[John V.]

Originally Posted by Baron Von Zeppelin

Not to confuse anything -
this is a 66 Trim Tag
But it has 52-1W

Is the "gate" the fisher body jig fixture, or the fisher transport fixture, or a hole in the wall ?

Body fixture. Helped them track downstream tolerance problems with the body back to the jig it was welded up on. 52 is for a Lemans Convertible. Each Body Style had their own series of fixtures, might have been 4 or 5 for the Lemans Convertible, maybe only 1 or 2 for a Bonneville Station Wagon (if there was such a thing). My recollection for '68 was that they had something like 63 in total. I note the extra letter on this '66 Data Plate so maybe Pontiac started adding the letter codes late in '65.

Originally Posted by Baron Von Zeppelin

It does look to be an H after the 2 , on Jolly Green
Think i had a breakdown log of those Fisher Codes - but it must be on the crashed drive. I can't find it and don't have any of those memorized.

Have to rely on you and Seymore for those breakdowns.

Since it was a low option race car from square 1 - maybe that is the code for deleting sealants caulks insulations etc .... justa wild guess.

Went and looked at one of my older 5 Group decode reference lists, it claims 2H is for Heater Delete.

I don't think I've ever seen that coded on any Pontiac before, so pretty cool.

[John V.]

Originally Posted by Option 382

Here is a thread with a BAL cowl tag and later in the thread is THE questionable BAL cowl tag. Notice on the bottom of the BAL cowl tag in the 1st pic, there is a number 4. I have in my files 9 1965 BAL cowl tags including one early 66, they all have a number of some sort in that corner where the questionable one does not. All of the 65s BAL tags I have do not list accessories including the 1st picture in this other thread which has a later date stamp. Also notice no letter B for the interior. PON & KAN might have used the 5N code and the B interior code but in my opinion BAL did not use these. The 223 code makes you even more confused. Just too many things against this cowl tag.

http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...imore+cowl+tag

I'd forgotten all about that old thread, looks like I considered it a fake back then and for more reasons than just the fact that the Accessory Codes were coded when they should not have been. I'll stand by what I posted back in 2008 about it.

pontiacmonstr, this should serve as a good example of the difficulty of recreating an accurate repro Data Plate if you don't do a LOT of homework.

[Keith Seymore]

Originally Posted by John V.

Went and looked at one of my older 5 Group decode reference lists, it claims 2H is for Heater Delete.

I don't think I've ever seen that coded on any Pontiac before, so pretty cool.

Agree. We'll have to add that one to our notes.

Originally Posted by Baron Von Zeppelin

It does look to be an H after the 2 , on Jolly Green
Think i had a breakdown log of those Fisher Codes - but it must be on the crashed drive. I can't find it and don't have any of those memorized.

Have to rely on you and Seymore for those breakdowns.

Since it was a low option race car from square 1 - maybe that is the code for deleting sealants caulks insulations etc .... justa wild guess.

I'm not sure insulation/dum dum delete was coded on the cowl tag (although it seems like it should be).

I know Tenney's '64 is an insulation delete so I'll check the tag the next time I see it (I don't believe I have any photos on hand).

K

[John V.]

One possible explanation for having a 5 Group code for the Heater Delete and NOT coding the Insulation Delete, the Heater Delete was a Regular Order option for '64 & '65.

Sales code 584 both years.

Insulation delete was ordered as a Special Order item, it had to be requested by written instruction and then approved. There was no Sales Code for it.

I suspect that Memo 198 was the PMD Sales Dept. approval specifically to address the Insulation delete for the Wangers GTO. Memos were issued for all such Special Order items, including my favorite, the '64 GTO built with the standard Tempest hood.

Very likely, no 5 Group codes were generated for Special Order items.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Originally Posted by Option 382

I have in my files 9 1965 BAL cowl tags ]

The body sequence does seem way out on the 05C car, along with other things you guys pointed out. Is there any chance that any of your other specimens are 05B, 05C or 05D Hardtops ? Just to eliminate all possibilities.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Originally Posted by Jeff Hamlin

Rick Holliday and I do recall him stating his '65 was ordered Radio, Heater, & undercoat/soundener Delete.
It was also painted a dark Chevrolet Green .

Trim Tag does show Special Order color code.
Do you know what year chevy color ?
I really like that car and have the Die-Cast Replica of it.

Originally Posted by John V.

Went and looked at one of my older 5 Group decode reference lists, it claims 2H is for Heater Delete.

That was neat factoid.
Figured it must have had something involved with race build heritage.
Will have to check the die-cast replica and see if they nailed that delete.
Its a very high effort detail replica build on the car.

[Option 382]

Originally Posted by Baron Von Zeppelin

The body sequence does seem way out on the 05C car, along with other things you guys pointed out. Is there any chance that any of your other specimens are 05B, 05C or 05D Hardtops ? Just to eliminate all possibilities.

