#181  
Old 07-07-2020, 05:30 PM
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Nah, I always just remember some advice given to me by a very wise and accomplished man around here. It was to never take advice from a guy who keeps blowing his $h!^ up. I believe it was you, and you were not the guy who gave me the advice.
You find out what went wrong with the nitrous system when the rod went through your block?

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Old 07-07-2020, 05:37 PM
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To this day I dont think there is a pontiac head that has made more HP per CI N/A than the Warp 6 ,if so would like to see the number and backed up at the strip when and where.Tom
Pickets right ? Smaller engine wasn't it.
Even if you go to KREs website and look up their engines they do not even offer a NA Warp engine. Their "race High Port engines make 1250 HP but have sheet metal, 2 x 4s and a spray kit.
Their heads up High Port engines, NA have the sheet metal 2x4s and make 1075 HP.
It looks like they are pushing the Warp head for boost.

  #183  
Old 07-07-2020, 05:39 PM
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You find out what went wrong with the nitrous system when the rod went through your block?
Ha, Ha, have any picks of those Scat rods you tried to make big power with ? Still in one piece ?

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Old 07-07-2020, 05:41 PM
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Dragncar races on a beach and has never raced other places, he doesn't understand DA.
You need to live stream your dyno session with your new engine. You know, to prove it can make it off the dyno.

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Old 07-07-2020, 06:08 PM
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So all pissing matches between you and slowbird aside, just because you were buying a set of bad ass e-heads for 3800 doesnt mean anyone can. Or that it is repeatable for 3800. I'm not going to ask how much mike had in them because any response couldnt be verified but I would bet it was way more than 3800. I'm sure the cost was up there comparatively to others making that much power. I bought my heads, intake, 2 sets of piston, cam, lifters, shaft rockers and other misc items for 4,000. But that doesnt mean thats all it cost to buy again. I would assume everything i got would be well over 10,000 to duplicate.

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Old 07-07-2020, 06:14 PM
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Rick Johnson is building a Warp 6 N/A engine right now.There are other ones out there.Fact is it made I think like 2.6 HP per CI YEARS ago and backed it up at the strip.I think Stan has it listed on his top quickest pontiacs.Tom

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Old 07-07-2020, 06:44 PM
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Rick Johnson is building a Warp 6 N/A engine right now.There are other ones out there.Fact is it made I think like 2.6 HP per CI YEARS ago and backed it up at the strip.I think Stan has it listed on his top quickest pontiacs.Tom
Tom,
I am not sure now who gave me those numbers. I did see the car in 2013 run some very low 8.0x's @ ATCO.

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  #188  
Old 07-07-2020, 07:10 PM
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Ha, Ha, have any picks of those Scat rods you tried to make big power with ? Still in one piece ?
Never owned Scat rods, more fake news from you.

  #189  
Old 07-07-2020, 09:33 PM
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So all pissing matches between you and slowbird aside, just because you were buying a set of bad ass e-heads for 3800 doesnt mean anyone can. Or that it is repeatable for 3800. I'm not going to ask how much mike had in them because any response couldnt be verified but I would bet it was way more than 3800. I'm sure the cost was up there comparatively to others making that much power. I bought my heads, intake, 2 sets of piston, cam, lifters, shaft rockers and other misc items for 4,000. But that doesnt mean thats all it cost to buy again. I would assume everything i got would be well over 10,000 to duplicate.
Scott, that guys starts cr@p for no other reason than he wants to. Guy goes personal. He gets what he gets. Done with him on this thread, its Johns thread and I don't want it closed so he can yap all he wants here.
I bought another set of high end Gabby E heads with fresh springs Ti valves(both) guides and valve job for the same price. Probably better for me since Mikes heads were about 55ccs. Heads I bought are 63ccs and I have to run a 32cc dish.
There is another set of 400cfm E heads with Ti valves that were for sale for the same price. (GTO KID?) So they are out there.
And it did not have anything to do with my E heads. He made less with better heads and he does not like it. What I said is true about all those guys not beating Mikes number with "better" stuff.

  #190  
Old 07-07-2020, 10:48 PM
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Scott, that guys starts cr@p for no other reason than he wants to. Guy goes personal. He gets what he gets. Done with him on this thread, its Johns thread and I don't want it closed so he can yap all he wants here.
I bought another set of high end Gabby E heads with fresh springs Ti valves(both) guides and valve job for the same price. Probably better for me since Mikes heads were about 55ccs. Heads I bought are 63ccs and I have to run a 32cc dish.
There is another set of 400cfm E heads with Ti valves that were for sale for the same price. (GTO KID?) So they are out there.
And it did not have anything to do with my E heads. He made less with better heads and he does not like it. What I said is true about all those guys not beating Mikes number with "better" stuff.
Mike had a hell of an engine and put TONS of effort and money into it. Since you like to compare everyone to him. Please name another person that has built a 560+ ci engine like his and put that kind of effort into it. Everyone that i can think of has made more and gone faster. But you don't like to compare apples to apples.

