[Greg Reid]

Anyone have personal experience with one they highly recommend that won't break the bank for a shade-tree type? I have one but it's crap. Won't zero out any more. I've only used it a couple of times in the last 10 years but I need one now.
Is it even possible to get a 'decent' one for a $100 bill?
Maybe something like this?
https://www.amazon.com/OTC-5609-Cyli...22629493&psc=1

[Speargun]

I have that exact one & it's worked great the few times I've used it.

[rustedgoat]

I'd check to see if any of the auto parts store by you have the "free loaner tools".

[Greg Reid]

That's an idea...but I could use one with all the old junk i've got around here..lol

[Mike Davis]

I have the one you posted, has worked well for a few years.

[694.1]

Order up a new gauge??

[Greg Reid]

Yeah, I could try that and thought about it but I don't really know that the gauge itself is bad or the adjuster or what. I'd really rather replace it. It was an el-cheapo to begin with. Think I paid about $30 for it 15 years or so ago.
Besides, sometimes when I'm trying to troubleshoot something, I hate it when I have to troubleshoot my troubleshooting tools in order to troubleshoot the only thing I'm really trying to troubleshoot.
I just ordered the one I linked to. Thanks for ALL input fellows.

[mgarblik]

The OTC leakage tool you listed in post 1 is a nice tool. We have about 6 of them in use at the college I teach at. So your talking about hundreds of students handling them each year. Also hundreds of uses. They are pretty tough and reliable. Much better than the Milton units they replaced. BTW, do NOT purchase one from Harbor freight. Had a student bring one in and use it on his Toyota 4-cyl. It had the plugs deep in a spark plug tube. (hemi-style head) The latent heat softened the hose some and the hose just spun on the cheap crap crimp and the low grade rubber hose. Could not remove the hose and fitting, no access. Had to remove the cylinder head to get it out. Student learned a good lesson about buying quality tools that day.

[Greg Reid]

Thanks, that makes me feel better about buying it. I can't remember where I got the one I have now. Likely ebay. Doesn't even have a plastic case.

[rohrt]

I got that exact same OTC one as well. Works great for me.

[Greg Reid]

It's on it's way along with a fuel pressure gauge. I have one of those that works fine but only goes to 15psi. That's fine for my old carb'd cars but I'm working on an older fuel injected car and fuel pressure is supposed to be 35psi.

[Schurkey]

Originally Posted by Greg Reid

Anyone have personal experience with one they highly recommend that won't break the bank for a shade-tree type? I have one but it's crap. Won't zero out any more. I've only used it a couple of times in the last 10 years but I need one now.
Is it even possible to get a 'decent' one for a $100 bill?
Maybe something like this?

Good God NO! NOT OTC. OTC is a four-letter word as far as I'm concerned, ever since they offshored practically everything they sell to Asian suppliers, often in Communist China, and began screwing people like me on their warranty claims. Apparently this got bad directly after OTC got bought-out by Bosch.

Maybe you can cancel your order.

There are no legal regulations nor "industry standards" for automotive leakdown testers. Leakdown tester design is totally up to the manufacturer. One leakdown tester doesn't have to be made the same as another--leading to different indicated leakage.

OTOH, the Federal Aviation Administration issued guidelines for leakdown testers used on aircraft. Beyond that, Teledyne has it's own spec for verifying leakdown testers.

I suggest a leakdown tester compatible with FAA regs, and testable with Teledyne-style Master Orifice built-in. You want the variety that has a .040 orifice in the tester (suitable for cylinders under 5" bore.)

https://www.aircraft-tool.com/shop/detail.aspx?id=2EM

Comes with an 18mm cylinder adapter. Tell them you want the 14mm one instead. They swapped it out for me at no increase in price. I bought mine in...2012...maybe.

[Greg Reid]

Thank you, I just may do that one. I like the look of the hardware. Amazon is pretty low hassle if you want to return something.

[4zpeed]

Originally Posted by Greg Reid

Besides, sometimes when I'm trying to troubleshoot something,
I hate it when I have to troubleshoot my troubleshooting tools
in order to troubleshoot the only thing I'm really trying to troubleshoot.

Had my Hank Kimball face after I read that...

.......