I do not.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

I (thought i knew) the lower right corner number on these was supposed to be the body jig.
But didn't know what the gate term was all about.
Didn't want folks , or myself , to start thinking that was the gate where it entered or left a certain building. lol

This is from my 65

07A - Pontiac Plant (7/14/5 BHC / invoiced)
Black - Black Bucket interior
WS - 4spd WideRatio - 3.90
No pwr steer, no pwr brakes
Redlines , dog dishes
AM P-button
Dual speed wipers
Splitters
Back-up lamps
Tach & Gauges
Wood wheel
Softray - All
Console
Deluxe front belts
HD Fan
Metallic shoes

[Option 382]

I bet you changed that cowl tag to have the famous AA paint code. Just kidding

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

hahaha
we didn't have those alternatives back in 90 or 91 .. i don't think we did anyway.
Got lucky as heck when found this one.

http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...1&d=1400210973

[Jeff Hamlin]

Originally Posted by Baron Von Zeppelin

Trim Tag does show Special Order color code.
Do you know what year chevy color ?
I really like that car and have the Die-Cast Replica of it.

That was neat factoid.
Figured it must have had something involved with race build heritage.
Will have to check the die-cast replica and see if they nailed that delete.
Its a very high effort detail replica build on the car.

IIRC; It was CYPRESS GREEN from '65
Next time I run into Rick I'll see if he still remembers.

The 1st issue/release from SUNSTAR was the closest, detail is so-so.
You know I too don't recall if it had the dash detail.
The 2nd 1/18th and other scales that followed are not as good,
the last few releases even Dropped Ricks name

SORRY BACK TO TOPIC...

[pontiacmonstr]

Ibm card

[pontiacmonstr]

Card

[pontiacmonstr]

Ibm

[pontiacmonstr]

Ibmcard

[Keith Seymore]

Originally Posted by Baron Von Zeppelin

I (thought i knew) the lower right corner number on these was supposed to be the body jig.
But didn't know what the gate term was all about.
Didn't want folks , or myself , to start thinking that was the gate where it entered or left a certain building. lol

Good point. I hadn't thought of that but it would be an important distinction.

We do sometimes track vehicles as they pass certain "pay points", especially now that the builds are broadcast on electronic billboards throughout out the plant.

K

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Pontiacmonstr , here is the basic stuff



65 GTO Hardtop
Dk Blue E-E / Black Bucket Interior 213-B
VIN 237375P149084
12-11-64 Invoice Date

08-283 - Paradise Pontiac - 8004 Lorain Ave - Cleveland OH 44102


382 - GTO
392 - AM Pushbutton Radio with Manual Fender Antenna
421 - Washer & 2spd Wipers
534 - HD Engine Fan with Clutch (20 inch with notched blades) {required w/ 3.90}
601 - Console
692 - Metallic Brakes
703 =
701 - Safe-T-Track (posi)
702 - Special Order Perf Axle Ratio
71P - 3.90 Axle Ratio
72C / 73C - Redline Tires (standard)
744 - V8 Synchromesh 4spd
75W / 76S - WS TriPower Manual Engine
779 - 4spd Wide Ratio Trans (M20)

(Dog Dish hubcaps)
(Single Pinstripe - probably White)
(Black plastic covered seatbelt buckles - front only - non retractable - bolted to floor)
(NO driver side rear view mirror)
(Standard interior rear view mirror - non flip)
(NO back-up lights in rear bumper)
(Steel tailpipes - likely turned down under rear bumper ?)
(4 core radiator with finger guard) {standard w/ 3x2}

2LG
5N

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Originally Posted by Jeff Hamlin

The 1st issue/release from SUNSTAR was the closest, detail is so-so.
You know I too don't recall if it had the dash detail.

Thats the one i have.
Thought it was great quality and detail for a die cast of the price. (about $20)

Moved in 2009 and all that type stuff is still packed and stacked in boxes.
If you can get to yours - check the dash for block offs - and underhood (no heater box).
Will be cool if they got that right !

[pontiacmonstr]

Wow! Pretty good options to go fast (racing)!

QUOTE=Baron Von Zeppelin;5197762]Pontiacmonstr , here is the basic stuff



65 GTO Hardtop
Dk Blue E-E / Black Bucket Interior 213-B
VIN 237375P149084
12-11-64 Invoice Date

08-283 - Paradise Pontiac - 8004 Lorain Ave - Cleveland OH 44102


382 - GTO
392 - AM Pushbutton Radio with Manual Fender Antenna
421 - Washer & 2spd Wipers
534 - HD Engine Fan with Clutch (20 inch with notched blades) {required w/ 3.90}
601 - Console
692 - Metallic Brakes
703 =
701 - Safe-T-Track (posi)
702 - Special Order Perf Axle Ratio
71P - 3.90 Axle Ratio
72C / 73C - Redline Tires (standard)
744 - V8 Synchromesh 4spd
75W / 76S - WS TriPower Manual Engine
779 - 4spd Wide Ratio Trans (M20)

(Dog Dish hubcaps)
(Single Pinstripe - probably White)
(Black plastic covered seatbelt buckles - front only - non retractable - bolted to floor)
(NO driver side rear view mirror)
(Standard interior rear view mirror - non flip)
(NO back-up lights in rear bumper)
(Steel tailpipes - likely turned down under rear bumper ?)
(4 core radiator with finger guard) {standard w/ 3x2}

2LG
5N[/QUOTE]

[pontiacmonstr]

Do you guys think this car was a special order or run of the mill car back in the muscle car days?