  #191  
Old 07-07-2020, 11:47 PM
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Mike had a hell of an engine and put TONS of effort and money into it. Since you like to compare everyone to him. Please name another person that has built a 560+ ci engine like his and put that kind of effort into it. Everyone that i can think of has made more and gone faster. But you don't like to compare apples to apples.
OK, lets be civil here. In all likelihood no one will ever beat Mikes numbers with E heads. Simply because they will use a more race oriented head.
Its the fact that no High Port engine had beat his number, nor RAV head that is the impressive part.
Its a freaking aluminum RAIV head. The New LS chambered E head is better but doubt anyone will try what he did.
Its not apples to apples if you are comparing his E head engine to anything other than a E head engine. And his was the best, no one else was even close.
Thats the point.

  #192  
Old 07-08-2020, 12:09 AM
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OK, lets be civil here. In all likelihood no one will ever beat Mikes numbers with E heads. Simply because they will use a more race oriented head.
Its the fact that no High Port engine had beat his number, nor RAV head that is the impressive part.
Its a freaking aluminum RAIV head. The New LS chambered E head is better but doubt anyone will try what he did.
Its not apples to apples if you are comparing his E head engine to anything other than a E head engine. And his was the best, no one else was even close.
Thats the point.
You are correct no other person will beat Mike because no one will try. As for the HP and the ra5 head not beating him, it's also because no one has tried. Mike broke a lot of stuff getting to where he did, few people will go through that headache and amount of money just to say they did it. Easier and more reliable ways of doing it.
It's like my dad saying he has the fastest tri-power might be true but doesnt really amount to much when no one else has put effort into beating him.

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  #193  
Old 07-08-2020, 12:09 AM
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No lets be realistic. Why with better heads available that will make more HP than "E" heads (sorry Paul) would anyone choice to use "E" heads for this type of build?

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  #194  
Old 07-08-2020, 02:13 AM
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You are correct no other person will beat Mike because no one will try. As for the HP and the ra5 head not beating him, it's also because no one has tried. Mike broke a lot of stuff getting to where he did, few people will go through that headache and amount of money just to say they did it. Easier and more reliable ways of doing it.
It's like my dad saying he has the fastest tri-power might be true but doesnt really amount to much when no one else has put effort into beating him.
Mikes engine was better than the sum of its parts. He crossed the line at 8800- 9200. Crazy making power out of that puny head with such a long stroke spinning that high.
I was really hoping to see what could be done with 480cfm High Ports and a sheet metal with 2 x 4s on top. Sad deal, hope his boys are doing well.

  #195  
Old 07-08-2020, 10:18 AM
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YAWN........

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  #196  
Old 07-09-2020, 08:53 AM
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The most power that will ever be made NA with the Pontiac platform can be summed-up pretty easily, in no particular order.
1. Size of budget
2. Determination
3. Desire to be the best
4. Best technology and research available
5. Industry connections
6. Buy-in by a proven winner in race engine development/builder
7. Engine owner's personal skill set
I can't disagree that Mike's accomplishments may not be surpassed by someone using old design E-heads. That would violate my #4 item. I don't think there is any argument that E-heads are the "best available" period. They may be the "best available at a given price point", that could be argued, I guess. From a pure design standpoint, I don't know if the original E-heads were ever the "best available", because the Larry Wenzler heads were damn good performers. But they had their own set of issues mostly due to the difficulties of one at a time production. It's reasonable to assume someday, every record will fall.

  #197  
Old 07-09-2020, 10:02 AM
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I agree.

If one just 'copies' what others did, no advancements will happen.
People like Scott Rex, John Langer, Jack Gaydosh, and many others don't rely on what other people say. They try other things, experiment, test, etc to get where they are.

Just my 2 cents.


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  #198  
Old 07-09-2020, 10:06 AM
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I should add that would be for ones who want the best.
Myself and the majority of others ( I imagine) just want a great engine that will last and be reliable.

I do try and make it run at the best for what it has in it, though.
There are many things that should be done that can wring out more power.
(or think of it as many things that can LOSE HP if not done correctly)



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  #199  
Old 07-09-2020, 04:25 PM
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I agree.

If one just 'copies' what others did, no advancements will happen.
People like Scott Rex, John Langer, Jack Gaydosh, and many others don't rely on what other people say. They try other things, experiment, test, etc to get where they are.

Just my 2 cents.

Those guys pretty much did the R&D on the Tiger. You think if they did not spend all that time and money we would have the Tiger 2 ? I don't.

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Old 07-09-2020, 05:12 PM
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Those guys pretty much did the R&D on the Tiger. You think if they did not spend all that time and money we would have the Tiger 2 ? I don't.
What's the difference between the Tiger and the Tiger2? Which one of those guys runs Tiger2?

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