[OVERULD]

Wow!!! Check this one out.

http://www.americanstreetmachines.co...A110571126.jpg

BJ

[threefidee]

Mark should be a happy camper, especially if this guy gets 300g's

JHody

[Judge273]

"Engine block codes shown in the Pontiac Shop Manual for the 1970 Firebird Trans Am 370 hp Super Duty (LS1) engine are WH (manual), and XN (automatic).
88 cars were built and 23 are known to exist. Of these 23, 6 manual-trans cars possess original blocks with WW codes. This is 1 of those 6 cars. It is also 1 of 18 4-speed cars built at the Van Nuys CA factory."

Rare car indeed to have matching block, and other factors. But, will anyone pay it?

[TA455HO]

I'm not as up on '70, but shouldn't this car have rear seat ashtrays? And the panel back there on both sides that the ashtray sits in, shouldn't those panels have the "embroidered" square in them. I thought both 70 and 71 had that.

[2manyT/A'S]

NO rear ashtray in 1970 birds regardless of trim level.

The "embroidered square" was a 1971 ONLY deal.

[TA455HO]

I think you ought to buy it to add to your collection.

[weranc55]

Thats a lot of money for the car and I doubt he will get it. He paid quite a bit for it for what I heard. There are more than 23 cars out there. Nice resto but a Van Nuys car does not get the red primer underneath.

[Larry Navarro]

Looks like a Mickey Hale restoration.

[Norwood]

Nice car for sure, I would love to own that one...

I don't mean to offend but.....Stated in auction....

"This Bird is completely rust-free with all-original sheet metal, floors and trunk!"

I don't think this statement is quite true. My observation's tell me that the hood is not original 1970 sheet metal. When you find obvious things that are misstated you have to wonder about other statements. $300,000.00 is a lot of coin.....

[Tellyshavilli]

This is the only RA IV 70 ta that was dealered in Az . The car was at MH restoration and is a very original car . The hood is a later one and the bottom of car should be black . 24 of the 88 RAIV cars came out of Van Nuys .


This quote was made around 1988 just before McCarthys book came out . There are about twice as many cars found now . Thats just what I know about .


"88 cars were built and 23 are known to exist. Of these 23, 6 manual-trans cars possess original blocks with WW codes."

[70RAlll]

At least the hood scoop doesn't say "455 HO"... there is one poster here who will know what I am talking about and get the laugh !!!
300 is a bunch... you have to be careful with these cars, engines are easiley restamped these days.I was told at a GM clearance auction,or something like that, an original grinding machine was bought by a guy who will restamp engines and the surface will have the correct "swirl" grind markings.you will never know the difference.
Tell... knows ,as i do, of a low milage original survivor,sort of rough underside and engine compartment, but still completely original <20k milage RA IV that brought high 200's. I know of a Van Nuys 4 speed that is being put back togather with all original correct parts that the guy will have over 200k all in. It will be at the TA nationals this year. My guess is it will score as high as any RA has ever scored.It is absolutely perfect down to every single correct original bolt,not a single repo used..I honestly think this car will break records and quite possibly get a perfect score. then again, knowing judges, most don't know how these cars were really supposed to be themselves..so wew ill see when it gets scored..
So 300 for a car mis painted on the underside, no not for me. then again, any of these cars in this price range is stupid to me.. I can take a RA lll , stroke it and blow the dooors off of a RA IV,plus my 71 HO in stock form will beat the 70RAIV,truth be told...yes, 300k for a car,,, must have a big ego and more money than sense if you ask me... my 300 would ratehr buy land....or 5-6 71 HO's better yet !!!

[eaglesan13]

I know that fewer cars came out of Van Nuys, but does that make it any more valuable? It wouldn't to me.

And, could you get an M20 with a 3.73 rear gear? I thought the 3.73 required a close ratio (M21).

[keith k]

Originally Posted by eaglesan13

I know that fewer cars came out of Van Nuys, but does that make it any more valuable? It wouldn't to me.

And, could you get an M20 with a 3.73 rear gear? I thought the 3.73 required a close ratio (M21).

Chris, other way around....

M21 required a 3.73, but 3.73 didn't require M21.

You could order the 3.73 on M20 cars, too. Every now and then I see one...

I think that all of the RAIV 4-speed cars were mandatory M20/3.73. The engine's lack of torque down low necessitated the better off the line gearing that combo gives (at least that would be my guess for why they did this).

[eaglesan13]

Thanks, I didn't know that.

Originally Posted by keith k

Chris, other way around....

M21 required a 3.73, but 3.73 didn't require M21.

You could order the 3.73 on M20 cars, too. Every now and then I see one...

I think that all of the RAIV 4-speed cars were mandatory M20/3.73. The engine's lack of torque down low necessitated the better off the line gearing that combo gives (at least that would be my guess for why they did this).

[Tellyshavilli]

Originally Posted by eaglesan13

I know that fewer cars came out of Van Nuys, but does that make it any more valuable? It wouldn't to me.

And, could you get an M20 with a 3.73 rear gear? I thought the 3.73 required a close ratio (M21).

Not really more valuable just because it came from Van Nuys but more that it was probably a western car and not subjected to road salt . If thats the case then it may sustantially affect the value. These 1970 RA IV ta 's are showing a real good survival rate . Definately over 50 % .

[Father&Son73T/A]

Would this be the first second gen to pull this kinda money?
Does anyone know if one has even come close?

[keith k]

Originally Posted by Tellyshavilli

Not really more valuable just because it came from Van Nuys but more that it was probably a western car and not subjected to road salt . If thats the case then it may sustantially affect the value. These 1970 RA IV ta 's are showing a real good survival rate . Definately over 50 % .

I think ALL of the '70 - '72 T/As had a remarkably high survival rate. People just seemed to know or feel, even back in the '70s, that these cars were special. RAIV even more so, for sure.

I do find the values/prices of the RAIV's surprising. Definitely rare, and probably THE top dog of Pontiac's lineup in '70, but 4 times the value of an RAIII T/A? Does a '70 RAIV Judge bring 4 times the money of a '70 RAIII Judge? (I don't know... don't follow them that closely).

Seems like a lot considering there was relatively little to differentiate a IV from a III. But I guess the value is whatever someone's willing to pay. I'm not in the game

[weranc55]

I highly doubt that he will get anywhere near 300 for the car. Might be worth 200. The car did come out nice but are a few things that are not correct on it for that kind of money. I heard of two ra4 cars that sold in the last six months and they brought nowhere near that money. Both where four speed cars.

[giles]

Originally Posted by 70RAlll

It will be at the TA nationals this year... then again, knowing judges, most don't know how these cars were really supposed to be themselves..so we will see when it gets scored..

The judging at the TA Nationals is, well, I'll be kind and say "lacking" when it comes to '70-'72 cars.
They have demonstrated in the past that they don't know a correct car from one that is not-so-correct. I would not use a TA Nats score as any kind of yardstick!

[70RAlll]

Originally Posted by giles

The judging at the TA Nationals is, well, I'll be kind and say "lacking".
They have demonstrated in the past that they don't know a correct car from one that is not-so correct. I would not use at TA Nats score as any kind of yardstick!

Giles, I completely agree. I hope that some of the judging erors aren't of malicious intent,but I wonder sometimes. Seems certian restorers are "wired in" and always end up in the magazines,getting great scores for cars that are nice, but not perfect etc... then again, I am drifting away from this threads subject.. so that is enough...