[mikediaz]

hey its the carb king himself. Hey there jon!
Thanks for the tip.

follow up questions:
0-
To get the actuator piston to move again I assume it needs some penetrating lube and some tender loving care. (some moderate force in and out till it breaks loose of its age). This sound right?

1-
Is a new spring included for the actuator included in the kit? If not any idea where I could get one?

2-
I hate these threadlocker color rating systems. They sell all sorts of different 'color' ratings in different colored containers. Example - I have what is labeled as "THREADLOCKER RED" but it is in a blue squeeze tube. I assume this is still red and I should go get the blue? What's the diff between red and blue in this specific application that the red is NOT right?


3-Anyone who has painted any parts of their carbs before - what do you recommend. Earlier in this thread someone said they painted their airhorns gray and their bases (throttle bodies) as cast iron, leaving the bowls 'as cleaned'. What other recommendations do you all have and what specific paint types should I look for? I'm thinking an engine enamel should be used?

[carbking]

Originally Posted by mikediaz

hey its the carb king himself. Hey there jon!
Thanks for the tip.

follow up questions:
0-
To get the actuator piston to move again I assume it needs some penetrating lube and some tender loving care. (some moderate force in and out till it breaks loose of its age). This sound right?

1-
Is a new spring included for the actuator included in the kit? If not any idea where I could get one?

2-
I hate these threadlocker color rating systems. They sell all sorts of different 'color' ratings in different colored containers. Example - I have what is labeled as "THREADLOCKER RED" but it is in a blue squeeze tube. I assume this is still red and I should go get the blue? What's the diff between red and blue in this specific application that the red is NOT right?


3-Anyone who has painted any parts of their carbs before - what do you recommend. Earlier in this thread someone said they painted their airhorns gray and their bases (throttle bodies) as cast iron, leaving the bowls 'as cleaned'. What other recommendations do you all have and what specific paint types should I look for? I'm thinking an engine enamel should be used?

0 - Try boiling the top in water. Let it cool normally and see if the plunger (the long item which the spring wraps) will move back and forth. It must move freely for the carb to function.

1 - The actuator spring is not in the kits. Pretty much same spring used on all 2 barrel Rochesters. Find a junk carb and remove the spring. You can carefully wind it off the shaft.

2 - Red loctite (red in color in a blue bottle) REQUIRES HEAT (600 degrees F.) TO DISASSEMBLE. In a nutshell, once it dries, it is there permanently (forever). Blue loctite will hold the screw, but can be disassembled if required using a screwdriver.

3 - We reccommend using ONLY epoxy-based paints for carburetors, and only AFTER the castings have had the correct original finishes applied (some will paint the carbs to match the engine color, or body color, or ???, but this should be done over the protective chromate finish). When painting epoxy-based paints, WEAR A MASK! Maybe a painter will jump in on this question.

Jon.

[mikediaz]

0 - Will boil it tomorrow and see how it turns out. Thanks a bunch for that tip!

1- ANYONE GOT AN EXTRA Actuator Spring I COULD BUM OFF YA? We can talk price if thats what it takes for someone to send me theirs...

2- Good point on the blue vs red. Thanks again.

3- I wasn't planning on getting them refinished... I think I'd rather leave it 'as cleaned' than go through the trouble of refinishing. Good tip nonetheless. Anyone else have any comments on painting these parts?



Throttle blade update:
Also as Jon told me the other day - there will just about always be a halo around the throttle blades and that it's ok. I did use an emory cloth to lightly deburr the minor irks on the throttle blades as well as the minor minor rust scaling left on the throttle bores even after I had soaked the whole throttle body in the Berryman dip for over 24hrs. Here's a pic of the final shut valve. It is now muuuch tighter shutting but still small halo coming through on two quarters of the blade. I think it's good enough but we shall see.

[mikediaz]

Yet more updates:

Took appart the choke system. (or started to).

Right under the choke cover (the black plastic piece to adjust the choke coil) there is the "choke baffle" (see pic 1) Mine was pretty destroyed... anyone think it's too bad to go back in? Service manual shows no pics of it so I don't know how far off mine is.

Also - I can't get my choke piston lever off of the choke shaft... I think it's just some oxidation bonding shaft to piston link but I'll try some lubricant tomorrow. I can't believe I left the PB blaster back at school! I just wanted to check- This little linke (picture 2) is supposed to pop off the choke shaft (once its screw is removed) right??