Frank

[Greg Reid]

Or this...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=08yePfqQbmU

[Greg Reid]

Read this while trying to understand the 'master orifice' use. Very interesting tech article. Clarified some things for me on how a leakdown tester works.
https://www.kitplanes.com/maintenanc...ssion-testing/
They delivered the OTC one today. Looks much better than my old one and no obvious issues... but I'm leaning towards the other now.

[mgarblik]

The link Schurkey provided was for a VERY nice cylinder leakage tool. The fact that it is certified and can be verified is a nice feature and it is American made. Your first post did state a nice tool for under $100.00. It cost about 30-40% more than that with shipping. The OTC tool is made in CHINA, I verified that. But so is about 30% of the Snap-ON catalog and about 75% of their diagnostic tools. Hard to win these days if you want all American stuff. A cylinder leakage tool is really a comparative tester, looking for differences cylinder to cylinder. The actual % of leakage has little meaning unless all the cylinders are low. No doubt the Aviation rated tool is better and more accurate. You get what you pay for most of the time.

[Greg Reid]

Yes, that is true that it's more than I initially stated and that's why I'm not knocking the OTC and haven't hit the 'return' button yet.. As I stated, it's much better than the one I had and will probably serve my purposes just fine...if it lasts.
What I don't know and perhaps one of you will, what is the significance of the orifice being .040"? I took my old one apart and it's way smaller than .040...probably more like .010".
Just an arbitrary standard in the aircraft industry?

[Schurkey]

Originally Posted by mgarblik

The link Schurkey provided was for a VERY nice cylinder leakage tool. The fact that it is certified and can be verified is a nice feature and it is American made.

I believe that ATS puts them together here in the States.

To tell the whole truth...the one I bought back in 2012 has "Made in Taiwan" gauges.

Originally Posted by mgarblik

A cylinder leakage tool is really a comparative tester, looking for differences cylinder to cylinder. The actual % of leakage has little meaning unless all the cylinders are low. No doubt the Aviation rated tool is better and more accurate.

The beauty of the Master Orifice is that it gives you a repeatable, calibrated "leak" to compare to--it's the upper limit of leakage (lower limit of pressure) that's allowable. Otherwise, you'd need to compare to "known good" engines of the same approximate bore size to get an idea of how "your" leakdown tester reacts to good vs. bad cylinders.

If this were just me--and not Major Aviation Manufacturers--I'd reduce the size of the Master Orifice. I think the orifice produces too much leakage, it sets the leakage limit too high. It's useful as-is, but it would be more useful for automotive/high performance use if the orifice was smaller. I've heard of folks using a Holley main jet as a master orifice, but I don't remember what size they chose. When I'm using my tester, I mentally adjust the maximum leakage/minimum pressure to about 3/4 of what the Master Orifice allows.

Originally Posted by mgarblik

You get what you pay for most of the time.

If you're lucky.

Originally Posted by Greg Reid

What I don't know and perhaps one of you will, what is the significance of the orifice being .040"? I took my old one apart and it's way smaller than .040...probably more like .010".
Just an arbitrary standard in the aircraft industry?

[Note: I'm no longer talking about the "Master Orifice", what follows is about the orifice positioned between the two gauges of the leakdown tester. This is the orifice that ALL leakdown testers have.]
Yes, somewhat arbitrary. In the Aviation world, .040 is used for cylinders having a bore size less than five inches. A cylinder with a larger bore size is tested with a leakdown tester having a .060 orifice. A larger bore is expected to leak more, due to the bigger diameter of the rings, and consequently the larger ring gap.

The size of the orifice makes as much difference in the indicated leakage as the actual leakage of the cylinder. A smaller orifice makes the tester more sensitive (larger pressure drop for a given leakage.) A larger orifice makes the tester less sensitive (smaller pressure drop for a given leakage.) This is the main reason that different leakdown testers can't be directly compared to each other--and why the Master Orifice is so useful. Any leakdown tester plugged into the Master Orifice can be "baselined" for the maximum allowable leakage.

[Greg Reid]

Thanks for that information. If I hadn't already pulled the trigger on the OTC, I would have spent another $40 bucks or so on the ATS rig without a doubt.
But having the OTC in hand now and seeing nothing glaring about it that gives me the heebeegeebees, I will probably keep it.
By the way, I inquired about the 2EM with the 14mm adapter and they told me that the 2EM-14 is the same unit and comes with both 14 and 18. They are listed for the same price so I'm skeptical..