/anti seize on bolts that are in areas exposed to moisture, extreme heat or dissimilar metals.

but i do trust ngk & others that come with a coating on the treads for initial install, they arent just making that up. but after a few times of removing the plugs & wearing off the coating, i use a very light coating of A/S on the threads just to be safe... & i reduce the torque a little to compensate. have never had an issue with dry ngks in my alum heads for years & thousands of miles, or friends that have alum heads.

[78w72]

Originally Posted by sdbob

He is afraid of plugs galled in threads of heads. Any ideas I've never worked with aluminum heads. Amazing thing he said engine ran well it was built yrs ago by well known west coast builder,yep you know who.

maybe "B.F." used anti seize on the spark plug threads? after all he is a master pontiac builder...

if they are NGK plugs they should be fine on a new(er) engine/heads after 7 years & being covered. 7 years on a new engine thats been kept dry isnt that big of a deal if the other steps mentioned above are done. new fuel, check oil, bump starter a few times to rotate engine & build oil psi or pull the dist to prime it... then start it up, after a full heat cycle the plugs should come out without any issues. whats the other option, to never remove them? hes got to try & start it somehow weather thats removing the plugs first or after starting it.

best of luck.