Any tips in cleaning the choke mechanism besides 'don't dip the plastic adjusting plate in solvent' (read that one already )

Thanks a lot everyone i really appreciate the help. This work is gonna end up being half mine (the manual labor) and half everyon on this forum's (mental labor)! Plenty of questions throughout these last 3 posts. Thanks!
mike

[carbking]

Mike - you probably have other problems. A choke housing this bad is indicative of exhaust leaking into the hot air tube.

Be glad to explain if you call, but don't really wish to type a "book" here.

Jon.

[mikediaz]

Called Jon today. No show-stopping serrious problems - he said it was probably a bad choke heat tube in the manifold and to make sure I get those replaced.

rebuild kits scheduled to be delivered today, looking fwd to them coming in but still have lots of cleaning to do. I will probably get the rear carb reassembled today but we'll see! Updates to come.

thanks all mike!

[mikediaz]

I found a carb on ebay for sale (rochester 2bbl)
here's a link
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...3ARTQ%3AUS%3A1

The seller sent me a pic of the power actuator spring, I wanted to run it by you guys since it seems like a little bigger spring than what I saw on mine. It's probably just the angle. I think i'll go ahead and get it as it should make a good spare parts carb.
It look ok to anyone else?

[mikediaz]

sorry 4 lack of updates my free internet has all but disappeared.
GOOD NEWS: I have completed the rear carb!

Here are a few shots of it. Berryman stuff is unbelievable if you soak it for a little bit and (most importantly) scrub it as soon as you pull it out of the solution using the solution itself. Further proving this point are my cleaned up choke piston and my power actuator piston. I'll post those pics later. First - let the mini celebration for the first completed carb begin (and subsequently end as I must finish up the center and then start the front carb!)

Mike

[mikediaz]

notes / questions on the 'completed' carb:
Yes I used paint on the throttle body... hope it doesn't do tooo much damage in any way. No I used no paint anywhere else. Just elbow grease.

Should I keep that brass shield on the center screw of the venturi cluster - and if so, it came with 2 fabric gaskets (one between screw head and shield, another between shield and cluster). This sound right? I left it that way , the pieces seemed in good shape.

and finally - the throttle blades close on their own all the time unless they are opened to absolutely WOT. At which point they sorta hesitate before snapping shut. I believe this should go away with the advent of the rest of the system hooked up to it, in particular the yellow throttle return spring , as it takes very little force to make it snap back immediately instead of the minor hesitation when left on its own. This sound ok?? I pray for no vacuum leaks at the blades

[Norwegian Bonneville65]

Looking Good,Mike !
Keep it coming !

(I will save this thread for later use .....)

Stig

[mikediaz]

Thanks for the encouraging words stig. I need them almost as much as i need all the advice I've received (and no doubt will receive) on this forum.

I'm considering putting in a little gas / stabil mix in the pump hole and hit the lever a few times to make sure gas is travelling well through they system. Does this sound like a good idea? Should I wait till its closer to the time I'm going to actually use it from fear that the gas could get old and gum in there in the few months it will take before I put this setup on and run it?

Any other opinions/ questions /answers to questions? Thanks all!

I hope to contine cleaning the center carb tomorrow but since I don't have the new power valve actuator spring yet (will be at least a few days till I get that) I won't be able to finish it within the next few days.
I hate to leave this thread dormant for so long but I'll probably have to wait till I get those parts till I can continue. AH well.. I wlil return, please post all comments / concerns/ questions.

To Stig(?) and any others who hope to use this thread for future carb resto.'s feel free to forever e-mail / PM me with any questions and i'd be glad to share any knowledge and any of what will end up being a huge library of pics (100+ at least by the time i'm done).

[krautwolf]

I 've go to admire you, Mike. I'm not sure I'd have the patience to undertake such a project. It would be so easy to just slap on any of a number of off-the-shelf fuel intake systems. That's what makes the mechanical part of restoration so cool. There's no substitute for having made work again a nearly 40 year old, intricate, high performance system.

[mikediaz]

thanks krautwolf! Well, I'm a 'moderate' in the originality vs. new stuff game but I do admit that I lean towards originalit. I just go with whatever feels good and I have wanted tri-power since as long as I've wanted a 65 Bonneville. I've also wanted a 421 for about as long but that's a future thread perhaps

Thanks.

[mikediaz]

Center carb work continues..

mini testament to berryman dip see a few posts back for the choke housing and for what this previously stuck power piston used to look.
Note:i haven't ever used Gunk or other brand dips so I can't say berryman is better, can just say it works.
Again the trick is to soak for a while (an hour at least, most stuff i just let soak for 6hrs to a day).

[Jack Gifford]

Nice looking work! That photo of the carb you're buying- looks like every power valve spring that I've seen. Did the original fillister-head screws clean up that nicely or did you replace them? I gave up on locating a source of black-oxide fillister head screws to use in my carbs. My original screws weren't very black anymore, and spoiled the looks of the carbs. I wound up doing my "shade tree black oxide" job on my old ones- getting the heads dull red with a torch and quenching in oil. Also had to do the same with lock washers. They look okay, but I have no idea about the durability of this home-brew finish.
Not everybody exhibits such patience with carb work; so possibly you'd be interested in the external-adjustment modification I made to my power valve. It will eliminate having to remove the carb top to change the power valve spring. It gives me a range from 5 to 13 in.Hg. for the power valve to open. I cut a hex on the screw head so I don't even need to remove the air cleaner to adjust it. All pieces are stainless steel or anodized aluminum, to hold up to the gasoline environment.

[krautwolf]

You can get black or grey oxide kits from the gunsmith supply world. All you need is distilled water and a stainless steel pot to cook up a very nice finish on the kitchen stove or outdoor propane burner.
http://www.shootersolutions.com/higdenchargr.html

[mikediaz]

As far as my fillister head screws, those are new ones! I paid the extra cash to get the new screws with the rebuild kit form the carburetor shop.

Interesting kit you made there for the spring adjustments. I'm too stock to look into it at this point. But it does look like a really nice simple and as-of-yet unseen approach to solving the problem. Most people buy different springs which are available but maybe you could make a kit out of that and sell it as a product!! could make some real nice $$$? I've seen reproduction air horns for sale so you could sell it with those , or do them on those and then sell them already done so people could just drop them on.



As for the tripower carb project - it has reached a standstill for a few days. I didn't win that ebay auction for the above-shown picture (darnit! I didn't keep an eye on it!)

Plus I'm going to buy a new float for the center carb so I'll order that and have to wait on it.. plus I'm back in scool now ($#@T F#@$@ $#$#*) SO that will hold me back too.. I'll post updates as they come along.
Thanks all
mike

[Jack Gifford]

Thanks for the pointers on black-oxide finishing- I hadn't thought of gunsmithing stuff. I was too cheap to buy kits from the Carb Shop- so I'll see how my home-brew oxidizing works out.
Yeah, I could consider marketing adjustable power valve kits, but I doubt I could realize any profit- I spend way too many hours carving out those little pieces!

[mikediaz]

Ok. I'm going to buy some of the misc. parts that I need to complete the resto of the trip setup.
I know the air cleaners will be needed but I will get that after I finish them up. here's my list so far with a few questions:

1. Fuel lines - no fittings needed, the ones on there now are all good.

2. Blue or yellow throttle return spring (or yellow... its a tossup for me as to color)

3. Throttle cable bracket - this item I've only seen available from www.pontiactripower.com but it's the bracket that bolts on to the corner of the manifold and that the throttle return spring (yellow or blue) attaches to on one end (its other end goes to center carb's throttle). Anyone know anywhere else I can get this from? Mine has an odd one on it (see first post of this whole thread) and I figure I should get the correct one for it. It's about 35.00 bucks for a new one... :-\

4. Slide bar. - this is the one that goes on the driver's side, it's got a slot on it for the center carb's throttle arm to go into. I've only seen it sold as part of a kit that includes some other stuff I don't need. I need it only so am trying to find it by itself.


Excluding #4 (since no one sells it), and adding on a brass float, the total is about 81 bucks. This is from pontiactripower.com - Has anyone ordered from them before?????

The only reason I'm going with them and not Ames is because Ames doesn't sell the throttle cable bracket. That and they sell brass floats whereas I'm not sure what material Ames' are.

[mikediaz]

wups dbl post